Could a third year at Sauber ruin Heidfeld's career?

Yoong Montoya · 2 Jul 2002, 19:42 (Ref:326064)

I hoped that Heidfeld would be in the running for the second McLaren seat alongside Raikkonen for 2003. But if Coulthard continues his good form, he could keep it for next year. Now Heidfeld does have an option for a third year at Sauber. But should he stay for a third year at Sauber for 2003 or should he try to get a Toyota drive? I think he should go for a Toyota drive if one is available. A third year at Sauber could condemn him to obscurity.

Tom Fuller · 2 Jul 2002, 20:44 (Ref:326105)

I think nick is better than Kimi, IMO. Coulthard should swap with Heidfeld, and drive a Sauber

R · 2 Jul 2002, 20:48 (Ref:326109)

Too many years in obscurity can ruin a driver's career. Nick has got the potential, and should really be in that McLaren - hopefully he'll get that seat next year.

Sato san · 2 Jul 2002, 20:58 (Ref:326116)

i think Heidfeld needs to move next year , I would like to see DC move on to another team , which would allow Nick to take the other Mclaren seat . It would be better if DC went to Toyota next year for a 2 year deal , because i feel Toyota may find next year quite tough despite their impressive debut season so far .

senna12 · 2 Jul 2002, 21:39 (Ref:326147)

You often hear the comment about how well respected Nick is, yet he appears to be headed for another year at Sauber.
Why do you suppose this is? There have been a couple of opportunities arise, yet he has been passed by. Did the year driving alongside Kimi hurt him?

Mr V · 2 Jul 2002, 21:56 (Ref:326162)

Quote:

Originally posted by Sato san
i feel Toyota may find next year quite tough despite their impressive debut season so far .

Agreed........the second year is historically harder than the first (to quote Sir Jackie Stewart)

Sato san · 2 Jul 2002, 22:33 (Ref:326203)

And that is why i feel someone like DC will fit in better at Toyota as next year they will need strength in the direction they take , while it would leave the door open for Heidfeld to return to Mclaren .

senna12 · 3 Jul 2002, 00:05 (Ref:326236)

As much as Nick may deserve the McLaren drive, Ron has no doubt taken notice of the fact that he did not beat Kimi comprehensively, or even on a regular basis, at Sauber. So he looks at this and says, "You know, I don't think the scenario would be any different here, so I will pass on Nick."

As for his Mercedes connection, I feel if it meant that much to them, he would have been in the car before Kimi.

In order to progress, he needs to go elsewhere. We all know the limitations of the Sauber, despite being a good car, they are basically a Ferrari junior team. Their budget is very restrictive, I think. Have you heard of many improvments to this years car? All the teams have interim aero packages under development, but we haven't heard much on this front from Sauber.

If Nick can't get the drive he wants, if we assume that it is with McLaren, then he should try to nail down McNish's ride. Sorry Alan!

f1manoz · 3 Jul 2002, 00:10 (Ref:326237)

I'm hoping Nick doesn't have to put up with being at Sauber yet again next year, but he's driven well for the past two years in the team but although the teams have taken notice, no-one has signed him yet.

It's obvious McLaren don't really care one way or the other, so the best thing for Nick to do would be to find another seat, Toyota being the best option. He's be smart if he nailed a long-term deal with the team to help the team develop, and then drive for them when they start winning.

Jukebox · 3 Jul 2002, 01:13 (Ref:326255)

For a driver with a high caliber like Nick, if he wants to move he best move to either 5 of the top teams and Sauber is one of them.

A move to Toyota would not be a good idea as they are only in their 2nd year next year and we can't just assume that they are going to do better next year. Remember Honda in their first year? They were quite impressive and strong with an edge in straight line speed over some of the top teams. But what happened to them now?

To me, if he can't get a seat with either the top 5 then better not move because it'll be a very big risk for him to go to other teams as we have witnessed that new engines like cosworth and honda and maybe toyota won't get their drivers anywhere.

Sato san · 3 Jul 2002, 09:13 (Ref:326347)

What i dont understand is ...why would WEST Mclaren invest all that money in his Junior career , spend time on him bring him up technically with their F1 testing programme , putting him in their Junior F3000 team under David Browns wing , just to leave him sitting there at Sauber or even take his ability to another manufactuer like Toyota ?

It reminds me of what Mercedes done with TGF back in 91 .

**touringlegend** · 3 Jul 2002, 09:24 (Ref:326353)

I don't see DC moving but maybe it'd be good for him as he's spent so long at McLaren, no possibility of Heidfield to Jag ?

f1manoz · 3 Jul 2002, 10:40 (Ref:326383)

Hmm, Heidfeld to Jag works because they've stated they would like a German in the car, but the name thrown around a while back was Frentzen.

Personally, a step back to Jaguar would do nothing but harm his career. If he has a choice between that and Sauber, I know where I'd prefer him to stay.

steve_r · 3 Jul 2002, 11:22 (Ref:326417)

What choice has the guy got? A step into any team other than Ferrari, Williams, McLaren or Renault would be a step backwards. Jordan, BAR and Toyota would be a step sideways at best.

f1manoz · 3 Jul 2002, 11:51 (Ref:326440)

I'm still not counting him out of a chance at a McLaren seat. Ron Dennis still hasn't been quoted as saying DC is completely secure for next season. The only driver it appears who will be there for sure is Kimi, and even he may be dumped to test driver!!!

neilap · 3 Jul 2002, 17:16 (Ref:326588)

How are these drivers judged? The coverage that I get on Speed rarely shows anything but the red cars. I know the technical staff is able to see where he brakes and all of the details of his driving. Is this the information that is given to other teams looking for a driver? For example. If Ferrari wanted Massa, would they use his data to compare to MS and see if his skills measure up? After all that is probably the best way to draw a conclusion. Sure, the difference in equipment has to be taken into consideration. The reason I say this is, some drivers get so much hype but I never see them in a battle. RS get really high props as one of the best however it seems to me he brakes earlier and gets on the gas later than any driver I have ever seen an onboard lap with.
Maybe these are the things that are affecting Nick. He may be fast but the data may say he should be faster.

NiceGuyEddie · 3 Jul 2002, 17:50 (Ref:326606)

Lets not forget, Nick had to grow up very fast. He was very highly rated in the lower classes, than did very well against Jean Alesi in a very poor Prost and from that time on found himself challenged by a pubescent teammate.

Kimi's talent is undisputed and rightly so, but to judge him better than Nick is perhaps a bit unfair or at least judged too soon. As for now, Kimi is not showing any real improvement, and could end up an 'almost-have' like David Coulthard is now.

For the second time in a row, Nick is sided by a youngster, and he is forced in the role of the more mature and experienced teammate. He plays that role so convincingly, that people tend to overlook the fact that he himself is quite young also.

It's time for Ron to say goodbye to David. One needs to understand that McLarens future does not lie with David nor vice versa.

McLarens future lies with Kimi and Nick. And it would be quite ironic when you think both of them got a big chunck of their education from a Ferrari-liaisoned team.

NiceGuyEddie · 3 Jul 2002, 17:51 (Ref:326608)

Plus, it would make up for some damaged publicity for Mercedes. They need to homecrowd cheering for them again. A well-performing German driver could do the trick.

Speedworx · 3 Jul 2002, 20:56 (Ref:326728)

Why are people talking as if there is a seat at McLaren in 2003? DC looks set to stay alongside Kimi. Nick would do better to stay at Sauber and push for a McLaren seat in 2004, when DC retires.

NiceGuyEddie · 3 Jul 2002, 21:05 (Ref:326738)

Mercedes has stated nothing is certain for DC. And rightfully so. He shouldve been dumped at least two years ago.

yintandiddleipo · 3 Jul 2002, 21:20 (Ref:326746)

I don't see any harm with staying at Sauber, at the moment, if he has a poor race, then nobody notices coz it's only Sauber (who have the image of a mid-grid team even though it's not really deserved anymore), but if he has a good race then people say "wow, how did he do that in a Sauber?". Fact is, unless you have a chance at Ferrari, Williams or McLaren (or maybe Renault) then Sauber are the next best team.

Mr V · 3 Jul 2002, 21:35 (Ref:326754)

Quote:

Originally posted by yintandiddleipo
if he has a good race then people say "wow, how did he do that in a Sauber?".

whilst i agree to a certain extent yintandiddleipo the same sort of thing has been said about Fisi, and look where thats got him! If Nick stays at Sauber too much longer, he's destine to stay there or there abouts!

EERO · 4 Jul 2002, 16:26 (Ref:327172)

He has got to get out of Sauber. They will NEVER be a race winning team as long as they are Ferrari's customers.

Heidfeld is clearly fast-he's been a great qualifier in a car that is very good, but not front-line. He is technically very strong-a good tester and he has that crucial German connection.

I see two possible scenarios. Though I like DC immensely, and I would like to see him remain at McLaren, his time may be up, and a move to TOYOTA alongside Salo might make sense.
Wurz is said to be actively seeking a race seat for 2003. If both DC and Wurz were to move on, then Nick might fill the void at McLaren very nicely. Then McLaren puts Frentzen in the Test seat-it has a nice symmetry.

The second option sees Heidfeld at the Koln based TOYOTA on a long-term contract. Yes, as JYS says, the second season is tough, but next year continiues as a learning season and 2004 is the big assault for the Toyota team.

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