Best races of 80's and 90's

[[Kona]]

Maybe a common forum question, but I haven't seen it in ANY of the ChampCar forums online. I'm looking to buy some of the great IndyCar and CART races of the 80's and first half of the 90's.

So what are some of the most memorable and exciting races of that period???

[rookie]

the 1992 Indy 500

[ASCII Man]

1995 Indy 500

[macdaddy]

1993 Cleveland.
1995, 2000, 2001 Michigan.
1997 Vancouver.
2003 Germany.
What year was the 3-way finish in Portland?

[Dov]

I believe the 3-way finish in Portland was in '97.....

[Snrub]

Germany 2003 sucked, don't listen to them!

My brain is degenerating at an alarming rate so I can't remember the exact years:
Tracy's win from the back at Elkhart.
Andretti's win from the back at TO.
Pretty much anything from 1999-2001 was incredibly good.

Question for you: How and where are you going to buy these race tapes?

[macdaddy]

Good question, Snrub. I've tried to contact ABC in the past, to no avail.

"My brain is degenerating at an alarming rate..."
We're gonna have to team up for a beer sometime soon.
Just to reminise about things we can't remember!

[Snrub]

Well I don't drink, but something like that is not a bad idea.

Another one I really enjoyed was the Moore vs. Zanardi battle @ Brazil (?) in 1998. Reason it was such a good battle was that I really hated Zanardi due to his reckless/bullying driving back then and I thought Moore was CART's best driver at the time. (other than Montoya I still think he's the best driver since I started watching in '94-95)

[macdaddy]

I'll go to my grave mumbling that Z-Man was the most naturally-talented driver to ever strap into a ChampCar.

And then I'll ask you to pass me your drink, seeing as you're not enjoying it!

[Jordi]

I'll go to mine thinking that ever since Greg left us, things have gone wrong. There was some kind of aura with him, and just after 1999, CART started to go slowly down...

[boom boom]

Any race with Z of course. But the one that comes to my mind now, is the first race in 93 at Surfers. Mikey(Mario's kid) back from F1 won first time back for Chip G in Reynards debut race. I saw it on TV, and it was memrable for me anyways. From rain to sun in the drop of a hat and hearing the rain tires hum so loud as they all went back to the pits for slicks, and then when it rained again how they all spun or went off track before they could go in for rain tyres. Micheal was launching off the curbs all day, and Nigel was on fire and I still smile as he would spin in the rain and out of anger he would give it to much gas to get back on and spin again( i think he need a push once to restart his engine), he would make mistakes and then get back towards the front... but in the end to no avail. And as the day got shorter and darker they called the race a little early, but not after many laps where you could see the glow of the brakes and the glow out of the exhuast. I just remeber so many things happening in that race from one extreme to the other, one of my many favorites

[boom boom]

In person it is Alex wining in Elkhart in 97, I waited for 2 or 3 hours in the rain for that race to start ( and it was worht it).
Alex's race in 98 at elkhart was awsome too, even though it was for a 2nd place finnish. He would be in the back then up front, then in back again and then right back up through the field to the front again.
Also JPM at elkhart in 99 and 00. Alex and JPM in those 4 years could pass people at will (yes I know they had the best cars) on that track .... I am smiling just thinking of it. Those 2 guys were just really something special in a champ car

[jhansen]

The year is not coming to me, but there was a very close finish between Mario and Son at Portland. I'm pretty sure it was the mid to late 80's. That was great, as far as finishes go.

[macdaddy]

boom... I watched 'em all, and Juan was a special thing, but he never really did impress me as much as Alessandro did. Juan could win from the front, but only Z-Man could win from the rear.

More than once.

[boom boom]

Speaking of Mario and Son I always loved the Indy 500 where they passed (dont know who it was) right on the top and bottom of someone with not to much room to spare at the same time. Wow!
And speaking of the 500 I enjoyed the spin and win in 85 (was it?) with Danny sullivan.
and of coures Laguna Seca: The pass!! what year was that, 97?
Too many great races, not enough memory in my poor little head

[boom boom]

You are Correct Macdaddy, Alex did have the better form at elkhart. JPM did do some passing, but nothing like Alex Z. Alex amazed me greatly, as those were the first 2 races (97&98 at elkhart)I saw in person. Amazing track amazing driver.

[macdaddy]

"Mario and Son"
"Mario's grandsons's father" (MGF)

Love it.


(By-the-way, editted due to spelling!)

[boom boom]

MGF
I like it Macdaddy

[racerkeke]

May I suggest you expand your horizons and see if you can find a copy of the first Indy Lights race at Michigan Speedway -- it would have been 1996 or 1997, I think. Especially worth it would be a copy of the "director's cut", which I have seen but do not own myself. Of course, I must admit I was there, so I remember it pretty well!

If you ever thought oval racing was boring, this should change your mind. Green all the way, and a HUGE pack running within inches of each other and getting tows that could slingshot a car from mid-pack to the front like nobody's business.

I only like this one better than the first Handford Device CART race at Michigan because it was easier to hold my breath for 50 laps than 250.

Remember that CART had to sign special waivers with Lola for this race because Lola was not convinced the Indy Lights chassis could stand up to superspeedway impacts.

keke

[Mags]

A tie for me. The Atlantics race in Fontana 2001 (for those of you there.. can you EVER forget the way those number 1-2 cars were on top of each other??) Sorry that isn't within the topic boundaries.. 2 years shy.

Absolutly Alessandro doing those laps in Germany in 2003 (sorry.. NOT within the limits of your question, again!!)

But for me, Michigan 2001 was THE race. Patrick winning, and because Tags came to the rescue...he had been searching for his first win in CART, and that one was SWEET!

NOW, to answer your question as you wish.

Greg Moore's win in Homestead in 1999. #99 in 99, is how he answered my e mail. DRAT, that hurts to even think about.

And his Tokyo race where he crossed the finish line backwards!!

RIP Greg. DRAT, I wish he could have gone to F1 and kicked TGF's butt!!!

[Snrub]

When Zanardi had his first stint in CART much of his success was from driving like a nut. He drove increbibly aggressively and was simply lucky not to crash more often. He got a lot of passes not nessissarly because he was that much faster, but because drivers let him through to avoid an accident. It's not the way to pass.

The one race at Elkhart where he bounded off track and later nearly killed Andretti was the culmination of all of this. I knew it something like that would happen and it was only a matter of time. Before the accident I would have almost wished that something would happen so Zanardi would wake up.

Montoyta's skill is his freakish reaction time which allows him to react to the car far faster than normal and do things that are contrary to what is generally accepted in racing. He didn't have the luck of Zanardi (In Zanardi's record season he often had great luck with competitiors DNFing, while JPM DNFed a lot and I don't know that it was ever his fault), but I think it's an easy sell to say that JPM's performance far surpassed Zanardi's, despite the obvious points discrepency.

[[Kona]]

Yeah Zanardi was a maniac in CART while with Ganassi, but after he went to F1 then returned, he seemed to grow up a bit. Of course he didn't return to a championship winning car, but the Zanardi of 96/97/98 was his peak, and most dangerous. It still puzzles me why he did so poorly in F1 alongside Ralf, who doesn't have the raw speed of Zanardi. Zanardi had F1 experience and knew the tracks, but maybe he takes a while to get into a new team and car, like in 96 it wasn't till the second half of the year that he found speed.

That close Andretti finish might have been Cleveland 1988, Mario won marginally in front of Michael after a big battle.

There are alot of great races at Michigan. I remember Kanaan's comeback from 2 laps down was a great one in 99. And Carpentier's win was exciting.

In answer to where I'm getting these races, I know a guy who sells them for about US$12 each (free shipping), and he's got almost every F1 and Indycar/Cart etc race from 1984, and every IRL race since 1996. They're all on VHS, and the quality is average (recorded straight from TV with ads cut out) but I've only been watching racing since 1995, so it's worth it to see some older classics. Email me at alkali@ihug.co.nz if your interested and I'll give you his details.

[Mags]

Originally posted by [Kona]
Yeah Zanardi was a maniac in CART while with Ganassi, but after he went to F1 then returned, he seemed to grow up a bit. Of course he didn't return to a championship winning car, but the Zanardi of 96/97/98 was his peak, and most dangerous. It still puzzles me why he did so poorly in F1 alongside Ralf, who doesn't have the raw speed of Zanardi. Zanardi had F1 experience and knew the tracks, but maybe he takes a while to get into a new team and car, like in 96 it wasn't till the second half of the year that he found speed.

When I interviewed him in 2001, he said it was the set up of the car and the changes that had happened since he had left; he had got so used to the CHAMP car style and the handling, it was tough for him. And remember, they don't do a lot of thier own testing if F1, so it was like a step backwards in a way. But I think it was also that he missed the teamwork and he missed Jimmy and the happiness that he had in CART. F1 is a dark pit. There isn't the family type feeling at Williams that there was at Target (although I'll argue it was Alessandro that brought it there, it sure wasn't Chip)

[Hazza]

Its probably been mentioned but the race where Zman won at (Long Beach?) after getting 2 drive throughs...

Oh, Boom-Boom, the first Indy-300 was in 93, but this guy called nigel won on his first attempt, not MGF. 94 is what you are thinking about

[Omega99]

I think I remember hearing of the legendary Andretti-Andretti finish in the preamble on TV before a race at Portland a couple of years back. The commentators were going through and showing highlights of all of the close finishes at Portland. Michael had pulled a lap ahead of the rest of the field, with Mario running second, but a miscalculated fuel startegy meant Michael had to slow down to conserve fuel in the dying stages of the race, which allowed Mario to close the gap and there was a final lap shootout that Mario ultimately won by a hair. After the race Michael said something to the effect of "This actually works out because today is Father's Day and I forgot to get him a present, so happy Father's Day Dad." Does that offer any help? I could be completely wrong, but I'll try to find a year to go along with it.

Editted to Add:
http://www.cart.com/Results/ResultsIndex.asp?ID=263
1986 appears to be the year I'm talking about. Mario won by 0.070 seconds.