Radical LMP1?

[DanJR1]

any idea if or when this could happen?

[Graham Goodwin]

Somebody has to pay for it and at the moment nobody appears to want to do that

[juicy sushi]

has the SR9 been a sound move for radical? i love the car and am very happy to see it on the grid, but how many have they sold exactly, and how close is this program to breaking even (or has it passed that point)?

i ask this in all innocence as i'm happy that a new manufacturer emerged for LMP's, and they seem to be pretty competent so i'd be rather unhappy if things didn't work out for them after their hard work...

[Fogelhund]

I don't think they've sold near the cars that they were hoping to. What three cars sold, plus maybe the factory car. The chassis appears to be a very competent privateer car, and cost effective too. Shame in some ways that Porsche and Acura came along, and eliminated their market in P2 in the ALMS.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Shame in some ways that Porsche and Acura came along, and eliminated their market in P2 in the ALMS.

Although, I perceive the car to be only the third best LMP2 in Europe, also.

[SebringMG]

Yes - you would have to say it is slower than the Zytek, although on a par with the Lola!!

[broadrun96]

Are Porsche and Acura in to keep making LMP2 customer chassis or will they keep supplying after moving on? Just thinking Radical could have a shot to be the option to Zyteck or Lola if the other 2 get out. plus with the new proposed rules working on the chassis could help them by 2010 if the ACO pushes big manufacturers out of LMP2. The new rules could hurt their LMP1/LMPGTP (whatever the ACO calls it) chances without having a manufacturer engine supplier to work with. Would hate to miss out on them, personally think its the best looking proto in the field.

[SALEEN S7R]

Originally Posted by SebringMG

Yes - you would have to say it is slower than the Zytek, although on a par with the Lola!!

On a par with some of the Lola's maybe, but is that more down to the teams than the actual cars themselves? RML are the class of the field at the moment in LMP2 in the LMS, IMO. The ASM car isnt going badly either.

[SebringMG]

Originally Posted by SALEEN S7R

On a par with some of the Lola's maybe, but is that more down to the teams than the actual cars themselves? RML are the class of the field at the moment in LMP2 in the LMS, IMO. The ASM car isnt going badly either.

Bit of both i would say - the Radical has gone backwards imo since rollcentre left although it looks like Embassy 'may' be getting the hang of theres. Given a team of RML or ASMs class running a radical i would think it would still be as quick as the Lola.....potentially quicker maybe ?

[isynge]

As others have said, so much is down to the team running any prototype. I think the Radical's inherently got the fundamentals rights, so put in the hands of a team that really is on top of its game (and no disrespect is meant to those currently running Radicals) such as RML and I think you'd see it contending with the best of the Lolas and the Zytek. The fact that it's a podium contender in the LMS says there's not a whole lot wrong with the car.

As far as profit is concerned, I'd be interested in what the balance between sticker price on the chassis and the support contract was in terms of where you make your money on a customer racing car. In aerospace I've heard it said that you'll make at least as much out of follow on services as you will out of the initial sale, and in software earning 20% per annum on support is certainly not unheard of. In this light you may not have to sell all that many cars to make it worthwhile, especially in an era when you could comfortably expect to get 3 or 4 years competitive front line running out of them, then with any luck some longer tail of revenue from the historic market.

[ThePenguin]

There is an older article on Radical's website about the possibility of them manufacturing an LMP1 coupe. There are also pictures of what it could look like.

http://www.radicalsportscars.com/ran...tent/index.php

[Zurbert82]

van der Steur have been surprisingly competetive with their Radical SR9. This has gone largely un noticed, but they finished the Northeast Grand Prix in the top 10. They were lapping ahead of the B-K Mazda during the first half hour of the Northeast Grand Prix. Having a driver like Adam Pecorari helps a bit as well. Keep in mind this team was the slowest of the old LMP2 generation with their Lola B2K/40, but their recent performance is a testament to the brilliant design and value of the Radical SR9. I realize this thread is about a potential Radical SR9 LMP1 so don't mind the topic meandering

[Jed Maxwell]

I disagree, how can you say the Radical has gone backwards? I think the overall level of speed in LMP2 has increased immensly. The only circuit so far that the 2006 and 2007 visited is Nurburgring. (Its worth bearing in mind here the restrictor change to a dimensionally smaller restrictor for 2007).

Comparing qualifying times:
Rollcentre Radical 2006 = 1.48.250 (Joao Barbosa)
Embassy Racing 2007 = 1.48.141 ( Warren Hughes)

Bruichladdich 2006 = 1.48.6
Bruichladdich 2007 = 1.46.9 ( Both with Stuart Moseley )

Pole for 2006 = 1.46.6
Pole for 2007 = 1.45.4

In the hands of "Radical" themselves (AER Turbo) they had only had the car 1 week prior to this meeting in 2006 so the pace shown was quite raw, hence the larger gain in lap time. Difference in 2006 to pole was 2.0 secs, and in 2007 was 1.5 secs. I'd say that isn't a step backwards. Nurburgring was Embassys first real race with the car after their durability test in the UK and showed great promise until a small pit fire slowed their progress. They were 2nd at the time making inroads into Mike Newtons lead! I don't think they would have ended up there but a podium was still well on the cards.
We all know that the Judd in the back of Rollcentre and Embassys car is always more of a race engine then a qualifier so will always look better in the race than in qualifying. Also it is worth mentioning that Nurburgring is some 2000ft above sea level which benefits the turbo cars more than the N/A engines. Hence the large difference between the works car and Embassys car.
Race pace was hindered for both cars by the fact that the Dunlop tyre likes to run on other peoples rubber! So going off line to pass slower cars meant that they had massive pickup and took a long time for the tyres to clean up. The RML car (which Tommy Erdos said that is one of their strongest races ever) didnt lose anywhere near the amount of time that the Dunlop cars lost in traffic which is a testiment to the Michelins. Wouldn'tit be interesting to see a Michelin Radical out there!

To sum all this up, I think the Radical is now nearer the end of its "on track" aerodynamic development (without ever going to a wind tunnel for downforce development ((Peter Elleray never had the time in the project, so good guess work!!)), the previous visit by Radical themselves were only to validate and develop cooling ) so will loose ground to the Zytek inpartcular but also the Lola due to there vast resources with a windtunnel and so many teams running them.

Embassy did great things at Nurburgring to get the car to a competitive 2nd so lets see them go now after they completed their first race, good luck to them!

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Jed Maxwell

Embassy did great things at Nurburgring to get the car to a competitive 2nd so lets see them go now after they completed their first race, good luck to them!

I have high hopes for Embassy. I was somewhat confused by their decision to go the Pilbeam route. I'm sure they had their reasons, but they're not immediately evident. I'd like to see them ditch the Pilbeam altogether and continue with Radical next season (and beyond). By the end of 2006 Rollcentre were on the verge of making the Judd powered Radical a race winning package, Embassy should continue where Shorty left off. I genuinely believe that elusive first win for the car is close.

Anyway, I digress, the thread title would suggest I'm risking a reprimand!

[thereal_tdb]

the prices radical charge for cheap sub standard parts with no warranty even when new fully built driveshafts come with no grease in, would suggest that there is plenty of funds for whatever the company owners next racing dream is, to be funded

[minimangler]

As regards LMP2 heirachy, they were definitely getting toward best last year but Shorty pulled out
Lola are top dog, Zytek equal 2nd with Radical, as each has their strengths. I think perhaps the Zytek needs more work (as does the Radical, and probably the Lola) on reliability, but apart from that I'd say it COULD be even, it just isn't yet.