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18 Oct 2008, 09:57 (Ref:2315181) | #1 | |
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-help- Ferrari are cheaters
Hello i started to watch f1 last year and read that ferrari are cheaters and michael please can you tell me some informations about them ? when ? what GP?
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18 Oct 2008, 10:07 (Ref:2315190) | #2 | |
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Well, when people refer to Michael Schumacher as a cheat they're usually referring to controversial incidents at Adelaide 1994, Jerez 1997 & Monaco 2006.
When people refer to Ferrari as cheats, it's usually due to a perceived collusion between them and the FIA, prompted by bizarre penalties issued to their close rivals, such as Alonso's grid penalty at Monza 2006 and Hamilton's penalties at Spa and Fuji in 2008. |
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18 Oct 2008, 10:11 (Ref:2315192) | #3 | ||
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And the movable floors at the start of last year, Super Hans. They removed them after Australia (?) though.
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18 Oct 2008, 10:12 (Ref:2315193) | #4 | |
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I wasn't aware that it was Ferrari that were cheating.
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18 Oct 2008, 11:13 (Ref:2315223) | #5 | |||
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18 Oct 2008, 13:41 (Ref:2315270) | #6 | ||
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Sure they are cheaters, otherwise they wouldn't be so dominant.
TGF in 1994 was driving a Renault, and the cheater was Briatore with the consent of one Bernie... but that must be forgotten like many other cheats perpetrated by other teams. Don't lose your perspective that F1 is a fair game. |
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18 Oct 2008, 20:23 (Ref:2315456) | #7 | ||
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Ferrari are cheaters, McLaren are cheaters, Renault are cheaters with Flav.
I guess that means BMW are the true top team on the grid |
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18 Oct 2008, 20:49 (Ref:2315466) | #8 | |||
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There is a difference between cheating and working with the rules as they are presently set out. ******* With regards the moveable floor thing, well, the FIA had passed that same floor as legal. Mclaren were only able to protest it because they had the Ferrari team's drawings of it in the first place. |
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18 Oct 2008, 21:07 (Ref:2315474) | #9 | |||
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I started watching F1 in the 1960's and no one has ever cheated until 1994, not once. Ever. Not even the time the guy from McLaren (I think it was) got locked in the Ferrari transporter when he lost his way to the loo...but that was not cheating! |
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"He's still a young guy and I always think, slightly morbidly, the last thing you learn is how to die and at the end of the day everybody learns every single day." - The Ever-Cheerfull Ron Dennis on Lewis Hamilton. |
18 Oct 2008, 22:21 (Ref:2315504) | #10 | ||
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Water tanks, allegedly for cooling purposes, but strangely only filled after the race... that would be Tyrrel, one of my faves team.
The (in)famous fan car - not car for fans to drive - of one win and then banned, that would be Brabham, another big fave of my mine. Led pellets, injected with the fuel in the last pitstop to add weight to the car to meet the after race requirements, that would be Benetton. That was not cheating then, just being smart... is that would be cheating now ? |
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18 Oct 2008, 23:44 (Ref:2315529) | #11 | |
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Michael Schumacher drove a Benetton Ford in 1994 and you could argue that the incident at Adelaide was not to dissimilar the incident involving Massa and Hamilton in Fuji, witch resulted in a drive through penalty. As far as I’m concern, and the Benetton legality aside, witch is nothing to do with Schumacher just as Alonso and Hamilton were found to be not responsible for McLaren misgivings last year, I felt that Schumacher was by no means gifted the 1994 World Drivers Championship.
Schumacher was disqualified from first place of the 1994 British Grand Prix for overtaking Hill on the parade lap, before he was let back through in time for the start. He was disqualified from the race result for "failing to maintain position" and Benetton were fined $25,000(I think the fine and subsiquent 2 race ban given on appeal was for not serving a 10 second stop go during the race). He was disqualified from his victory at the ’94 Belgian Grand Prix due to excessive wear on his Benetton's skid block, indicating the car's ride height was too low and giving the car an illegal aerodynamic advantage. The race officals would not accept the excessive wear had been caused by a spin at Pouhon on lap 19 which caused the floor to run over the kerbing on the outside of the corner. To quote Niki Lauda “Worst disision in F1 history”. So effectivley Schumacher was stripped of 20 points plus two races. Hill had no right to win the world championship in 1994 and you would have to be blind to think that Schumacher was not the most desurving winner of the ’94 Drivers Championship. Had a cirtain British driver in a Britsh team been treated this way there would be a massive outrage and conspiracy theories all over the net. Ooh, that’s what’s happening this year… 25 Seconds was not added to Schumachers 98 British GP Victory as he served his drive through penalty within the required number of laps. Teams can not be penalised for competing within the rules laid out by the governing body. It’s up the FIA to be smarter when writing the rules. Rant over. |
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18 Oct 2008, 23:50 (Ref:2315533) | #12 | ||
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"I know they're cheating... because I'm cheating and they're beating me!"
Racing, you gotta love it. Chris |
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19 Oct 2008, 02:16 (Ref:2315578) | #13 | |||
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"He's still a young guy and I always think, slightly morbidly, the last thing you learn is how to die and at the end of the day everybody learns every single day." - The Ever-Cheerfull Ron Dennis on Lewis Hamilton. |
19 Oct 2008, 03:58 (Ref:2315602) | #14 | ||
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Indeed. The design itself was perfectly alright. It was the team's declarations and actions with the fluids that was their problem.
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"The world is my country, and science is my religion." - Christian Huygens: 17th century Dutch astronomer. |
19 Oct 2008, 04:12 (Ref:2315604) | #15 | ||
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NO, the FIA give penalties to the other teams so that when Ferrari beats them they will have an excuse....
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19 Oct 2008, 04:15 (Ref:2315605) | #16 | |||
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Cleared up ......... carry on |
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19 Oct 2008, 08:24 (Ref:2315663) | #17 | ||
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Thanks Marcus... like they say... It was all about Briatore.
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19 Oct 2008, 08:58 (Ref:2315691) | #18 | |||||
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Going from my admittedly poor memory:
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Many teams had these tanks for brake cooling and would empty them as soon as the race started only to re fill them at race end (see below). Quote:
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19 Oct 2008, 09:00 (Ref:2315695) | #19 | ||
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Thanks, Peter !
I was a kid back there, that was an adult issue... |
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19 Oct 2008, 09:10 (Ref:2315709) | #20 | |||
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Brum brum |
19 Oct 2008, 21:47 (Ref:2316245) | #21 | ||
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Off course Ferrari, and McLaren and all the other teams are trying to see how far they can go within the rules or outside them.
Is that cheating? Depends on your definition. In any case, Ferrari is usually better at it than the rest. |
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19 Oct 2008, 21:49 (Ref:2316248) | #22 | ||
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That makes me see red...
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20 Oct 2008, 09:43 (Ref:2316520) | #23 | ||
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what's the smilie for opening a can of worms?!?!
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20 Oct 2008, 09:48 (Ref:2316523) | #24 | ||
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20 Oct 2008, 11:00 (Ref:2316584) | #25 | ||||
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Traction control that 'they didn't use' and so on.... If last year McLaren was found to have (done) anything similar to theese, the team would have been fined 1 billion dollars ($ 1,000,000,000.00) and Ron Dennis personally would have been forbidden to get near anything under FIA's authority for life! I even didn't get to Adelaide, and you call that deserving... Now, that is a rant! |
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Let it be |
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