Jordan are running old Bridgestones.

[Ej10]

Jordan have been running old bridgstones for the first two gps of the season along with Minardi. Jordan have paid for the best tyres yet Bridgstone were unable to have enough of the wider tyres that have proved significantly more competitive on the saubers and Ferraris availabe untill the Bahrain GP.


As far as i am concerned this is unbelivable and shows why jordan have not been all that competitive as they should be.

[hamsmith]

I think the fact that Mitchelin cannot supply any more teams is discusting. Bridgestone should not be allowed to treat Minardi and Jordan in such a second class way.
EJ10 great peice of info but wake up! the tyres are not the reason for Jordan not being competitive.

[Ej10]

Maybe but the tyres are rumored to be 8 tenths faster than the jordans so that is a big chunk of time.

[Adam43]

Eight tenths. Well that would have meant Heidfeld would still have been 15th on the grid! However Pantano would have set a better time than Baumgartner.

http://www.autosport.com/f1results.a...54&id=7163&s=5

[Testure]

I've already read this a couple of times this year in quotes from Jordan. Think it was Heidfeld, actually. BAR were the same last year, remember Jacques complaining? If I remember correctly, at one point they discovered that they were testing some "new" Bridgestones that Ferrari had already been using for the previous race.

The difference in the approaches of the two tyre companies couldn't be more different and I'll bet it really, really annoys anyone who's not Ferrari. There was an interview with Gary Anderson in an F1 mag a few weeks ago that mentioned this stuff and he wasn't impressed at all, either with their methodologies or the end product.

[TeddyG]

Bridgestone have been working solely for Ferrari for quite some time now guys...there should be some kind of regulation against tyre manufacturers favouring certain teams.

[Inigo Montoya]

Bridgestone partners strongly with Ferrari because they know they will win, and because of the publicity that goes along with it.

Seen any Bridgestone ads lately that feature Jordans?

[Testure]

Sure, it works out great for Bridgestone and Ferrari. Kinda boned if you're one of the other teams using their tyres, though, eh?

[pole2pole]

Jordon are running ferrari tyres........come on we all know that is the case

[Kicking-back]

Originally posted by hamsmith
I think the fact that Mitchelin cannot supply any more teams is discusting.

Michelin can supply more teams, they just don't want to.

[Knowlesy]

The way Bridgestone treats their "lower" teams is absolutely disgusting and shameful.

Those guys pay for those tyres and deserve better treatment.

[Kicking-back]

Maybe those "lower" teams should read their tyre contracts more carefully.

[D_Marshall]

As much as i wouldn't want it to happen maybe this could be a good reason for a single control tyre. The tyre war is fantastic and helps to create a great spectacle as the tyre companies are always changing in who has the best tyres. However if the lower teams are getting older developments then they are just going to lose more and more time to the guys at the front. This means that they are unlikey to get the extra sponsorship they want, and may, in the end, go out of business. I know this is a worst case scenario but Jordan and Minardi are already in significant financial difficulty. Being slowed down more doesn't help their cause.

On another note, this could also be a way of slowing down the cars without cut backs in engine size.

[GTRMagic]

Originally posted by Kicking-back
Michelin can supply more teams, they just don't want to.

It was cynically suggested that the reason Minardi got the punt from the Michelin supply roster was due to ruining the average points per race calcs against Bridgestone....

[Gt_R]

It's not cynical..those who complain how "badly" BS treat Minardi should take a close look at WHY Michelin kicked Minardi out. The fact is that at least BS is supplying tyres to Minardi.

Is it because over-supply which cause Michelin to drop Minardi? Hell no...because they got BAR-Honda onto their list of manufacturers backed list.

Look at the customer lists of Michelin and BS. Michelin runners are all manufacturers backed, and Bridgestone only had one manufacturer backed runner in Ferrari. it's so obvious who bridgestone should/would favour, to condemn them for the obvious and logical is unreasonable.

Of course, if BS could provide sufficient tyres to everybody then it's easy. But the thing is the competition is so tight, the tyres improvement-rate so quick, BS is having a tough time to catch up, let alone properly track test and develope in huge numbers of tyres - and risk realising that the tyre isn't working all that well.

Yeah, Jordan may pay some money... but the problem lies with their ability to help in the developement. People find it easy to criticise BS-Ferrari, but nobody understood that almost the whole burden of tire testing and developement is resting on Ferrari alone.

[Gt_R]

Just to add, from the perspective of "lower" teams, i do feel unfair and sad for them. It is unfortunate for their hard-earned cash to not be fully maximised.

Did the amount they pay simply help them get tyres, and all they paid was a basic sum? Or do they actually negotiate for the best tyres and agree to pay a higher sum? If what Jordan/Minardi agreed with BS is to pay them a higher sum and buy the best/newest tyres yet BS failed to deliver, yes it is BS's fault. But i believe in cases like Minardi, all they could afford is a basic package of tyres.

[GTRMagic]

Other than Ferrari, dont the other Bridgestone runners in Jordan, Sauber and Minardi only participate in Friday 'private practice' sessions, and not run with unlimited testing?

So these guys only have 20 days testing allowed away from the race weekends... and none of the three have a separate test team do they?

[Gt_R]

Indeed, the ability to test is very lacking in the "lower" teams.

Furthermore, to make things even more difficult, with cars like Jordan and Minardi whose cars are difficult to setup/handle, it's tough to get much consistent and quality data from them. Because nobody knows for sure if the poor times come from the different tyre compounds testesd, or is because of the car that's slow/inconsistent.

And i seriously doubt Michelin gives "equal" treatment to all teams either (though more equal than BS), that while the compounds they brought has been tested and made available to all, Michelin would still put a bit more effort and had tyres that are more pro-top runners.

[RWC]

do jordan actually pay for their tyres?
it wouldn't surprise me if they did being a slow team and no help to bridgestone in development.No it's not fair but it is reality at the moment.

Yes the way BS get behind furrari is annoying to the max-but they do it because they see the value of winning the WDC at the expense of all else.
It could be argued that mich are wasting huge resources doing it the way they do.

It still does irritate though......furrari/michael manipulate things to get the very best of everything

[Gt_R]

I really don't think "manipulate" is the best word

Let's just say, putting anyone of us in the BS/Ferrari shoes, and either we would have done exactly as they did, otherwise we'd do what experts suggest on this forum and we wave goodbye to the WDC/WCC.

[GTRMagic]

So bring in Pirelli, Yokohama, Good Year, Dunlop, Kumho and Avon and lets have open slather...

[Skam85]

Actually i think Jordan are about half a second quicker than at the same stage last year, they have been kicking it with the Saubers and Toyotas, at least Heidfeld is anyway!

[Bleu]

Originally posted by GTRMagic
Other than Ferrari, dont the other Bridgestone runners in Jordan, Sauber and Minardi only participate in Friday 'private practice' sessions, and not run with unlimited testing?

So these guys only have 20 days testing allowed away from the race weekends... and none of the three have a separate test team do they?

This year there isn't "max 20 days testing" rule I think.

[golem]

This is not surprising, and yes it is entirely destructive to Minardi and Jordan. Those people who whine like dogs about the two back teams being slow then say it's their fault for being slow that stops them from getting tyres. How the HELL do you think they're supposed to get faster when every supplier treats them like this? From engines to lubricants to tyres. They pay or have 'technical agreements' to be used in the front runners, they demand payment from the backrunners.

And after paying for all this, the backrunners have to develop their cars, while the front teams have larger budgets on top.

Control tyres, control ECU design. This CAN be done, it will help with the slowing down of things, help with regulating traction control etc & still leave plenty of scope for car and technical improvement as well as helping close things up. It won't reduce costs, costs are a function of available funds. But it will free up the lower teams in terms of budgets to spend on development.

[BootsOntheSide]

Hoepfully by the time we get to Bahrain, Jordan and Mianrdi will have up to date tyres. It won't really help them, because they have been so far adrift of the other 8 teams, and will only fall further behind on pace as the season goes on due to their lack of testing.

Some of the ideas Golem suggests are well worth pursuing. Something needs to be done to keep private teams involved and competitive - mark my words that we'd be in a big mes sif manufacturers were behind all the cars.