Brands Hatch MSVR 27/28 March

Bryan Degerlund · 20 Mar 2010, 12:20 (Ref:2656356)

I notice from the Final Regs (yes, sad b*gger) that several of the races will not have a "green flag" lap at the start. This should save approx. 3 minutes per race and could allow an extra race for someone on the programme.

Thoughts?

Stoowert · 20 Mar 2010, 14:13 (Ref:2656420)

As it's tin-tops on road tyres, it'll be a good move. 750 MC shows the way, they've been doing that for years - I think it's 750MC! Having said that, I'm glad I'm on Post 23! It might spice up F1 too...

Bodysnatcher · 20 Mar 2010, 14:51 (Ref:2656459)

Looking at the programme,[ http://www.msvracing.co.uk/media/116...ssue%20two.pdf ]we'll need every 3 minutes we can claw back between races. Max 13, min 6 minute gaps on Saturday. Packed does not do it justice. Lets hope though that there are not too many understeering off due to cold tyres & brakes both at 4a and 5.
Stoo, you'll probably have to be helping form them up on the grid as the last car in the prior race goes past you. hehe heh.

Really looking forward to a great weekend of racing. Would'nt bet on much of a lunch break, but let's be honest we're there for racing. Hope it's drier than it is now.

**Tim Falce** · 20 Mar 2010, 15:36 (Ref:2656538)

I think it's a good idea and maybe those grids that need to warm tyres could be sent out via the pit lane and use this lap as a warm up. The only downside as a driver is that we get little enough track time for our hard earned and this is another erosion of value for money.

Eddy V · 20 Mar 2010, 16:00 (Ref:2656565)

In the old days when I started racing we didn't even know the principle of the warm up lap. We started with cold tyres and drove accordingly for two laps.
Or lost it in the first corner.

I'm looking forward to the weekend, especially now after I crashed into a deer (again). Bugger.

Bodysnatcher · 20 Mar 2010, 16:11 (Ref:2656573)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy V

Or lost it in the first corner.

I'm looking forward to the weekend, especially now after I crashed into a deer (again). Bugger.

yeah, it's that losing it on the first corner that worries me..

Sorry to hear about your car eddy, looking at another forum it seems piglet had some troubles last night too.

**Tim Falce** · 20 Mar 2010, 17:06 (Ref:2656622)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bodysnatcher

yeah, it's that losing it on the first corner that worries me..

TBH I doubt the warm up lap does much anyway, I'm more concerned about brakes working on the second corner, you rarely need them on the first. As for tyres, at somewhere like Brands Indy it can take a good two or three laps before they start gripping anyway.

Richard Duvall · 20 Mar 2010, 17:28 (Ref:2656647)

I thought there were two key reasons for a green flag lap:

1. To make sure the cars are all running OK
2. To give the drivers the chance to see where the marshals posts are.

Isn't doing away with the green flag lap a reduction in safety?

Does this increase the risk that cars won't get away from the grid causing startline pile ups?

**Tim Falce** · 20 Mar 2010, 17:29 (Ref:2656653)

We should know where the marshals posts are from the practice laps and the car can break down at any time, it never really knows what lap it's on.

Steven Humphrey · 20 Mar 2010, 17:53 (Ref:2656701)

As someone mentioned-750MC already have no green flag laps for series running on road-type tyres but anything on slicks has one (or if, as happened at Snett on Sunday, the track is wet for a race where the practice/quali was dry). Seems to work-everything ran to schedule, with a few red flags involved. Even managed to squeeze a shortened F4 race at the end of the day after they had 2 reds earlier on!

Stoowert · 20 Mar 2010, 18:21 (Ref:2656724)

Maybe they should look at throwing the chequered flag at post 8 in qualifying. So much time is lost by drivers tooling around on the slowing down lap. Champ Car (RIP) used to do this. I know, I did at Assen!

Piglet · 20 Mar 2010, 18:58 (Ref:2656754)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bodysnatcher

it seems piglet had some troubles last night too.

Yes, you could say that

Got disorientated in really thick fog coming over the back roads home and managed to stick the Saab front in to a ditch and a hedge. Couldn't get it out (even with KK trying to tow it and the nice policeman pushing) but the front wheels were in the air (oh for a rear wheel drive car!). Really needed a team of burly marshals and D&G!!

Gotta pay to get it taken it to my usual Saab independent rather than an approved repairer and they are going to try hard to avoid it being a write off...which would be good as I can't afford to replace it.

First fault accident in 23 years and a lot of miles so I feel slightly less ****ed off about it than I did last night...

On the topic, I think the Blue Book only mandates a Green Flag lap for cars on non road tyres. One of the problems is that some series take vast amounts to time to complete their Green Flag laps thus destroying our carefully crafted timetable.

The weekend is going to be challenging, I have no doubt we will all do our absolute best to make it all happen on time.

Bodysnatcher · 20 Mar 2010, 22:33 (Ref:2656892)

Challenging, thats one way of putting it.

The biggest variable when it comes to planning has to be incidents. If a car goes deep into the gravel or bends itself against the armco in the last 2 or 3 minutes of a session, be it race or practice, it'll probably stay there, but given that it will take 90 seconds after the chequered is first shown until the last car is off track, we could be left with as little as 4 minutes and 30 seconds to put a damaged car onto a flat bed and away into pits before the green flag flies again.

I'm sure all race officials will be doing their utmost to ensure MSVR can run all the planned sessions, but it'll be the track state (ie weather) and the competitors that will ultimately decide whether it will all be achievable.

A good pep talk from Mr Carburettor

(look like anybody we know?) will gird our loins, but praying might help too.

Piglet, I was sorry to see of your troubles elsewhere, hope your P&J can be fixed in budget, meanwhile I am laughing inside at the thought of KK on the end of tow rope (manually) trying to pull the car out the ditch.

Piglet · 20 Mar 2010, 22:53 (Ref:2656902)

LOL you'll be in trouble for that !!!

I don't know what you might mean....

The timetable is here http://www.msvracing.co.uk/media/116...ssue%20two.pdf there's 10 or 11 minutes down time between each race session (other than two which are only 7 minutes), we're only on the Indy circuit and hopefully we'll make up enough time between some sessions to balance out the hopefully occasional big problems.

I suspect that there is a good chance that the weather may be our worst enemy.

KK came out to rescue me having got the call to say "have you got the number of the breakdown company, I'm in a ditch and I don't seem to have the right number" - I was only 10 miles from home! So it was Saab power to try to pull the other Saab out the ditch not man power!

brands hatch · 21 Mar 2010, 18:08 (Ref:2657304)

I am annoyed as I can't make this one!...it will be only the second car meeting i have missed in about 2 years

. It looks like a great, packed timetable, I really wish I could make it!

chezza · 21 Mar 2010, 18:21 (Ref:2657317)

I'll be pottering around at this one, with my three series/championships on the bill. Looking forward to my first meeting of the year!

**Stephen Green** · 22 Mar 2010, 11:49 (Ref:2657761)

I'll be there with the Lotus guys.

Benny1664 · 22 Mar 2010, 16:07 (Ref:2657894)

Is there an entry list anywhere? Im def up for the Sunday but think Saturday will depend what the entry lists look like..

TwoSheds · 22 Mar 2010, 16:14 (Ref:2657900)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benny1664

Is there an entry list anywhere? Im def up for the Sunday but think Saturday will depend what the entry lists look like..

Keep an eye on this page http://www.msvracing.co.uk/calendar/...n-starter.aspx.

The entry list is "Not currently available".

**Stephen Green** · 22 Mar 2010, 16:40 (Ref:2657914)

Lotus Elise Group A 26 entries
Lotus Elise Group B 23 entries

Bodysnatcher · 22 Mar 2010, 17:16 (Ref:2657937)

from our friends over in National & Club forum
http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....4&postcount=14

70+ Production BMWs

Bodysnatcher · 22 Mar 2010, 17:19 (Ref:2657940)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piglet

LOL you'll be in trouble for that !

so, what else is new?

Bodysnatcher · 22 Mar 2010, 21:07 (Ref:2658152)

and from rod birley's site, chezza's championships' entry lists

http://www.rodbirley.com/27&28th.3.10report.htm

Cannons and Quaifes on Saturday

Piglet · 22 Mar 2010, 21:08 (Ref:2658155)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bodysnatcher

from our friends over in National & Club forum
http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....4&postcount=14

70+ Production BMWs

eh how does that work then? We counting them in and out of the circuit...(must read timetable ahead of the weekend

)

JimW · 22 Mar 2010, 22:00 (Ref:2658205)

I'd love to see some evidential basis for green flag laps. At present the experience/evidence and discussion with "thinking" drivers does not convince me.

Jim

PS Not quite sure of the significance of the new Post icons but have used one all the same.

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