Similarities between Jacques Villeneuve and Nelson Piquet...

[The Moon Monkey]

Anyone else think that Villeneuve's position now echoes Nelson Piquet back in 1989 when he was seemingly washed up at Lotus after 2 very poor seasons. Everyone thought that Piquet was finished in F1 but Benetton signed him for 1990/91 on a "pay per points" deal - i.e. very low retainer and paid a certain amount (£100,000?) per point. He won 2 races in 1990 and scored 44 points, finishing 3rd in the title! A quite remarkable comeback. I feel Jacques is at the same point in his career now...

I reckon that a top team (maybe McLaren) may be tempted to sign Jacques to replace DC on a similar deal...

Any views?

[corkholio]

I am sure Denniswill jump to replace someone who can't pass an Arrows with someone who can't pass Minardis.

[Glen]

Originally posted by corkholio
I am sure Denniswill jump to replace someone who can't pass an Arrows with someone who can't pass Minardis.

[Knowlesy]

Now come on. JV did pass, he simply spun like an idiot after it.

[TeddyG]

Well I've been pretty quiet after his last performance. That was truely JV's first bad weekend (i.e. can't blame the car this time) but every driver has one or two of those each season. It is only compounded because he has had such miserable luck thus far that everybody is writing him off now.
I really don't know about JV's future anymore...there was something about a Williams move on a few sites but I think it's pretty slim now that Ralfie seems to be winning and BMW will want to keep a German driver.
My guess is he'll ride out his career at BAR on a performance pay deal...it's all up to Honda and Willis if we're ever to see JV win again.

[Knowlesy]

JV and NP suffer that same disability - motormoutheus talkus rubbishus.

[Liz]

Well, they are alike in thinking they were the no. 1 driver when they were not ... and in rubbishing their teammates in public with a view to destabilizing them, although Piquet was actually successful at it.

However, Piquet had more women in one year than Jacques will have if he lives to be 100 years old. And to my knowledge nobody has ever complained in public that Piquet locked himself in his bedroom and played video games to escape close encounters with his fiancee!

But if you're talking about racing, there's no comparison. Piquet was a star. Jacques was a meteor.

[Glen]

Hey TeddyG - I was wondering when you'd surface. Better luck for this weekend - better luck for the team too because those Bridgestone teams are suffering big time at the moment.

Jacques will be needing every ounce of his famed mental strength to get through this rough patch, I do hope he makes it, but as you say it is hard to see where he'll go other than staying at BAR... and can't see him relishing the prospect of another season like this one.

[Gore]

Wouldn't be the first time Mclaren have proposed a performance related deal to a previous WDC of uncertain present motivation. Ron offered Hill $1m to race in 1998 plus, IIRC, $1m per race win (may have been $100k per point). Hill called this offer an insult and went to Jordan, while Hakkinen and Mclaren won the World Championships... (Not the best decision Hill ever made in hindsight; though perhaps not the worst either).

I'd be surprised to see the same offer made to JV, however; Hill had had more recent glory days at the time, was a better PR figure, and Mclaren weren't necessarily considered 1998 title contenders in late '97 (although Newey's arrival made it a safe bet).

[DieRitter]

Villeneuve will never be as good as Piquet.

In my opinion Piquet is a legend not because he was the quickest... He was actually the smartest on the field.

While JV just drove once for a top team... Piquet did that twice for many years (Brabham-BMW and Williams-Honda)...

His mistake to move to Lotus (turning down Ron Dennis' offer... He saw how hard was to divide the "Number 1" status with other driver) was actually a reasonable decision at the time...

The prospects with Lotus looked great... he had attracted sponsorship + the best engine... Btw leaving Williams and Mansell with the weak judd engine...

Piquet just couldn't preview that the design of the car should be so shocking.

Benetton was just a good end after many years of Formula 1... How long has JV been in F1?

[Bononi]

Originally posted by Liz
Well, they are alike in thinking they were the no. 1 driver when they were not ... and in rubbishing their teammates in public with a view to destabilizing them, although Piquet was actually successful at it.

However, Piquet had more women in one year than Jacques will have if he lives to be 100 years old. And to my knowledge nobody has ever complained in public that Piquet locked himself in his bedroom and played video games to escape close encounters with his fiancee!

But if you're talking about racing, there's no comparison. Piquet was a star. Jacques was a meteor.

...and just adding that Piquet left Lotus in a different situation, since Benetton needed him to help develop the active suspension.

[DieRitter]

A good old picture...

http://8w.forix.com/1295bra.jpg

Mansell? Definitely very quick... but the Brazilian smart ass ended up getting his 3rd wdc.

[Mekola]

I found more similarities between Jacques Villeneuve's BAR years and Emerson Fittipaldi's Copersucar years. There are similar adventures made in the same period of time: 1999-2003 for the first, 1976-1980 for the second.

[The Moon Monkey]

Originally posted by Mekola
I found more similarities between Jacques Villeneuve's BAR years and Emerson Fittipaldi's Copersucar years. There are similar adventures made in the same period of time: 1999-2003 for the first, 1976-1980 for the second.

Interesting point you raised here. Emmo threw it all away on a hopeless dream with his family team effort as has Jacques when he was blinded by his manager/mentor Craig Pollock when he signed for BAR..

I think some people have misinterpreted my point here - I am not saying that I think that the two drivers are similar drivers/have similar personalities etc. Just the point that they are at the same point in the careers - i.e. driving quite badly in uncompetitive cars (Nelson at Lotus in 1988/89 and Jacques now for BAR) and whether a top 4 team will take a punt on Jacques (in the same way that Benetton took a chance on Nelson for 1990, albeit on a pay per points basis)...

My own view is that Jacques would never measure up to a Piquet and is unlikely to feature in many people's "top 10 drivers ever" (although I think Nelson would well creep into this type of top 10)...

[Miss Hardt]

Originally posted by Liz
Well, they are alike in thinking they were the no. 1 driver when they were not ... and in rubbishing their teammates in public with a view to destabilizing them, although Piquet was actually successful at it.

However, Piquet had more women in one year than Jacques will have if he lives to be 100 years old. And to my knowledge nobody has ever complained in public that Piquet locked himself in his bedroom and played video games to escape close encounters with his fiancee!

But if you're talking about racing, there's no comparison. Piquet was a star. Jacques was a meteor.

Was that supposed to be funny?
I am offended. I really am.

[Jordi]

Well, a CART, F1 and Indy champion must rate pretty high in the list.

[Miss Hardt]

Thanks for calming me down. At one certain moment, I was ready to execute the half of the forum.....

...no, I am not like that.

[Liz]

I like Piquet. I don't like Jacques. Sue me.

[John Turner]

Liz, my view is the opposite ..... well almost. Piquet's behaviour could be pretty obnoxious at times with personal insults about other drivers, one even extending to Nigel Mansell's wife. He was a poor ambassador for the sport and I have yet to be convinced he deserved 3 world championships. He was the beneficiary of our (continuing) appalling points scoring system. Jacques as far as I can recall has never stooped to Piquet's level of insults but I do think he should now curtail some of his public utterances particularly now that Jensen has proved to be as good if not better. I'm not sure that Jacque's position really echoes Piquet's; he's been with an uncompetitive drive for so long, it is difficult to see how he can resurrect his career.

[GTRMagic]

Nelson Piquet, 3 time WDC Vs Jacques Villeneuve, 1 time WDC

No comparison surely... Nelson may not have been everyone's cup of tea, but he won in 1981 (Brabham Cosworth), 1983 (Brabham BMW turbo) and 1987 (Williams Honda), all different cars, in 2 cases having to fend off his teammate for the title...

Jacques Villeneuve had nobody to beat buy Schuey.....