Penske to IRL

[nem]

It is now official: :headbanger:

http://www.autosport.com/newsitem.cfm?id=17431&series=7

Comments?

[nem]

I think today may mark a major shift in American Open Wheel Racing.

[KC]

Definitely a blow for CART. I am sorry to see this occur. I hope Marlboro are happy. I am going to let them know how I feel about it.

[racer69]

Why is it everyone is heaping blame on Marlboro.

It is Marlboro USA that funds Penske. Marlboro has Ferrari, Yamaha 500s and Mitsubishi in Rallying to promote it worldwide, and as Marlboro USA fund it, they would want to promote their business in their area, USA. They don't get any benefit from races in Australia, Brazil or England.

[Dr. Austin]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by racer69

"Why is it everyone is heaping blame on Marlboro?"

Pimping cancer leaves you open to all kinds of critisism. The cigarette companies know they have a deadly product but they are as addicted to the money as the people are to the cigarettes.

Don't defend Marlboro. They are a tobbacco company. Sure, I know some of you think they have been loyal sponsors, but that is the really big lie. They had nowhere else to advertise BUT auto racing. They can't advertise on tv or radio. I am pretty sure there are restrictions on what they can do on the internet. If the laws weren't so restrictive, don't believe for even a second that they wouldn't be advertising at football and baseball games instead of auto racing. The only reason they have been in auto racing for so long is they had nowhere else to go.

If they are so loyal, why didn't they sponsor cars before the advertising restrictions began in the late '60's? They aren't loyal to anyone. They are drug dealers. Period.

KC, let them know you are unhappy about the important things like them pimping death to our children. I think that is alot more important than our stupid sport.

If Penske's leaving CART is the beginning of the end for CART as some see this to be, it will have all turned on the blood money. Our sport is really sick if money is all that matters and we need it so bad that we will get in bed with those people and let them control the direction of the sport.

Sorry, guys. I hate cigarettes. The sooner these leeches are out of our sport, the sooner we can hold our heads up again.

[bluefeather]

Glad to see Roger back at Indy as a home team!
Why complain about the cigs now? While you're writing and complaining about the cigs, drop a line to the distillers. Drinking and driving is FAR more dangerous than smoking and driving! OH! And tell Cingular Wireless that driving and cellular phones are a political punching bag.
I Luuuvvv IT!

[Dr. Austin]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by bluefeather

"Why complain about the cigs now?"

I've always complained about them.


"While you're writing and complaining about the cigs, drop a line to the distillers. Drinking and driving is FAR more dangerous than smoking and driving!"

Right on. They don't have as powerful of an effect as cigs on sponsorship, yet. But with cig advertising soon to be gone, more teams are going to hve to pitch the alcohol pimps for money. Cig smoking is stupid, but legal. Drunk driving is not, and it is even more stupid. Let' smoke, get drunk and race. Yeah, that's it.

Both are legal products.

Cars and alcohol are not a good mix.

Should cigs be illegal altogether? Ask a doctor.



"OH! And tell Cingular Wireless that driving and cellular phones are a political punching bag."

I saw a woman driving down the interstate this morning while reading a book. Another was playing coochie-coo with her baby while on her cell phone AND applying makeup. Farding, as it were. I saw another car that appeared driverless, but he was merely bent over picking up the joint he dropped on the floor! Lord, we are never safe!


We could do something about it, but a law banning utter stupidity would be too broad and effect the freedom of responsible people. It would also put too many people in jail. Probably most of us. Yeah, the stupidity police, that's it.



"I luuuvvv it!"

You have a sense of humor so you and I are going to have fun here.

[KC]

I blame Marlboro for the defection because they are the impetus behind it. I urge everyone to contact RJ Reynolds and express your disappointment or if you are happy they moved. I am unhappy with this.

Marlboro and Roger Penske had the chance to take a leadership role in CART and elected to jump ship. It is their decision just as it is mine to not support them or their satellite companies. Why should Marlboro or Penske stick with the series they created with their sweat and blood when they can encourage its destruction?

I am not nor have I ever been a smoker. Here is my stance on tobacco advertising. If you are so stupid an indivdual to start smoking from advertisements on anything then you are a person that is going to do other stupid and self-destructive things and are doomed to die from it. No one person in the world can blame any tobacco company for their own self-destructive and addictive behavior. If you are under 40 years of age in America then you have had the evils of smoking pounded into your head since kindergarten, I know because I have. I can't speak for any anti-smoking campiagns for the rest of the world, but I can for America. And it is not just in one school system as I attended school in Hawaii, Florida, Tennessee and Texas. It was present in every school attended from pre-kindergarten to undergraduate study. If you now smoke then it is on you, not Joe Camel or the Marlboro Man.

[The Beer Baron]

Reading Robin Miller's column at RPM suggests it's the fact that the IRL are racing on Roger's tracks are the main reason,

Roger fought tooth & nail to keep CART at Nazareth, despite the low turnout he wanted to keep a CART race at Nazareth, it was blasted for poor promotional facilities, even though Marlboro brought a lot of execs there!

No CART at Michigan, the ISC didn't want CART there anyway.

The ISC are very much pro IRL and anti-CART , If the IRL doesn't succeed at these tracks then the future of OW Oval racing is in doubt!

[Dr. Austin]

KC, you are right in everything you say about the personal responsibility of chosing whether or not to smoke. But, remember, people are stupid. How many people do we kill every year in drunk driving accidents? That is certainly stupid enough. Cigarettes are only different because you only kill yourself instead of everyone close enough to get hit with the swirling debris.

I say, if the product is legal and the company pays their taxes and doesn't break the law, leave them alone. Let them advertise their product like everyone else. If the product is so bad, we don't need all kinds of laws and restrictions and agreements and settlements. we just need one law; no cigs!

I think the dammed things should be illegal. All of this becomes mute when the Cig advertising goes away. Good riddance.

[paulzinho]

Ever heard of passive smoking, thats one reason why smoking should be banned otherwise charge smokers with manslaughter...

[Jay]

Seriously, smoking's one of a few products that will kill you whether you are the one doing it or not. That's why I'm in favour of it being strictly regulated almost to the point of making it illegal. Luckily, they do where I live.

I can appreciate the money they donate to racing though. This is the most expensive sport in the world. Most people can't even get a snif of it unless they are already reasonably well off.

It is fair to blame Marlboro for Penske leaving, as let's face it, if they had a different sponsor, that was more concerned about their product's exposure world wide, or even around North America, they probably would have stayed in Cart.

[f1manoz]

It's been expected for some time now, but I was still mightily depressed when I read that they had defected. I feel more sorry for the drivers as they are going to do it sooooo easily next year. Plus Gil won't be able to defend his CART title, which will be a shame.

As for those defending Phillip Morris, forshamed. This move has nothing to do with the Indianapolis 500 or anything like that. This is a complete corporate takeover of Penske!!!! They, Phillip Morris, have dictated what they want to Roger and he has followed them. Why is Roger listening to those swine???

However, I did read some press releases which did state that what put the final nail in the coffin concerning Penske and CART was the dropping of Michigan from the fixture for 2002.

[Dr. Austin]

[i]Originally posted by f1manoz


However, I did read some press releases which did state that what put the final nail in the coffin concerning Penske and CART was the dropping of Michigan from the fixture for 2002. [/B]

Remember the "punch in the nose" he got from CART? He felt CART dropping Michigan after all his efforts was "like a punch in the nose." Did anyone really think that wouldn't come back to haunt them?

[Jerry]

Let's face it, Penske didn't need too much pushing to switch sides. He was already upset with CART over the loss of his tracks and the internal friction. So when his sponsor says "switch", he switches. No big surprise, and since the days of sportsman/owner teams are a thing of the past, replaced by big business, noone should be taken aback with this action.

How Helio and Gil feel about it will be obvious when their contracts come due. By that time who knows what kind of position CART will be in.

I'm just glad that the sport hasn't lost Penske as a participant. He will definitely raise the bar for the IRL teams and that will provide better racing for the fans.

While I am anti-smoking myself, I wonder where motorsport would be today if cig companies were banned. It already is a certainty that F1 will not be allowed their sponsorship in a few years, and a lot of teams are already concerned about where they will find a replacement. With the cig sponsors gone, all racing series are going to be competing for limited resources. I personally feel that alcohol related sponsors are soon to follow, making matters even worse.

[The Beer Baron]

Good points there Jerry!

Maybe it's time for motorsport bodies to look for more friendly sponsorships. F1 still wants tobacco sponsorships 'til 2006

How much money really is needed to put on some great racing?
Do we need $100m+ budgets for F1 teams?

With CART's lower cost for 2003, I think they could find it easier to get more friendly sponsorships!

NASCAR has shown the way not to totally rely on tobacco, yes RJ Reynolds is the biggest player, but there are very few cars that rely on tobacco money.

Alcohol will follow. But I would think a series is in better shape if Tobacco/Beer companies weren't relied upon.

[Dr. Austin]

They (CART) have an absolute pool of captive sponsors, don't they? None of these cig teams have to have any sponsorship gathering skills. They just stick out their hand because the tobbacco companies have nowhere else to pimp their cancer. When this money goes away, those who don't remember how to hustle are going to get left out. It is going to cause a gigantic economic autoracing crash. As of now, the only IRL teams that will be effected are Hollywood team of Nunn and Marlboro team of Captain Hustle. I don't think it will be a problem for the man with the bloody nose. Nunn's team will also face the problem, but he has been scratching for nickels his whole life and hasn't rolled over yet. Mo Nunn AKA No Munn.

With the tobbacco companies restricted to one series or the other, CART had an easy ride. The cig money was all tied up and the IRL teams had to look elsewhere. So they might be in better shape because they have actually had to pitch potential sponsors instead of just sit back and light up.

[KC]

Certtainly Penske should not be happy about losing the races at his tracks, but he can take a little of the blame on that on himself. There is little or no promotion of the race at michigan. He relied heavily on Ford to run ads about it and when they stopped it went unadvertised. It is the responsibility of the promotoer to advertise the race. When you see the cars orbitting with 1/2 empty stands it only drives home this point further. The track at Nazareth is too small for these cars or the IRL cars. The loyal fans there got shafted because the track is made for 120 mph cars, not 180 mph cars. Even NASCAR avoids that place and runs even shoter tracks (Bristol). A one lane track is not going to get the the series to keep on coming back.

[Dr. Austin]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by KC


"The track at Nazareth is too small for these cars or the IRL cars."

Yeah! Let's talk about race car and tracks!

I think you are going to be flabbergasted at what a good show the IRL cars are going to put on there. We already know the race itself is going to be a Penske blowout, but the action all around the place is going to be thrilling. The IRL put on a decent show at Richmond and that place is even smaller.

But the most exciting tracks they run seems to be the 1.5 milers. The cars really seem in their element there. They get speeds up to 220+mph average and there always seems to be two very good grooves, thus great side by side action. They just look right on those tracks.

The only bad race they had all year was Atlanta, but that was a blown engine and oil on the track. Having a 12 car pile up pretty much pulls the guts right out of any race. The biggest effect that has was alot of smaller teams were going into Indy in two weeks with broken cars and empty bank accounts. No one ever said this is an easy business.

But I wouldn't worry about Nazerath. The CART mile package wasn't very good this year, but the high downforce driver friendly IRL cars will really have us standing up in our seats.

[The Beer Baron]

Nazareth should be good this year, but both they & Michigan need to put the people in the stands & make sure they return!

It's a critical time for OW racing , CART couldn't get the people to return to Naz,Mich but with the IRL it's oval racing last chance saloon!

[Dr. Austin]

Thankfully, there is just one series that has real Indycars, and that is the IRL. Face it, they ARE the real Indycars. Tony can legally use the name again beginning in 2002 and it is his forever. Once the speedway and the IRL start playing that card, the public well become more aware and more folks will tune in.

As far as putting people in the stands, go to an IRL race. Take your friends. If you can't do that, drag them over for pizza and an IRL telecast. They won't care about turbos or international fields. they won't care about stock prices or engine leases. All they are going to remember is that they were hypnotized by the incredible side by siude wheel to wheel backs to the wall mega thrilling action. We're in the promised land, baby!

[mac]

I'm getting sick of this garbage!

[Dr. Austin]

Then contribute something.

[mac]

I have been contributing something, but it gets a bit repetitive and boring when some people turn every thread into an All-American, backslapping advertisement for the IRL.

[Dr. Austin]

Originally posted by mac
I have been contributing something, but it gets a bit repetitive and boring when some people turn every thread into an All-American, backslapping advertisement for the IRL.

Just like it gets real old that some foriegners think they can come to America and tell us how to do everything. Like they think after 80 some years that they have a better idea how to do it than the speedway that started it all.

And so what if I want to advertise the IRL? So what? It is damn good racing, much better than all that follow the swerving red car nonsense. It's alot better than those guys who can't even finish a whole race because they were too cheap to buy more tv time.

The Indianapolis 500 is held at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, in Speedway, Indiana. That is in the USA. It is such a monuental success that it has spawned an entire racing series just to support the teams for the rest of the year. It is an American tradition and an American race.


Live with it.