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11 Oct 2008, 02:56 (Ref:2308822)
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#1 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,549
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Internationals disappoint at Bathurst
Would Team Vodafone think the decision to run Giovannardi & Hynes in the #88 car worthwhile - in the last session they were 4+ seconds off the pace.
Neal & Said in SuperCheap Autos car are little better. Disappointing: race day might bring out the competitive juices .... |
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__________________
more torque than a climate change conference 
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11 Oct 2008, 03:04 (Ref:2308823)
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#2 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,940
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If they are that slow they are less likely to be in packs, so less traffic (except when it goes zooming past them) might make them less susceptible to getting hit. In which case, despite being several laps down, they could still concievably finish top 10... if enough other cars get taken out!
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HSV - Sideways cars from an upside down country.
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11 Oct 2008, 03:08 (Ref:2308826)
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#3 | |
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Racer
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 330
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Happens every year and they (team owners) don't learn. You cant not drive these cars regularly (and race ****y little 2litre ones), come to Bathurst, AND be a Pom and expect to get anywhere! It does put the status of some of those other overseas champinships into perspective. Theyll cruise around until one of them bins it, but at least iot allows the teams concerned to concentrate on their number one car
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11 Oct 2008, 03:18 (Ref:2308829)
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#4 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,549
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spec22, if you are correct, Roland Dane (888) is a dill ... dont subscribe to that.
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__________________
more torque than a climate change conference
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11 Oct 2008, 03:28 (Ref:2308831)
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#5 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 903
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Quote:
"You cant not drive these cars regularly ... come to Bathurst," doesn't matter how good they are - it could be Schumacher and Alonso and they couldn't come out here, drive a Supercar for the first time (or in Said's case a RH drive of any sort) and then try and drive at Bathurst of all places, and be competitive. It certainly doesn't mean they aren't any good. I must admit I don't quite understand why they bother. |
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11 Oct 2008, 04:31 (Ref:2308862)
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#6 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 8,963
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Quote:
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__________________
Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film
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11 Oct 2008, 04:49 (Ref:2308874)
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#7 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 413
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Interestingly, Boris Said finished in the lower half of the field in the Mini race today, in the BMW Uber Star entry.
NATSOFT |
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Bring on the Endurance season, and some big name DNF's... (I'd love to see the V8 Chumpionship decided @ Winton, thus making the El Grande Finale the flop it deserves to be...)
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11 Oct 2008, 05:17 (Ref:2308886)
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#8 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,940
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Quote:
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__________________
HSV - Sideways cars from an upside down country.
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11 Oct 2008, 07:26 (Ref:2308935)
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#9 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,637
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11 Oct 2008, 07:33 (Ref:2308941)
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#10 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,530
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Roland is a pretty smart cookie so he doesn't do it for nothing.
I wonder if it is somethng in the Vodafone sponsorship or T888 deals with their drivers in overseas series. Either way it took Simonsen and Lyons a couple of years to get on top of the cars. Last edited by sizzle; 11 Oct 2008 at 07:35. |
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11 Oct 2008, 08:57 (Ref:2309002)
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#11 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 761
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what would happen if you took a top V8 racer and stuck him in a top class in the USA where Said does ok?
oh... wait a minute.... |
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11 Oct 2008, 09:41 (Ref:2309022)
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#12 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,215
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Ambrose hasn't exactly run at the front, nor Montoya and I could go on. Though I must say that in the days of group A when they were racing cars they were familiar with the Europeans ran at the front. So maybe it is the cars more than the track. I can recall winning a fair bit of money when everyone reckoned Walkinshaw's Jaguars wouldn't last and they ran away with it.
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11 Oct 2008, 11:20 (Ref:2309074)
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#13 | |||
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Racer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 273
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Quote:
For Ambrose its the track, he smashed the NASCAR regulars on every road course but not on an oval. I expected more from Boris Said since he is a road course specialist. I think Ambrose is a better road course driver than Montoya however both Ambrose and Montoya are mile ahead of the NASCAR regulars when it comes to road course. http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=oY3OPwUd6Xs http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=7m-B_n9UonE |
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11 Oct 2008, 11:22 (Ref:2309076)
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#14 | |||
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Racer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 273
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Quote:
Not so good on ovals but would dominate on a road course, especially when its raining (against NASCAR drivers). |
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11 Oct 2008, 11:29 (Ref:2309082)
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#15 | ||
 Race Official1% Club
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 47,331
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Of the two pairings... the least scary looking pair are the SuperCheap duo of Said/Neal... the other imports have brought the #88 car back with less bits stuck together than it left pit lane with on more than one occassion....
I suspect if the #67 pilots truck around all day tomorrow without any mistakes or technical issues, a top 15 is indeed on the cards... its what happened to the Coulthard/Pither car last year, which was also slow (not driver induced entirely..) and they picked up 16th place Sir Speedy Thexalot is said to talk of great pride of the 15th place he achieved in 2003.. |
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__________________
Go woke, Go broke… Here’s hoping a random universe works out in your favour… The meaning of life… ENJOYING THE PASSAGE OF TIME! #CANCERSUCKS
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11 Oct 2008, 12:01 (Ref:2309093)
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#16 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,890
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It doesn't matter who they are or what type of racing they have done, you cant expect a driver to just hop in an unfamiliar car on an unfamiliar track and be on the pace straight away. Especially if they are used to driving left hand drive etc.
There are plenty of examples where Aussie drivers have raced overseas and struggled intitially. I remember Skaife did the World cup race at Monza in a Nissan (a "****y little 2 lite one") and he was off the pace too. Having said that I never understand why teams keep doing it. They know the drivers are going to be off the pace....so why bother doing it? Last edited by touring fan01; 11 Oct 2008 at 12:05. |
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11 Oct 2008, 12:20 (Ref:2309100)
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#17 | ||
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Rookie
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 67
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I dont understand why Team Vodafone had to go with these drivers, i know some of drivers such at Ivan Muller and Allan Simonson have prior racing commitments, but theyre much better than these too...
I was disappointed that Tim Leahey didnt get a drive this year, oh maybe Jonny Reid could be a possibilty... Team Vodafone didnt obviously do their homework.. :P |
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__________________
Jason Bright Stone Brothers Racing 2009 and beyond;)
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11 Oct 2008, 13:12 (Ref:2309119)
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#18 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 522
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International drivers no matter how good they are with no experience at Bathurst will never do well and yet they continue to get drives. Menu is imo one of the greatest touring car drivers of all time yet he was 2secs off the pace when he came to Bathurst.
This place is all about the amount of laps you have done, and you just can't expect these international drivers to perform well. |
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11 Oct 2008, 14:00 (Ref:2309143)
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#19 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,710
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Yvan Muller has raced many other disciplines, and is more a pick-up and go driver. Giovanardi could certainly be considered to be comparible or even better in FWD machinery, but is less adept at RWD cars, only having raced one in 2003 fairly unsuccessfully.
Triple Eight would always be able to find an international connection with their BTCC drivers though. I'd have expected the top DTM or FIA GT drivers would have a better time adapting to the V8 Supercar series, it's a shame drivers like Ekstrom, Scheider, Fassler or Wendlinger don't give it a go. Oh well. |
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11 Oct 2008, 15:28 (Ref:2309165)
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#20 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,269
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While all of this is valid, how do these guys get the "experience" of the mountain if they arent given a chance? Even guys coming from other categories within Australia often take a few years to crack it at the mountain in the Supercars.
It's nice to know that these internationals are considering these cars and track amazing enough to take time off from home and come here... So, what can we do to accomodate them better? More practise time allowed perhaps? Or do we just "ban" them and say that we must try and foster young Aussie talent instead? In my line of work, it is often said "Dont present an issue without a solution (unless it's a safety matter)". So, I've chucked a few in there... what else is there? |
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"Racing.....it's in my blood."
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11 Oct 2008, 16:10 (Ref:2309175)
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#21 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,043
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Quote:
If 888 & Supercheap give these guys another go next year, they'll do a much better job, its all about experience. |
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__________________
"The Great Race" 22 November 1960 - 21 July 1999
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11 Oct 2008, 18:20 (Ref:2309226)
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#22 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Only came to Australia with about 2 hours to get used to the car on Friday afternoon, jumped into a completely unfamiliar XC Falcon hardtop at Bathurst 1977, with no brakes or handling or set-up comparable to the GT-40's and Porsche 917's etc he was used to racing overseas, and proceeded to assist a certain Moffat Ford Dealer Team to wrest the winners trophy and garland in emphatic style. Then again, there's few drivers anywhere anymore with adaptable driving skill even close to the same postcode as Jackie Ickx, sad to say..... Likewise the Eggenberger Texaco Sierra Team (Niedzwiedz and co on their first Bathurst outing) who 'won' the race in '87. They made the locals look anaemic to be honest, although even they had one up on Ickx - they at least were very familiar with their car - Ickx had never even sat in a Falcon previous to when he saw one at the track. Likewise one Klaus Niedzwiedz again, who nearly won the race in the ANZ Sierra for Moffat in '88 ... he was romping it in ... etc etc. Last edited by sweetchuk; 11 Oct 2008 at 18:29. |
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__________________
"When you were born, you cried and people rejoiced ... Live your life in such a manner that when you die, people will cry and you will rejoice ...."
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11 Oct 2008, 21:02 (Ref:2309324)
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#23 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 761
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I think the V8s these days have become very specialized, and so so competitive.
Back in the day the competition wasnt as close, ie in an interview with one V8 driver I saw the other day he often qualifies about 8 tenths off pole, and often cant crack the top 20.... Add in the increased reliability and some of the guys who may have made the top ten in the 70s or 80s now cant crack the top15.... I for one hope the same internationals do keep turning up, ppl like Cleland and Muller etc who got the hang of it |
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11 Oct 2008, 22:17 (Ref:2309371)
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#24 | ||
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Llama Assassin and Sheep Botherer
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 4,212
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These Contential types are O.K if you want to run up a shelias dress or design a new handbag,but when it comes to driving a V8 around the mountain leave it to the Kiwis and some Aussies.
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11 Oct 2008, 22:17 (Ref:2309374)
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#25 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 5,549
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