Ford in sports car racing

Joe Fan · 27 Oct 2004, 14:35 (Ref:1137828)

Now that Ford is pulling out of Formula One, I think they should get back into major sports car racing like Chevrolet did with the Corvette. They would get more bang for the buck this way. Formula One is an open wheel series that requires having the best people to be a winner and those individuals are at Ferrari.

With the new Ford GT and the new Shelby Cobra that is coming out, why not get back into big time sports car racing? Since Ford owns Jaguar and Aston Martin, why not get these brands back into sports car racing again too?

kdr · 27 Oct 2004, 15:21 (Ref:1137880)

joe, aston martin are already on their way back, and whether ford would pit the two of them against one another i don't know...perhaps in different classes.

**FIRE** · 27 Oct 2004, 15:38 (Ref:1137899)

On 2 November Ford gives a press conference (probably to lauch their plans for WRC and WTCC).

tblincoe · 27 Oct 2004, 15:53 (Ref:1137913)

aston is indeed coming back with the DB9GT next year, and mazda was supposed to return, but i think thats unlikely now.

ford will slowly return to sportscars now that they have money freed up by Jag quitting F1. for instance they are running a factory Mustang team in Grand-Am Cup next year, but whether or not the ford name will return to elite sportscar competition remains to be seen. the dark cloud of nascar clouds their vision in North America, and the only ford brand i could see coming to sportscars would be jaguar. due to the re-focusing of jaguar that is going on, i wouldn't expect to see a Jaguar effort in sportscars until at least 2008-09.

i just don't think ACO sportscar racing fits the ford badge right now, they are concentrating on selling family cars, pickup trucks, and mustangs. i wouldnt expect the ford name to return to sportscars until someone who is passionate about sportscars gets in a position to make motorsport decisions for the company.

SL · 27 Oct 2004, 16:29 (Ref:1137941)

You are probably right, to make the investment, research and build a car capable of taking on the top sportscars will take a few years, unless they buy into a ready made team that is.

The Mustang would make better sense, idealy promoting though private teams with maybe a factory backed financial package.

I cannot see Ford pull out of motor sport, but I'm sure they will look very closely at what they do invest in. F1 could still be an option, should other teams withdraw costs could come down and winning easier, although perhaps a few years from now.

Looking back Ford have had little sportscar success, apart from the GT40, which was an all out win at all cost corporate war, most other Ford cars failed for one reason or another.

Simon

Dauntless · 27 Oct 2004, 16:30 (Ref:1137942)

Unfortunately, tblincoe's analysis is probably very close to the mark...

Nordic · 27 Oct 2004, 16:33 (Ref:1137946)

The Aston Project is far from a works effort. Ford have only agreed to allow the car to be used and get a approval from the FIA. No Ford money is going into the project. As I understand it all the money will need to come from other sorce's and may prove to be the downfall of the project that is yet to appear in public

What should not escape the notice of Ford is the amount of positive Press as sucessful sports car like the GT40 or 917 generates long after its racing career is over when compared to a single seater.

Ford have been able to play on the GT40 being the 'car that beat Ferrari' for 30 odd years. Not a bad return.

Porsche have long been aple to dine out on the 917's success, yet the TAG/McLaren is all but forgotten (and the Arrows effort is hushed up)

Jag will forever be linked with sportscars, the F1 effort in years to come will be seen as a mistake.

JAG · 27 Oct 2004, 16:50 (Ref:1137955)

The TWR Jaguar effort was very similar to the Prodrive Aston Martin one.

TWR had to find most of the sponsorship etc. to fund the program, while Ford/Jaguar gave the program its official approval and helped out in some of the technical and promitional areas.

There are at least 2 teams, both unnamed, who tried to get Jaguar backing for a prototype engine program a few years back. This was before the F1 program started.

I wonder if Jaguar would be interested if someone started an engine program now? Theres the XK8 V8 that has been developed for Trans Am!

I believe Lister have had sponsorship from a few Jaguar dealers in FIA GT also, so there is interest out there.

Failing that how about making the Prodrive developed Aston Martin V12 available as a customer engine for LMP1!

Bramzel · 27 Oct 2004, 17:01 (Ref:1137969)

If there's one Jag I'd love to see in sportscarracing it's that Jaguar XKR that ran in the british GT season last year. AJO Racing or something? Gorgeous british racing green XKR, I'm not really a fan of the roadcar but that car was just stunning.

[edit] Found a pic of it in this gallery at F1Photographs.co.uk. It's AJR XKR driven by Lloyd & Wainwright.

Bob Riebe · 27 Oct 2004, 17:15 (Ref:1137982)

Quote:

Originally posted by JAG
The TWR Jaguar effort was very similar to the Prodrive Aston Martin one.

TWR had to find most of the sponsorship etc. to fund the program, while Ford/Jaguar gave the program its official approval and helped out in some of the technical and promitional areas.

There are at least 2 teams, both unnamed, who tried to get Jaguar backing for a prototype engine program a few years back. This was before the F1 program started.

I wonder if Jaguar would be interested if someone started an engine program now? Theres the XK8 V8 that has been developed for Trans Am!

I believe Lister have had sponsorship from a few Jaguar dealers in FIA GT also, so there is interest out there.

Failing that how about making the Prodrive developed Aston Martin V12 available as a customer engine for LMP1!

Jag, is there anywhere on the web where one can find specs. on the TA Jaguar V-8?
Bore, stroke, comp. ratio, horse-power etc.
Bob

paul-collins · 27 Oct 2004, 17:33 (Ref:1137999)

Quote:

Originally posted by SL
The Mustang would make better sense, idealy promoting though private teams with maybe a factory backed financial package.

My understanding is that Ford has submitted the Mustang to the FIA for homologation, and is developing a racing catologue of parts which will allow the cars to be built into GT spec.

So who knows?

I just don't see a Mustang GT program happening until the Cobra comes out with independent rear suspension. Unless the GA Cup car proves very competitive...

JAG · 27 Oct 2004, 17:38 (Ref:1138004)

http://www.motortrend.com/features/n...ews030225_jag/

http://jaguarracing.wz.cz/Racingcars/xkr8_04.htm

billnchristy · 27 Oct 2004, 17:39 (Ref:1138005)

It may not be elite, or top notch, but stop and think for a minute about this:

Ford will offer its GAC car as a catalog item. Just like a Porsche Cup or GT3 RSR, you can buy this thing factory direct and go race...

That is cool no matter which way you look at it!!

More companies should do this with touring cars and the like.

GT1 · 27 Oct 2004, 18:26 (Ref:1138042)

In years? How about right now? If they had let the team alone it would have had a chance. But they had about six team principles in five years (I think six, counting Jackie Stewart who stepped down at the launch of the R1). Each one brought in new people, new ideas, adn by the time they had things the way they wanted, Ford would pull them for lack of results and hire someone else, who would repeat teh cycle of hiring new people, firing old, etc.

In the TAG's defence, Porsche kept a low profile. The entry was always McLaren TAG, even if the engines were of course a Porsche. Only "Made by Porsche" on the turbo indicated anything of involvment by Stuggart.

The Arrows deal was a mess. But that V12 was mysterious from the start. In 1987 Porsche showed Dennis what it would cost for the 3.5 liter 1989 Formula and Dennis got free Hondas, which were better anyway at that stage.

Then Oynx's Moneytron man started blathering about how he would quit F1 if he didn't get those Porsche engines. Lotus sent out a statement to prospective sponsors after the 1989 season expressing a desire for the engine, but saying it would take around US 20 million in funds to develop it.

Finally, somehow it landed in the back of a Footwork/Arrows for about five minutes. It was a disturbing blotch on Porsche's record.

Here is where the buck stops. We know about the stories of the 917. We here all the time about the 956/962. We love the 935 Moby Dick. Ever hear a lot about the 804?

In F1, its a lot about the drivers. In sports cars, its always about the brand unless you have a particurally well known driver, a Jacky Icyx, Tom Kristenson, Dereck Bell, or one off specials like the Earnhardts at Daytona.

Quote:

Originally posted by Nordic
The Aston Project is far from a works effort. Ford have only agreed to allow the car to be used and get a approval from the FIA. No Ford money is going into the project. As I understand it all the money will need to come from other sorce's and may prove to be the downfall of the project that is yet to appear in public

What should not escape the notice of Ford is the amount of positive Press as sucessful sports car like the GT40 or 917 generates long after its racing career is over when compared to a single seater.

Ford have been able to play on the GT40 being the 'car that beat Ferrari' for 30 odd years. Not a bad return.

Porsche have long been aple to dine out on the 917's success, yet the TAG/McLaren is all but forgotten (and the Arrows effort is hushed up)

Jag will forever be linked with sportscars, the F1 effort in years to come will be seen as a mistake.

SL · 28 Oct 2004, 01:10 (Ref:1138415)

Ford paid megga for the GT40, it won and still wins today. Evan take one down a high street and young kid's will comment on it, same as a 917 or even a 962. They look good, sound nice and have a race winning history. Ford's GT40 cash was well invested.

The same may apply to the McLaren F1. they are pretty cars, won a big race. A car to dream of. The F1 cars for the last 10 odd years have been much the same...... bland.

Anyway...

Simon

marcosgt · 28 Oct 2004, 09:34 (Ref:1138659)

After what the F1 programme's done to Jaguar's reputation nothing less than a full blooded Audi-crushing Le Mans return will do...

Well, I can dream

Cheers.

Jack Man · 28 Oct 2004, 22:26 (Ref:1139336)

I'd like to see them sink some money into The Saleen program. I'm sure with some Factory help this car could win just about anywhere. JMO

GT1 · 28 Oct 2004, 22:56 (Ref:1139355)

Ford really don't have a lot to do with the S7R aside from the engine being based on a Ford, loosely.

Remember the diamonds on the nose at Monaco? They were suprised they lost one I guess. That would be like putting a piece of stained glass on the nose of a stock car at Bristol. Its bound to hit something sooner or later.

Bob Riebe · 28 Oct 2004, 23:49 (Ref:1139398)

Quote:

Originally posted by GT1 ]Ford really don't have a lot to do with the S7R aside from the engine being based on a Ford,-LOOSELY.(!?)

I wonder why Ford and Saleen do not have a closer working relationship?
It would definitely be to the advantage of both, as the S7R would probably a lot more competition to Chevy than it is now.
Bob

Rich R · 28 Oct 2004, 23:51 (Ref:1139400)

maybe ford don't want the saleen beating the aston(when it arrives).

Joe Fan · 31 Oct 2004, 12:13 (Ref:1141210)

Another thing I wonder, with the uncertainty of Chevrolet in the IRL after 2005, maybe Ford pulled out of Formula One so that they could get into the IRL?

Overall, I just can't see Ford pulling out of F1 and not using that money to invest somewhere else in motorsports.

GT1 · 31 Oct 2004, 13:29 (Ref:1141244)

If one looks at the IRL's TV ratings and attendence at many tracks, one sees very little interest in investing in the series. The championship decider got a 0.1 rating on ESPN. You can't go up to anyone in the world and advertise that.

The general view, not my view, but the general view even on extremely pro IRL boards is that Toyota will take their money to NASCAR cup levels around 2008 and Chevy is out after next year, regardless. That would put Honda, not exactly known for their Cosworth like view of supplying an entire series, as the remaining supplier.

I can see, should the situation arise, the dropping of the rule (silly as it is) that every engine has to be badged from an automaker. Thats what kept the TWR engine out last year.

We could see Judds, Cosworths, etc enter the series. Otherwise, if the perception is true, then either Honda supplies everyone, someone else comes in, or they revert to lawn mower power.

Hugewally · 31 Oct 2004, 16:23 (Ref:1141357)

Quote:

Originally posted by GT1
or they revert to lawn mower power.

That would be great in my view...

Martin

Nordic · 31 Oct 2004, 16:48 (Ref:1141378)

Quote:

We could see Judds, Cosworths, etc enter the series.

The supply of Cosworth's is going to depend on who ends up owing them. Hopefully, in my view it would be better if it was not a car maker like VAG, Proton etc but someone who can dance to there own tune.

Mal · 4 Feb 2011, 15:29 (Ref:2825721)

I see pictures of a new Ford GT in Auto Express today - what chances of it racing??

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/au...as_hybrid.html

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