Good old Roebuck! WARNING PRO-JPM THREAD.

[Damon]

The question...

Dear Nigel,
I have been paying close attention to Juan Pablo Montoya this year and my impression is that his frustration with an uncompetitive chassis is starting to show. Do you think this is the reason why his performance has been so average? And do you think BMW will stick around for much longer if Williams does not come up with a competitive car?
Edgar Palacios, Alachua, USA

The answer...

Dear Edgar,

Yes, I'd agree that Juan Montoya does seem to have gone off the boil a bit recently, but I don't think anything has fundamentally changed in him – I still believe he's at least as quick as anyone else in F1.

That said, there is probably a case to be made for saying JPM is less adept at setting a car up than many of his contemporaries. Patrick Head has said of him that he 'relies too much on his talent', and while that sounds initially like a contradiction in terms, one knows what Patrick means. In Montoya's CART days, with Ganassi Racing, Morris Nunn, who had boundless admiration for him, remembered his laidback approach: "He'd say, 'Just get the car near enough, Mo, and I'll do the rest'. The problem is, that was all very well with a CART car, but in these ultra-technological days, it doesn't work with an F1 car.

To be honest, too, I wonder if perhaps a degree of frustration is starting to get to Juan. This, after all, is a man who overtook Michael Schumacher – not exactly easily done – in only his third F1 race, and although he led many races in 2001, and won at Monza, there have been no victories since. This is not at all what he had in mind when he arrived.

True, he's made mistakes, although far fewer than some would have you believe, but the essential truth is that he has very rarely had the car/tyre combination to take on Ferrari. There may be no more powerful engine in the business than the BMW V10, but, frankly, it has been let down of late by both Williams and Michelin, and it would serve no purpose to pretend otherwise.

At Barcelona Montoya told me of the latest car's rear instability. It was, he said, the twitchiest car he had ever driven – and this, let's remember, is a man considerably more at ease with oversteer than most of his rivals.

While I think there have been shortcomings on both sides, quite honestly it seems to me that Juan has been let down by his car and team rather more than the other way round. If the Williams FW25 ultimately proves truly competitive – and the foundations appear to be there – and if Montoya works harder at its set-up, there is no reason whatever why we shouldn't see the stunning driver of the last couple of years again. Unquestionably, he has talent to throw away; what perhaps he needs to do is channel it a little more productively.

Now, Williams and BMW? Do I think BMW will stick around? Yes, I do. For one thing, this is one of the three 'big' teams in F1, and while it may have its fallow periods, Williams, like McLaren, always come back in the end. There is really no other team – no available one, anyway – which screams out for BMW to change its allegiance. And as for BMW going it alone? Very expensive, and hardly a short-term project.

I'd be amazed to see it happen, frankly.

It's not just me, mr v and Sato San then!

[garcon]

Well I wouldn't exactly call myself a huge JPM fan, but I can't disagree with a single word of what Nigel Roebuck has to say.

And I guess it kinda backs up what I've always thought...

He should have come to Ferrari!!!

[Bononi]

Yeah, he's right, but when Williams will turn the tide ?

[Irv the Swerve]

As said above:
If the Williams FW25 ultimately proves truly competitive – and the foundations appear to be there – and if Montoya works harder at its set-up, there is no reason whatever why we shouldn't see the stunning driver of the last couple of years again.



He'll just have to work his socks off on the set-up and car development. its another part of GP racing and he should be well able for it.

[Snrub]

Spot on with what I've been saying. I disagree that he's been slower as a driver now. It's simply the car.

We hear Kimi this and Kimi that, but I still say we've yet to see much that proves how great he is.

[Bonnoni]

Originally posted by garcon
Well I wouldn't exactly call myself a huge JPM fan, but I can't disagree with a single word of what Nigel Roebuck has to say.

And I guess it kinda backs up what I've always thought...

He should have come to Ferrari!!!

Last warning. Change your tone or you will be banned

[Craig]

A good imposter is always amusing. Unfortunately this imposter isn't very good at it...!

[JR Ewing]

Roebuck is as well qualified as all the Autosport journos - ie. he knows **** all about motor sport but he does have a very highly exercised mouth...

[Adam43]

Roebuck writes in a forum called Autosport. At the very least he knows as much as we do. Somehow I think that his opinions are worth listening to and could well offer some insight. But there we go.

[JR Ewing]

I probably was too enthusiatically rude about his mouth (too late to edit). He knows NOTHING about driving cars. If you CAN drive and read his column that is very clear although his reminiscing can sometimes entertain although I'm not sure about his (un)biasedness.

Marcus Pye always shows himself up in his column as well with his lack of knowledge but at least he knows the front wheels from the back ones!

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Damon


It's not just me, mr v and Sato San then!

Thank goodness for that I can't wait to see JPM in a truely competitive car

[Sato san]

Originally posted by Bonnoni
Last warning. Change your tone or you will be banned

At Least Damon , Mr V and myself seem to know whats what !.........even if Bonnoni's post does seem a little strange !!!

[garcon]

Had me going for a moment though.

Only a moment, mind.

As Craig said, there's nothing like a good imposter. And this one's nothing like a good imposter!

[Damon]

Nigels comments and opinions hold a lot of ground to anyone who cares to listen to them. I'd like to think that there are many people here that are very knowledgeable but someone who has been reporting on and had a close link with the sport for over 40 years, is very well placed to judge the abilities of one driver to the next. He's on the inside don't forget, we are mere observers.

[Schummy]

"If the Williams FW25 ultimately proves truly competitive – and the foundations appear to be there"

Where are the foundations? I don't see them. I see Williams in trouble this year, and they will be even more with the new Mac. Maybe Roebuck knows something we don't know, or maybe he was a bit optimist there.

If they doesn't find a good fix, Williams could end this season as fourth team,... but obviously they have the foundations

[Woolley]

I cannot disagree more with JR Ewing's comments. There are some poor journalists out there, but they are not those he's chosen to put down in such basic terms. Both men are erudite, well informed and have the respect and friendhip of the teams and drivers. Nigel is an expert on F1 and motor racing history and writes very fairly. Marcus is the only journalist who understands the problems of British motorsport, and is very well qualified to speak. If he hasn't driven it, he's organised it, marshalled it or commentated on it. You may disagree with some of their views and comments, and anyone is entitled to that, but you cannot argue with their credentials.

[senna12]

I think Nigels' response was a pretty accurate summation.

[DavidStHubbins]

WHo is to say that other drivers would not be better if they had proper tyre/chassis setup under them?!

[Peter Mallett]

Originally posted by senna12
I think Nigels' response was a pretty accurate summation.

Agreed.

I will say however that all the pro JPM peeps have not mentioned the (and I paraphrase) "lack of ability to set a car up" or "He's as quick as anyone in F1".

None of which tell us he's a superstar which is my opinion as well.

As to Roebuck's credentials? He's been around too long to be considered anywhere lower than the top rung. But I don't always have to agree with him.

[DavidStHubbins]

Hakkinen could not set up a car to save his life but got away with it more often than not.

However, guys like Senna, Schumacher and Prost are unique in recent times in having the speed AND the ability to set up a car consistently.

YES MOntoya is fast...! We KNOW this, but if he doesn't improve in other areas he will end up an ALesi. In my eyes he is far from great.

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Peter Mallett


I will say however that all the pro JPM peeps have not mentioned the (and I paraphrase) "lack of ability to set a car up" or "He's as quick as anyone in F1".

No Peter your right, and yes, his set up work could be a bit better, it's about time that he realises that in F1, his massive talent will not make up that extra bit in a car which is basically a dog.

Originally said by Nigel Roebuck
I still believe he's at least as quick as anyone else in F1.

Nigel actually said (and i paraphrase) "at least as quick" which i took to mean that he was (in Nigels view) actually quicker)

[Peter Mallett]

Interesting and selective use of the English language there Mr V.

Originally quoted by Nigel RoebuckI still believe he's at least as quick as anyone else in F1.

Looks like I'm correct then.

[Damon]

"At least as quick" does not suggest slower Peter, it seems to be it's Nigel's diplomatic way of saying Montoya'd kick ass in a Ferrari.

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Peter Mallett
Interesting and selective use of the English language there Mr V.

I know

[garcon]

Peter, I'm afraid "paraphrasing" inn your case means quoting incorrectly.

"He's as quick as anyone in F1" (your quote) is very different to "I still believe he's at least as quick as anyone else in F1." (which is what Roebuck actually wrote).

Now, in my interpretation (which may be different to other peoples'), "as quick as anyone in F1" implies he is no quicker than the best of the rest, whereas "at least as quick as anyone else in F1" means he can consistently match the best of the rest and in some cases will be quicker.

Or something. :confused: