New venture for VLR

Reido Rules · 4 Jun 2002, 17:44 (Ref:304628)

Former British Touring Car champions, Vic Lee Racing, is planning to run an ASCAR for the second half of the 2002 ASCAR motor racing series.
Managing director and team principal Vic Lee hopes to have one of the Days of Thunder-style, V8-powered stock cars ready for the end of July, in preparation for the August 5 round of the series at Rockingham's 1.5-mile banked oval.
"I've kept my eye on the series in the background," Lee said, "and I like what I see.
Lee has had discussions with Oval Racing Management chief executive, Bob Berridge, and is all set to introduce a Vic Lee Racing team in the championship. "Bob Berridge is a motor racing man," said Lee. "He has worked bloody hard this year, as have the people at Rockingham, and he has steered the ASCAR series in the right direction.
"We are in the motorsport business, it's our shop window and we're very pleased with what Berridge has achieved. I've looked closely at the car Darren Turner is racing with HTML and can see what a good package it is.
"We have had a two year association with HTML, who won the British Touring Car Production class last year - they are a good young team - and I'll be working with them next week at Rockingham.
"VLR are working hard to get a deal together so we can run a car alongside HTML in the second half of the year. The plan will be to run one car for the remainder of this season with the intention of building a two-car team for next year."
Lee has been involved the motorsport industry for more than 30 years - and during that time has enjoyed great success on the international racing scene.
He first entered the British Touring Car Championship as a privateer team in 1990, finishing third overall. The team claimed overall championship honours the following season with Will Hoy and repeated the feat in 1992 as the works BMW team with Tim Harvey in 1992.
More recently, after a successful spell running Peugeots in the National Saloon Car series, VLR was appointed the works team for Peugeot in last year's BTCC. The team secured three podium finishes and third overall in the Touring Teams' Championship and as Team Halfords are currently running a three-car team with former BTC champion Tim Harvey, Dan Eaves and Carl Breeze.
"If ASCAR keeps on pulling in the drivers of the quality of Jason Plato, Nicolas Minassian and Darren Turner and teams like Ray Mallock Ltd and Bintcliffe Sport then the series can only get better," Lee said. "We are in the racing business and ASCAR has a bright future. We want to be a part of that."

The driver is not yet confirmed but should be Simon Harrison. Sponsors Halfords have apparently inspired this move, and it is believed that they want a win before the end of the season or VLR will move totally to ASCAR, to try and fight for wins, and showcase their sponsors.

**touringlegend** · 4 Jun 2002, 19:13 (Ref:304705)

Shouldn't this be in the ASCAR forum ???

Reido Rules · 4 Jun 2002, 19:49 (Ref:304734)

Well it's BTCC news concearning a BTCC team, and an ex-BTCC driver.

Plus if they put an ASCAR forum in I'd possibly put it there but it's merged with NASCAR, and it's pointless putting British motorsport news there.

Speedworx · 4 Jun 2002, 20:50 (Ref:304790)

We do discuss ASCAR in there.

Great for the series to have another top name in it.

redshoes · 4 Jun 2002, 21:05 (Ref:304797)

No, we discuss ASCAR in the NASCAR/ASCAR forum. If you want this to be a debate about will VLR stay in the BTCC next year (as in the title of the pole) then it can stay here. If you'd rather discuss ASCAR then I'll move it.

Speedworx · 4 Jun 2002, 22:04 (Ref:304822)

VLR won't stay if they don't win soon. They will probably go to ASCAR full time.

**touringlegend** · 4 Jun 2002, 22:26 (Ref:304834)

They'll stay if they get a works deal...

flyingkipper · 4 Jun 2002, 22:40 (Ref:304843)

Pah, more silly rumours. Why Halfords would want to be seen in ASCAR is beyond me. There's no link to roadcars like there is with the BTCC and Halfords are selling things to roadcar owners. Not ASCAR owners.

Peter Scillitoe · 5 Jun 2002, 15:15 (Ref:305366)

Quote:

Originally posted by flyingkipper
Pah, more silly rumours. Why Halfords would want to be seen in ASCAR is beyond me. There's no link to roadcars like there is with the BTCC and Halfords are selling things to roadcar owners. Not ASCAR owners.

Spot on. I saw the German ASCAR race on Motors last night. All of 14 cars and not a single spectator in sight. Compare that to the BTCC!!

**bella** · 5 Jun 2002, 15:54 (Ref:305388)

you can't be seen in ascar.
number one, there's no-one at the races to see you, as previously pointed out...
number two, there's nowt obviously on tv that can beat a saturday avo time slot on itv...

**touringlegend** · 5 Jun 2002, 16:38 (Ref:305417)

I don't know why so many people(in general) think it's the place to be. Is it because Plato's there? Along with that CART star ???

Reido Rules · 5 Jun 2002, 17:57 (Ref:305494)

You have to remember at BTCC races, the fans are placed around the perimeter, but at Rockingham and Lauzsitz there are stadiums of over 45,000 and even a BTCC crowd would be hard to spot, especially if seated all over the place. ASCAR's crowd figures are not bad for a series in it's SECOND year, FIRST real year. Last years series round 1 attracted more people than most of last years BTCC races.

ASCAR now has a lot of class drivers, Kelvin Burt, Darren Turner, Jason Plato, Nicolas Minassain, Toby Scheckter and more arriving all the time. BTCC is still Britains No1 but ASCARs progress is amazing, and if it keeps up this it has a realistic chance of challenging the BTCC.

Do not judge ASCAR crowds by the race shown from Germany that was a Saturday race, with 2 more which were cancelled on a Sunday, Rockingham struggles to get many people in on Saturdays.

Compare 14 cars which is not ASCARs usual grid with last years BTCC Touring grid, makes it look impressive, there will be 20 this weekend, and more with VLR and Warren Hughes joining in the near future.

The best Summary of this was by one of the team bosses, where is last years ASCAR champion? going to be in NASCAR Busch with one of the top teams, with the runner up expected to be in Winston cup soon, where is last years BTCC champ? looking average in ASCAR.

BTCC fans do not like ASCAR because Plato is driving in it, that is an excuse I have been given far too often, and it's not good enough, and of the people who slag it off very few had actually bothered to watch a race.

Halfords want wins it's as simple as that, they can call themselves European ASCAR Champions due to technical excellence etc, where is in the BTCC they'd struggle to get a single win overall. VLR and Halfords decision is based on success and competitiveness. If the car they place in ASCAR does well for the remainder of the season, then we may see VLR moving away.

Peter Scillitoe · 5 Jun 2002, 18:20 (Ref:305508)

Quote:

Originally posted by Reido Rules
BTCC fans do not like ASCAR because Plato is driving in it, that is an excuse I have been given far too often, and it's not good enough, and of the people who slag it off very few had actually bothered to watch a race.

Reido

I am not a particular fan of the BTCC. As an occasional CART Oval Observer, I witnessed ASCAR at Rockingham last year and was not impressed. I am 55 years old and have been involved in motorsport since my teens; I have seen many championships come and go. I think ASCAR will continue to struggle, and to succeed it will have to move outside the strict confines of the ovals, ie it needs to spread its fan base around the country by running races at Brands short circuit, Mallory Park and possibly Castle Combe. If it does that it might give the BTCC a run for its money and draw people from across the country to Rockingham.

100%VauxhallFan · 5 Jun 2002, 19:01 (Ref:305534)

While I am sure all motorsport requires a certain level of skill to drive in, I have to say, I think ASCAR appears to be for drivers who can do nothing but go round in cirles. Like I say though, I'm sure there is skill invloved in it, but to me, it seems like the most boring series ever. I think it would be a shame if VLR left the BTCC to go to ASCAR, as I just think BTCC is a better place for teams to be in: It's a more interesting series.

Someone said about how the first round of last years ASCAR got more than most rounds of the BTCC - of course that will happen. It was the first round of a new series - it's bound to get a big crowd because people want to see what its like. I'd like to see how the second and third round crowds of last years ASCAR compared to the rest of the BTCC rounds.

Also, if you consider that last year was the first year of the new BTCC, you can compare it to ASCAR in the respect, they are both new series. I think the BTCC was much more stable and sorted last year than ASCAR was.

But, back to the issue at hand...

redshoes · 5 Jun 2002, 19:30 (Ref:305570)

If you mean the August bank holiday meeting straight after Oulton BTCC I'm not surprised it got a big crowd. There were so many free tickets to be had I'd be surprised if they actually had more than a few hundred paying spectators.

Reido Rules · 5 Jun 2002, 20:47 (Ref:305713)

They are different concepts and attract different types of Motorsport fan. ASCAR has improved this year, so if your judging it on last year give it another go.

ASCAR will grow, and if big names continue to switch, then it will becaome big. But I think in a comparrison to the BTCC it's a case of they are different forms of motorsport and hard to compare, due to technology, styles, skills, etc, they're both good series in their own right, BTCC is ahead at the moment, but who knows what the future holds.

**touringlegend** · 5 Jun 2002, 22:17 (Ref:305804)

I think you have to look at different series in respect of the different manufacturers represented there.

I've spoken to too many people who won't go to BTCC races because BMW aren't racing as works anymore, or Ford has left etc etc. Most Europeans/Brits etc want to see those different makes racing against each other.

It all comes down to where the car manufacturers want to race, and I wonder where that'll be ???

Super Tourer · 6 Jun 2002, 07:00 (Ref:306019)

I've seen some of the photo's from the German race and the stands look to be totally deserted, so ASCAR hasn't really captured the racing public's imagination yet - but it is early days.

Trouble is, that the 'theatre' style viewing of the ovals makes crowd attendance a more important factor to create the atmosphere. It's different when a sparse crowd might be scattered at viewing points around a 2 mile 'road' circuit, as even one line of people around the track look's good.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned (I know this isn't the ASCAR forum!), is how Colin White a racer with a real grassroot's background has made established 'superstars' like Minassian and Plato look fairly average, with his self run car - he even ran in Germany on tyres that had already done 100 laps....

Another factor, is the cultural differences in motorsport appreciation between the USA and Europe.US motorsport is very much speed led, laps are measured in speed as opposed to time - which is one reason why F1 hasn't previously been that well received in the US as its perceived as being 'slow'.

In Europe we are more used to circuit based racing on a mixture of tracks and different range of corners. Whether we will grow to love ovals in Europe only time will tell, but I beleive that Rockingham has substantially reduced the CART race ticket prices this year.....

Reido Rules · 6 Jun 2002, 17:53 (Ref:306567)

If you want to see Ford V8's then hey, go to ASCAR, but ASCAR isn't a manufacturer sport, just like NASCAR, if you think that it is based on manufacturer involvment you don't understand it.

Manufacturers give their name and possibly a bung to a tuning company which builds them a V8 and then the team Purchases a chassis fom a chassis builder commissioned by the series, and then a moulded space framed body shell is put on top. ASCAR is like NASCAR you can't expect British Manufacturers, because the Chassis are made in the USA, designed around American cars. Between the cars there is no real performance difference, but if people want to watch Fords then they can go to ASCAR, which is an ARCA equivenant series, which Ford pay the money to ahve cars built for, and to gett he best engine tuners.

So ASCAR will never beat the BTCC manufacturer wise, but if the Vauxhalls run away with the championshi, then we will see independant teams switch. Apparently a lot of the production teams are considering the switch, and Rob Collard is rumoured to have already made it. With VLR looking over towards ASCAR, how many other Touring privateers will move over? RML apparently turned down a BTCC programme in favour of ASCAR, so will it grow yes, but will it be above the BTCC? depends on how many manufacturers join in the BTCC and what kind of drivers each series attracts. Maybe it will take until a new generation of motorsport fans have developed until we see a growth in ASCAR as it is a totally new concept, and for many it will be hard to convince to go to Rockingham, but new younger fans coming through, maybe targeted well by publicity of ASCAR and ASCAR may grow bigger than BTCC if it grabs them first.

It's something that may take time to develop a winner, but IF say Jamaes Thompson moved to ASCAR would the Thommo fans amongst us, go and see him race? This is the point there are no real fan bases for guys like Colin White, who is agruably one of the heroes of British Motorsport.

Larsen · 7 Jun 2002, 09:44 (Ref:307174)

ASCAR is growing very quickly...and that is usually a good thing for any new series. Sure some of you might be upset that ASCAR are nicking some of the teams from the BTCC but you gotta think what the teams want. They want to win and to be competitive, in ASCAR they can be because its such a open series. Look at Colin White, he runs his own team with his family and he still has won 2 races so far.

I been supporting ASCAR since i first heard of it...i know some ppl would agree that the BTCC has become a bit boring nowadays because of the dominance of Vauxhall(dominance like that kills championships). If the BTCC wants to stay as the best series in Britain, they need to sort this Vauxhall situation out and get some more manufacturers in. I will always like the BTCC but i cant watch it every week because you know who would win. Overall im sticking with ASCAR because it is about to become big, and who knows...like Reido says...it might even be bigger than the BTCC in the future!

I'll just leave a question for you guyz (and gals) to answer...if you were a team owner and you wanted to win, would you join a series that gives you a good chance (ASCAR) or stick with one that you might not have such a good chance (BTCC) to win in?

Btw, for those who slag off ASCAR...why dont you actually go to one of the races and see what its like...you'll be damned amazed thats for sure.

100%VauxhallFan · 7 Jun 2002, 10:54 (Ref:307236)

Which would be the better achievment -

To enter ASCAR where the field is fairly evenly matched and win a race, or

To enter the BTCC and beat Vauxhall?

I know which would be the greater achievment if I were the team boss.

Reido Rules · 7 Jun 2002, 18:27 (Ref:307638)

Yeah but the money runs out to beat the might of Manufacturers with their experiance.

Vic Lee is probably fed up with trying to play catch but never quite getting there. He just wants to say VLR champions of ...... Not particularly any series name, Halfords want to say Halfords champions of...... and no particular series (well it does have to be respectable) the average person on the street will see champions in Halfords advert, and not of BTCC or ASCAR, and to say BTCC is gonna cost a lot more money, and may not happen, where as in ASCAR if you buy the car and you manitain it reasonably well then it will be competitive for a decent diver. As Larsen said Colin White with his wife in the pit crew last week on a limited budget came from 5th to win against massive companies like RML and Bintcliffe.

Drivers prefer to say Champion and can say that a win in ASCAR is based on driver skill and not 90% the cars skill in the BTCC, if you are a poor driver in the BTCC if you ahve a good car you can still do well, in ASCAR you'll drop to last rapidly and end up in the wall. ASCAR involves a lot of skill make no mistake, Jason Plato said if you approach ASCAR with a no skill theory you are taken by suprise he has recognised that ASCAR is Physically and mentally harder for drivers, and involves lots of skill. But he also says to get a podium in ASCAR is more satisfying than a win in BTCC because you know you've drove well and not just had the best car.

Larsen · 7 Jun 2002, 22:10 (Ref:307797)

exactly right....the concentration you would have to have in ASCAR is sooooo immense...if you have one second where you lose concentration, then you would be in the wall. It is a sense of achievement ofcourse. Most people think its easy to turn left and go around in circles but you gotta remember, if you dont keep the momentum going through the corners, you are gonna lose vital seconds to your competitor.

With the BTCC...you just need the best car to win. In ascar, its having the right setup which would give you a chance to win.

Reido Rules · 7 Jun 2002, 23:08 (Ref:307817)

Vic Lee's sister car belonging to HTML was fastest in testing at Rockingham.

Who will be driving the VLR ASCAR for this year? the one the only Steve Soper.

The two sports are very different, but it is ignorant to believe that ASCAR is Skilless, and that it is boring when you have never even considered watching a race.

Peter Scillitoe · 8 Jun 2002, 08:42 (Ref:307934)

Quote:

Originally posted by Reido Rules
guys like Colin White, who is agruably one of the heroes of British Motorsport.

I agree, but - if the series expands as most subscribers to this thread obviously think and want - then the money and the professionals will move in - and the likes of Colin will be left high and dry.

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