Honda admit they need upgrade

Champions · 5 Mar 2007, 09:58 (Ref:1858767)

Honda admits it failed in designing a competitive car and plans a major upgrade for Sepang.

Their tech director says they especially lack quali pace.

http://freshf1.wordpress.com/2007/03...malayesian-gp/

Intresting point on the BMW "non-2007" wing they used in testing...

Dudley · 5 Mar 2007, 12:48 (Ref:1858890)

Everyone needs an upgrade except whoever is quickest.

Marbot · 5 Mar 2007, 12:58 (Ref:1858900)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dudley

Everyone needs an upgrade except whoever is quickest.

You don't stay the quickest by not upgrading.

BootsOntheSide · 5 Mar 2007, 13:27 (Ref:1858915)

It was already pretty clear that Honda were struggling to live up to what they did near the end of last year, so this doesn't come as a huge surprise. I wonder if it's a coincidence that they haven't homoglated an engine yet - perhaps they're targeting a sneak upgrade there as well?

The engine freeze doesn't help them here - it's one less thing they can improve, so extra spending is going to be needed to eke more performance out of other areas.

Glen · 5 Mar 2007, 14:11 (Ref:1858942)

Funny how you read a press release like that and take it at face value - but when you think about it, it is nonsense. They can't wave a magic wand and put loads of performance into the car before Sepang - if that were possible they would already know what these features were and they would be part of the original design. The best they can manage is to learn from testing and gradually find a tenth here and a teenth there and thereby make forward progress - which is exactly what the other teams will all be doing. I notice Honda tries to suggest that the '07 car is so radical that it has more "headroom" for improvements than their rivals - hmm - believe it when I see it.

Sodemo · 5 Mar 2007, 18:55 (Ref:1859108)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Champions

Intresting point on the BMW "non-2007" wing they used in testing...

This I don't understand, have the wing regulations been changed since 06'?

Does he mean the use of the spacers in the rear wing?

f1manoz · 5 Mar 2007, 19:43 (Ref:1859132)

Haven't even started the season and Honda are already saying they are rubbish!?!?

Another wasted season for Mr. Button then.

SennaTheGreat · 5 Mar 2007, 20:17 (Ref:1859161)

Quote:

Originally Posted by f1manoz

Haven't even started the season and Honda are already saying they are rubbish!?!?

Another wasted season for Mr. Button then.

Like always at the moment, BAR/Honda went down hill after 2004!!

Davhut · 5 Mar 2007, 21:39 (Ref:1859202)

I hope Button and his managers are exploring options beyond Honda. I think as a driver he's "there," unfortunately the car never has been.

D-Angle · 6 Mar 2007, 00:37 (Ref:1859314)

Unless it's all a cunning ruse to lull the opposition into a false sense of security...

"Ah, we can ignore Honda, slow car with a crappy eco-nonsense livery..."

Cue them turning up in Oz with a fire-breathing rocketship sponsored by British Nuclear Fuels and Glock Firearms!

neilap · 6 Mar 2007, 01:21 (Ref:1859330)

Its bad news that the car is lacking. Its not a motor issue. The motor has been homologated a long time ago, or so I thought. There is no game.
However, it is good that they have what may be a solution so soon. There are teams like Toyota, Renault, Red Bull that are still wondering what is going on. Honda has for the first time utilized a full scale wind tunnel to build their racer. The engineers are still learning. The reason Honda says they have more room for improvement is that they have a car responds better to tuning than any they have had thus far. They did not say they had a car that is capable of improving more than others just more than their previous cars. However, Nakamoto has made it clear that they intend to develop at such a rapid pace that winning races is definitely their intent this year and that they want their rivals to be shocked by their progress.
The team is very open with its intentions. They may not all materialize but we all know where they intend to go.
There are some other teams that intentionally understate things to save face just in case...

Also, its only the first race of the season and people are already writing the team off. I would not do that.

neilap · 6 Mar 2007, 01:21 (Ref:1859331)

. pls delete. Double post.

FPV GTHO · 6 Mar 2007, 03:01 (Ref:1859357)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen

if that were possible they would already know what these features were and they would be part of the original design.

Not necessarily. They may have rushed the new car into testing to get a better baseline for further upgrades, or theyve found faults to which they know how to fix. Red Bull for example will only have its full aero package this week, as the RB3 was rushed into testing after a later than planned start in the windtunnel.

Gt_R · 6 Mar 2007, 05:36 (Ref:1859519)

Not a big issue. Last season, Honda was good in testing, terrible in the start of the season, and manage to up their performance to a competitive level in the last 1/3 of the season.

I'm just disappointed that they couldn't maintain that momentum.

I sure hope that Honda could deliver and come up with solutions in time for the Sepang race. The pre-season testing so far should give Honda a good idea of where they are not good at, and in F1, solutions are produced fast. (how teams could copy new parts in a matter of a week). Honda fans can only wish that the car will respond to these upgrades, and is not a fundamental flaw in the overall design.

Lets see how it goes.

Fish_Flake · 6 Mar 2007, 07:53 (Ref:1859560)

A team is acknowledging the shortcomings of its design and taking the steps needed to further its development. Where's the big news here?

Knowlesy · 6 Mar 2007, 17:40 (Ref:1859948)

There isn't any, particularly as this is Honda.

lovebritF3 · 6 Mar 2007, 22:40 (Ref:1860162)

they need an better livery! what is that about, f1 is great but why are the promoting eco stuff when they are racing around tracks ultimately for fun usi ng all the fuel they do. surely they could of come up with a better design to get peoples attention than a map, its going to look rubbish on tv i think

Glen · 8 Mar 2007, 12:51 (Ref:1861418)

Rubens reckons they are in the top ten. I should hope so!

I guess he means top ten places on the grid, not top ten teams. Even so, behind Ferrari, McLaren, Renault and BMW at the very least, plus Williams might surprise and maybe Red Bull... Honda are going to struggle to get points at all for a while.

Marbot · 8 Mar 2007, 13:50 (Ref:1861467)

Rubens reckons they'll be 6th to 10th on the grid.

**Peter Mallett** · 8 Mar 2007, 14:04 (Ref:1861480)

Well at least one car will be that far up. What about him though?

DSM · 8 Mar 2007, 14:21 (Ref:1861487)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Well at least one car will be that far up. What about him though?

Well, now that they have Conway on board, perhaps things will get better!

Marbot · 8 Mar 2007, 15:41 (Ref:1861532)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Well at least one car will be that far up. What about him though?

With Ferrari,Mclaren,Renault,BMW and even Williams seemingly ahead of them,it's hard to imagine either Honda driver getting through to Q3!

Knowlesy · 8 Mar 2007, 17:23 (Ref:1861615)

I'd have to concur with that.

Tough times again at Honda. They could do with a Ross Brawn....hmmm, now there's a thought.

Marbot · 8 Mar 2007, 19:59 (Ref:1861704)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

They could do with a Ross Brawn....hmmm, now there's a thought.

He said he would only return to Ferrari........hmmmm,maybe if they painted their cars red.......that would have to be one hell of a forest fire!

Knowlesy · 8 Mar 2007, 20:53 (Ref:1861757)

The rumours of a switch to Honda are persistent enough to make me suspect he wouldn't only go back to Ferrari. I'd imagine he's considering his options.

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