Bentley tires

Russfeld · 27 Dec 2002, 09:14 (Ref:458026)

What are they using next year? Dunlops or Michelins? Ive often wondered how much of the Bentley's potential is hidden by not being on Michelins.

SALEEN S7R · 27 Dec 2002, 10:36 (Ref:458046)

The bentleys will be using Michelins next year.

**Aysedasi** · 30 Dec 2002, 08:35 (Ref:459963)

That being so, what difference do you think it will make in real terms out on the circuit?

Russfeld · 30 Dec 2002, 09:46 (Ref:459986)

Well the Michelin is the best enduro tire by far. Pirelli and Goodyear have never come close.

**Adam43** · 30 Dec 2002, 13:35 (Ref:460086)

A while back they tested Michelin tyres at Snetterton and (if memory serves) it gave well over a second improvement in lap time. So at the longer Le Mans circuit that could equate to 2-4s (random guess!).

**Aysedasi** · 30 Dec 2002, 13:49 (Ref:460096)

I've just been looking at the title of this thread.

Bentley tires

Being a Brit, is this the expectation after 6, 12 or 18 hours of Le Mans 2003?

Fab · 30 Dec 2002, 13:52 (Ref:460103)

Quote:

Originally posted by AdamAshmore
A while back they tested Michelin tyres at Snetterton and (if memory serves) it gave well over a second improvement in lap time.

So much ?!? Good God, this is worth it !!! Audi wore Michelin those past years ?

Russfeld · 30 Dec 2002, 14:20 (Ref:460122)

Jesus, the Bentley was allready doing 58s at Snetterton. Getting another second is mega. By extrapolation thats 4-5 seconds a lap at Le Mans?

Audi have been on Michelin since day one.

**Aysedasi** · 30 Dec 2002, 15:09 (Ref:460150)

If only that were true.......

Please.......

Russfeld · 30 Dec 2002, 15:28 (Ref:460166)

Well just for the sake of easier math, lets say Snetterton is 60 seconds, and Le Mans pole is 3:30. so 3.5 times longer lap, which means I guess like a 3-3.5 second difference at Le Mans of Dunlop>Michelin

Hell Le Mans might be interesting this year

Rhino · 30 Dec 2002, 23:15 (Ref:460538)

And it's a new car with the full backing of Audi so they should have the better chip in the engine!!

Russfeld · 30 Dec 2002, 23:43 (Ref:460555)

What I find amusing, is despite all the protestation that the Bentley is a Bentley and not a Bentley-Audi, if I give you the phone # for Audi Sport in MIlton Keynes, Team Bentley answer the phone

Dauntless · 31 Dec 2002, 01:38 (Ref:460632)

I agree that 2003 may be the most interesting race at Le Mans in several years. However, my experience has been that one cannot simply extrapolate from one circuit's lap time to another's. Two years ago when my team switched from Goodyears to Hossiers, we conducted an extensive review of the data acquisition from both sets of tires on the same circuit. Our data showed that the Hoosiers could sustain slightly greater lateral G's than the Goodyears, which showed up as slightly quicker segment times through curves, but that there was no difference in the straight-line segment times between the two tire brands. I strongly suspect that if we could examine Bentley's DA comparing Michelins vs Dunlops, for example, we would see the same phenomenon.

If this holds true, then a more reliable method for comparing lap times is to compare the amounts of time spent in curved segments. Snetterton has about one third of its length in curved segments, or about 20 seconds for the Bentley. If the Michellins are 1 second faster than Dunlops, for instance, then they are about 5% quicker based on the amount of time per lap a car spends in curved segments.

Le Mans is about 20% curved segments, so a car spends roughly 42 seconds during a 3:30 lap under lateral G's. Five percent of 42 seconds is 2.1 seconds. So there you have it... my prediction for the improvement due to switching to Michelins. I guess we'll see this spring...

Stan

**Aysedasi** · 31 Dec 2002, 08:31 (Ref:460752)

All very interesting stuff. So we predict at least a couple of seconds a lap faster from the Bentley come pre-qual? Frankly, I'd have been very disappointed indeed if the relative performance between the Bentley and the R8 had not been evened out to an extent by then.

It never ceases to amaze me what a difference there is performance-wise between different lumnps of rubber.....

Fab · 31 Dec 2002, 09:07 (Ref:460766)

One question : does the grip of the track doesn't matter for the choice of brand rubber ? I.e., if the Michelin are better at Petit Le Mans, are they still better on the LM track ? Not sure...

Russfeld · 31 Dec 2002, 13:39 (Ref:460915)

Well not neccessarily no. Some tires are better other places. But i think we've seen with Michelin that they are good *everywhere*. Then again Michelin is allways with top teams so that helps them get to the front. A Pirelli shod R8 is going to beat a Cadillac-Pirelli for instance.

Dauntless · 31 Dec 2002, 15:12 (Ref:461000)

Frankly, I predict a bit more improvement than 2 seconds, but if what AdamAshmore reports from Snetterton holds true at LM, then I think we can safely chalk up a couple seconds of Bentley's improvement to the tires. It strikes me that it is in VW's interests for Bentley to win, and that therefore they will fund a certain amount of development work on the car for 03's race, in hopes of bringing home another trophy.

Of course, the privateers that VW have leased their R8s to will have designs of their own on the top spot, so I predict a real donnybrook of a fight at Le Mans. The R8s will be driven all-out as usual, and the Bentley will be pushed to the limits of its potential, with no holds barred.

And the other marques aren't exactly taking it lying down either...

**Aysedasi** · 31 Dec 2002, 15:24 (Ref:461009)

Well I certainly like the sound of that.

I can picture myself on that ferry right now.....

Russfeld · 31 Dec 2002, 15:35 (Ref:461020)

What other marques are showing up for LMP*** ?

Dauntless · 31 Dec 2002, 18:17 (Ref:461102)

Russfeld, I refer, of course, to those seeking the overall win, irrespective of their class.

Brettwp · 31 Dec 2002, 18:36 (Ref:461111)

Comparing the Bentley coup with the other LMP’s is a little bit like comparing apples and oranges. The LMP closed top cars I believe have smaller tires than the larger cars (by rules). This could give a problem with how long the car can run on a single set of tires that may offset the advantage on the track, if lost in the pits.

Dauntless · 31 Dec 2002, 18:43 (Ref:461116)

True, Brettwp, but the Bentleys have been beaten only by factory-backed Audis. Therefore, they must be considered a serious threat for the overall win at LM in '03.

C_g · 31 Dec 2002, 19:14 (Ref:461131)

So will Joest be at Le Mans this year? Do we know yet? Tthat may throw a monkey wrench into bentley's plans on winning le mans.

The dunlops weren't that bad on the Bentley. The main advantage of the Michelins should be the better (and more consistent) wear characteristics.

I think the narrower tires are more of an issue for the Bentley than they are for the LMP675s. Less weight and (at least currently) less downforce would predict less wear for the 675s. Does anyone remember how often the MG Michelins were changed versus the Bentley Dunlops last year?

Russfeld · 31 Dec 2002, 21:39 (Ref:461222)

Joest is running at Le Mans with the same drivers and same cars as before, with Infineon backing as usual. To say they arent 'factory' is only a paperwork designation.

Arena(?) the ex Gulf-Johansson team are running the Audi UK effort. Champion want to do Le Mans but are trying to find the money for it.

Dauntless · 1 Jan 2003, 19:05 (Ref:461630)

Quote:

Originally posted by Russfeld
Joest is running at Le Mans with the same drivers and same cars as before, with Infineon backing as usual. To say they arent 'factory' is only a paperwork designation.

I disagree. A critical element in Joest's success with the Audis has been the factory's direct engineering and financial aid. That aid has been terminated, from what I have read. That is hardly a "paperwork designation". In its place the UK Audi importer has added some cash, but that will not make up the difference.

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