Stupid rear safety plates make new LMP's look crap

[Flat12-Aircool]

Anybody else think those endplate things behind the 2004 reg LMP1/2 cars are totally spoiling the look of the rear of the cars?

Didn't they try to introduce a similar thing in Formula 1 until after a few races the teams got together and forced them out?

I mean, imagine how crap a 917k would look nowadays from the back if they had to have 2 of these things stuck behind the rear wheels. IMO its a safety measure too far, as they've already reined in the aerodynamics somewhat and if a cars got a decent enough survival cell & roll bar then that should be enough to protect the driver.

[gttouring]

truth be told, you can't really go too far for safety, although some things may look stupid.
these are for the 2004 reg cars though, newer ones don't suffer, and it could be worse.
RACER mag did a piece on safer open wheel cars and they had nerf bars and fenders and all sorts of rubbish on the car.
this is nothing so far

[JAG]

When it comes to these aero bits and bobs I don't think anythings good or bad, just different.

There were ugly Group C cars, ugly LMP900s and there'll be ugly LMP1s (NASAMAX).

But for every NASAMAX theres a Pescarolo.

Personally I like the new rear endplates.

[Flat12-Aircool]

Originally Posted by gttouring

these are for the 2004 reg cars though, newer ones don't suffer

What do you mean? That they are just for hybrids?

[gttouring]

i do believe so, i will have to look it up to be sure.
and one ugly aero bit that so many are guilty of from alfa to maclarenF1 and porsche's inbetween, is the 'long tail' variants of any sports car racer or GT
eeesh them is ugly

[Fab]

I won't use the same words but yes, the Hybrids regs don't allow cars to look good, at the rear (stupid enplates) and on the sides (the cars are too high).

[sportscarsRULE]

Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool

What do you mean? That they are just for hybrids?

The Lola B05 has them, and Mike explains their purpose. http://www.mulsannescorner.com/LolaB0540-4.html

The new cars look fine IMO (especially the RML Lola).

[sportscarsRULE]

Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool

if a cars got a decent enough survival cell & roll bar then that should be enough to protect the driver.

What about people standing along the side of the track? I'm sure Le Mans doesn't want anymore fans killed.

[Flat12-Aircool]

Originally Posted by sportscarsRULE

The Lola B05 has them, and Mike explains their purpose. http://www.mulsannescorner.com/LolaB0540-4.html

The new cars look fine IMO (especially the RML Lola).

Yes i'd seen that myself.

I realise what they are for, but apart from 1999 Mercedes doing a triple somersalt (with pike) then does this really happen very often? And after the new aero regulations are fitted I would think that it is even less likely to occur if ever at all. Even then the Cockpit survival cells nowadays are so strong that the driver has never been better protected.

This is the problem with modern racing, the picky FIA have turned all motorsports into rather Antiseptic affairs with no real edge to them anymore. Spectators are 1/2 a mile away from the circuit at any given place except Monaco because of enormous run-offs and sand traps.

I have to keep watching old Motor racing footage from time to time to remind myself what I used to like about the sport before all this Byzantine regulation nonsense started to water down the experience.

[Kicking-back]

Spectators half a mile away?

Not at Le Mans.

A 1955 style disaster could easily happen again if a car went skywards.

[pirenzo]

I don't think the endplates have anything to do with safety really do they? They're just to make the longer tails allowed by the old rules less efficient, and hopefully slow the hybrids so that they're slower than the LMP1s.
OK, so they're slowing all the cars in the name of safety, but the particular function of the endplates is to make the new cars appear faster than the older ones

[Dani Filth]

I'm with Jag .. i like the endplates .

[TheNewBob]

Spectators are not always half a mile away from the action - at Silverstone between Abbey and the bridge everyone could get very close to the track where the FIA GT's were passing along, same with the exit of Luffield. It's probably reasons like this that made Big Bernie try and take F1 away from there! Could get very close at Donington's Melbourne hairpin too.

[JAG]

The REAR endplates, not WING endplates, are there to stop the car leaving the ground when the car spins etc.

Just to confuse things I believe the WING endplates also help in this situation

Or something like that!

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/LolaB0540-4.html

[TheNewBob]

Also - I do like the endplates - to be honest it doesn't change my opinions much if they were there or not. When they're travelling past at high speed they're hardly the first thing you take note of when your at a circuit...

[Bob Riebe]

The open or semi-open rear fenders have been a problem, especially for cars following, since the Can-Am days.
I cannot say for sure, but I believe the SCCA required closed rear-fenders already by the early seventies.
In the Trans-Am the Cat. II cars coulld not have vents in back of the large fender flares that allowed anything to strike the car following.

I am still amazed at the somewhat paranoid attitude towards "safety" the many of you seem to posses.
If safety can never be taken too far, then the cars should be built and tracks designed that NO ONE will EVER be hurt, period.

IN sports safety never has been, or ever will be number one, as most courts stills see it as, the ones particiapating know the chances and can quit if the do not like it.
The day that truly changes racing will cease to exist.

Bob

[429CJ]

From square behind they look bit like MUDFLAPS

[Flat12-Aircool]

Originally Posted by JAG

The REAR endplates, not WING endplates, are there to stop the car leaving the ground when the car spins etc.

Yes just to clarify, it is REAR endplates I'm talking about.

However further to my point about overboard safety regulations, I've been watching some of the Isle of Man TT racing these past few days and that has brought a smile to my face that somewhere in this world there is still some real gritty no-holds-barred racing going on. All be it on 2 wheels and not 4, although the 3 wheeled Motorbike Sidecar racing has been my favourite so far, superb!

[Nivola]

flat12-aircool dont talk safty about the TT. People are going nutts on there forum about saftey!

If something is designed and works so that it is safer and still has the speed i will grow to like it if I dont already! Im glad that people are looking at safety in a good (endplates and co) because if we ever have another lemans '55 we will all be stuffed i feel because the media will just blow everything out of proportion for there own gain.

For an example there is a story going around about the TT. A family buys house on the tt course <lucky buggers!> and a poor rider dies doing what he loves to do. The marshalls do what they have to do. They put the poor fellow body in a bag and leave it in the family's garden till end of session. The media start mixing racing with mad sunday and saying that more of out "children" so to speak will die. What is our world coming to!

www.iomtt.com is there web sit look in the forums. The media sux

[cybersdorf]

Ah yes the good old days. Yawn.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool

Yes just to clarify, it is REAR endplates I'm talking about.

However further to my point about overboard safety regulations, I've been watching some of the Isle of Man TT racing these past few days and that has brought a smile to my face that somewhere in this world there is still some real gritty no-holds-barred racing going on. All be it on 2 wheels and not 4, although the 3 wheeled Motorbike Sidecar racing has been my favourite so far, superb!

Yes but who competes there any longer?

The Moto GP racers are long gone, now most of the top Superbike stars give the TT a miss.

The competitors tend to be road racing specialists and amateurs.

The race is too dangerous for a professional rider. Up until a few years ago you could have put forward a similar argument about Le mans.

Now, thankfully, the circuit and cars are much, much safer without losing too much of what makes the race special.

Theres was talk of building a purpose built circuit on the Isle of Man in order to attract Moto GP and Superbikes back. Theres the space to build an amazing, safe circuit, possibly including some of the more suitable public roads, as at Le mans.

Don't know what happened to the idea.

[krt917]

Originally Posted by gttouring

and one ugly aero bit that so many are guilty of from alfa to maclarenF1 and porsche's inbetween, is the 'long tail' variants of any sports car racer or GT eeesh them is ugly

Couldn't disagree more on that one! I've always liked the long tail approach (with the odd exception), from the 917 Langheck, through 'Moby Dick', to the McLaren F1 GTR.

Originally Posted by Nivola

For an example there is a story going around about the TT. A family buys house on the tt course <lucky buggers!> and a poor rider dies doing what he loves to do. The marshalls do what they have to do. They put the poor fellow body in a bag and leave it in the family's garden till end of session. The media start mixing racing with mad sunday and saying that more of out "children" so to speak will die. What is our world coming to!

I heard about this - if true, it's not the fact that the guy died that is the issue, so much as the appalling decision to leave him in the family's garden. Frankly, that sounds disrespectful to the rider and to the family.

As for the endplates, they're not that attractive but they aren't the worst additions to a racing car I've ever seen (X-wings, anyone). Pretty soon, everyone will get used to them...

[Laurent]

IMO, the biggest problem is the very short rear overhang, and not the endplate. The long tails are dead...

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by cybersdorf

Ah yes the good old days. Yawn.

As compared to todays fine oh sorry snoozed, ah, yes todays fine -snooooore...

Bob

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by Nivola

flat12-aircool dont talk safty about the TT. People are going nutts on there forum about saftey!

If something is designed and works so that it is safer and still has the speed i will grow to like it if I dont already! Im glad that people are looking at safety in a good (endplates and co) because if we ever have another lemans '55 we will all be stuffed i feel because the media will just blow everything out of proportion for there own gain.

For an example there is a story going around about the TT. A family buys house on the tt course <lucky buggers!> and a poor rider dies doing what he loves to do. The marshalls do what they have to do. They put the poor fellow body in a bag and leave it in the family's garden till end of session. The media start mixing racing with mad sunday and saying that more of out "children" so to speak will die. What is our world coming to!

www.iomtt.com is there web sit look in the forums. The media sux

I read the, and have been reading TT sites for years, the people who complained recently moved into the house for "race viewing", it is against the law to move a body until the coroner gets there etc.

It seems to be newbies who are whining, at least as many posts say the safety cry is BS, as safety IS addressed at the track.

Sadly with the death of the F-1 class the super fast race specials will not appear anymore, GP bikes had bee readmitted a few year back, so it had become a class with unique status.

It is not addressed in the chicken-little manners that is becoming a cancer in racing and has made the LeMans track, a farce compared to what is once was, but so also is the manner in which the race is run.

Eventually, barring a major war which puts death in a new perspective, the chicken-littles will probably be the norm, but until then enjoy the few remaining competitions which are a test of skill, and will.

Bob