1999 WDC question

zealot · 23 Aug 2001, 18:23 (Ref:134958)

In 1999, Mika beat Irv the Swirve 76-74 for the WDC. In the final race, Mika came in 4 points down. He won, scoring 10 points, while Irv took third for 4 points. However, Schumi Sr. took 2nd and 6 points.

Why didn't Schumi move over and let Irv take second? The Prancing Horse would have still won the constructors title, and Irv would have shared the drivers' title.

economy_waffle · 23 Aug 2001, 18:27 (Ref:134960)

i wonder....

R · 23 Aug 2001, 18:44 (Ref:134966)

It wouldn't have mattered, because if two (or more) drivers are equal in points, the championship goes to the driver with most wins. Mika won 5 races in 99, while Eddie won 4. So even if TGF had let Eddie by, they wouldn't have "shared" the title, Mika would still have won it. (Same situation between Montoya and Franchitti in the CART championship in 99, they ended up equal on points, Montoya took the title because of more races won.)

Don K · 23 Aug 2001, 18:49 (Ref:134970)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
... Irv would have shared the drivers' title.

No, he wouldn't.
Irvine would have had 76 points and 4 victories.
Häkkinnen would have had 76 points and 5 victories.
So Häkkinen would have been champion, and Irvine would have been second.
Remember Irvine had already been given the victories at Germany (by Salo) and Malaysia (by Michael), so on his own merit he would have ended up with 66 points and 2 victories.

zealot · 23 Aug 2001, 19:43 (Ref:134998)

Still, wouldn't it have been more impressive to have Irv tie Mika, something that has never happend in F1 before?

And Don, it really doesn't matter how you get the points, it just matters that you get the points.

R · 23 Aug 2001, 19:49 (Ref:135003)

Oh, but it does matter. It matters for the WDC! A driver with one win and one DNF (=10 points) is ranked above someone with one 2nd and one 3rd place (=6+4=10points). Whether a tie for points would have been more impressive or not is irrelevant, fact of the matter is it wouldn't have mattered one centimeter for the championship.

zealot · 23 Aug 2001, 20:53 (Ref:135056)

You misunderstood, R. What I was referring to was Don saying Irv was "gifted" two races, so on his own merit he had earned only 66 points. What I meant was that, if you cross the line first (and don't get caught cheating) you get 10 points, whether another car falls out to mechanical difficulties or a teammate moves over for you.

JeremySmith · 23 Aug 2001, 21:09 (Ref:135067)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
Still,it really doesn't matter how you get the points, it just matters that you get the points.

You tell Liz that go on I dare you!

nod nod....

zealot · 23 Aug 2001, 21:26 (Ref:135084)

While I'm at it I'll bring up the driving prowess of Michael Andretti.

**Bononi** · 23 Aug 2001, 22:21 (Ref:135130)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
While I'm at it I'll bring up the driving prowess of Michael Andretti.

I'm waiting

Epsilon · 23 Aug 2001, 23:41 (Ref:135158)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
In 1999, Mika beat Irv the Swirve 76-74 for the WDC. In the final race, Mika came in 4 points down. He won, scoring 10 points, while Irv took third for 4 points. However, Schumi Sr. took 2nd and 6 points.

Why didn't Schumi move over and let Irv take second? The Prancing Horse would have still won the constructors title, and Irv would have shared the drivers' title.

Irv was about to be lapped at the end. Actually, F1 Racing brought this up: Irv could have held Hakkinen back as long as he could, TGF would have passed him, and Irv would have enough points to be Champ. Of course, they could have just got Schuey to pull a Jerez again..

R · 24 Aug 2001, 20:37 (Ref:135470)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
You misunderstood, R. What I was referring to was Don saying Irv was "gifted" two races, so on his own merit he had earned only 66 points. What I meant was that, if you cross the line first (and don't get caught cheating) you get 10 points, whether another car falls out to mechanical difficulties or a teammate moves over for you.

OK.

In that case, I agree with you. A win is a win no matter what, F1 is after all a team sport (and IMO should be seen more as such).

Quote:

Originally posted by Epsilon
Irv was about to be lapped at the end. Actually, F1 Racing brought this up: Irv could have held Hakkinen back as long as he could, TGF would have passed him, and Irv would have enough points to be Champ. Of course, they could have just got Schuey to pull a Jerez again..

Or Irv could have done a "Verstappen" on Hakkinen...

Don K · 24 Aug 2001, 21:23 (Ref:135492)

Quote:

Originally posted by zealot
You misunderstood, R. What I was referring to was Don saying Irv was "gifted" two races, so on his own merit he had earned only 66 points. What I meant was that, if you cross the line first (and don't get caught cheating) you get 10 points, whether another car falls out to mechanical difficulties or a teammate moves over for you.

You misunderstood, zealot. What I meant to say was: Michael could have given Irvine two more points, in order to let the statistics pretend that this F1 season was more exciting than the seasons of 94, 81, 76, 64, 61, 58 (1 point difference), and 84 (1/2 point), but that would be misleading.

You are suggesting (in your first post) that Michael didn't want to give Herbert 2 points, disallowing him a WDC.
In fact, Michael and Salo had already given him 4 points each, and two more would not have been enough for the championship.

R · 24 Aug 2001, 22:35 (Ref:135517)

Poor Johnny... Does he know?

**Bononi** · 25 Aug 2001, 11:05 (Ref:135677)

Nah, he doesn't care about WDCs

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
The Unknown Car of 1999	Foster	Sportscar & GT Racing	8	18 Oct 2005 22:37
1999 - The Year It Shouldn't Have Been?	luke	Formula One	66	26 Sep 2005 11:15
[LM24] 1999 Le Mans	Garrett	24 Heures du Mans	11	12 Mar 2004 08:16
[FIA GT] 1999 fia gt	gomick	Sportscar & GT Racing	5	2 Jan 2002 23:38
1999 start	pink69	Sportscar & GT Racing	2	17 Apr 2001 21:48