Prosport LM3000

[Carsten]

Hiya,
I am new to the forum and hopefully a 1992 race car qualifies for this forum.
I want to know if anybody used to race these cars. I am currently rebuilding one to run as a trackday car so would like to hear from ex-owners or engineers who worked on them. I beleive I have the ex Chris Lord car and would love to locate him for a chat about it or even some pics of the car racing.

I basically have a billion bits with no instructions so will have a hoot the next year rebuilding it.

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2778...38875285nXZLvm

Thanks in advance

[Al Weyman]

Arn't they basically an Ultima? I remember I was on with them at Combe years ago and had a good look at them.

[greenamex2]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Arn't they basically an Ultima? I remember I was on with them at Combe years ago and had a good look at them.

Being from the same guy (Lee Noble) they look similar but underneath they are very different.

[Tim Wilkinson]

Funnily enough I was flicking through an old programme today and had left it open at a feature on the Prosport 3000 - a little about the car and a lap of Brands Indy in one with Tony King - who was one of only 5 entries, for a 25lap race. (this is from '92, btw). Decent prize money, too (a grand for a win) and the champion gets a new Prosport3000!

According to the article Prosport was run by Chris Taylor, and the car was designed by Arthur Griffin at Pro-Sport Engineering. There's a lot of talk about how this could be the return to a true sportscar and being a fixture in British racing for years to come, but not much hard technical info. The engines were race-tuned (by Cosworth) versions of the Ford FBA - aka the Grandad Scorpio V6 - giving approx 300bhp.

Drivers at that race were - Tony King, Mark Newman, Friedrich Glatz, Michael Millard and Klaas Zwart (doesn't he race Euroboss now, and has dabbled in F2?) entered by Techspeed racing. Mike Bletsoe-Brown, Eugene O'Brien and Peter Hardman are listed in the points-scorers, so must have been at one of the 3 previous rounds.

Cost was given at about 50k per car. And yes, they do look a bit like an Ultima. I've seen results for a race at Combe a little while later, and the numbers were better, but not by much.

Fastest lap that day was 45.29. Other fastest laps, as comparison, were Yvan Muller lapping in 38.93 in a Reynard 91D in the British F2 championship, and some bloke called Rod Birley doing a 47.77 in something called Thundersaloons.

[John Turner]

Welcome Carsten. There were a couple of LM3000s entered early on for this year's British GT series. Following issues over their eligibility raised by fellow competitors, despite their (contentious?) acceptability in previous seasons and an SRO 'fudged' compromise, they had pulled out before mid season. One of the drivers, who was pretty miffed, with some justification, actually posted on the GT forum but not sure he is still around, here. Might be worth looking either of these teams up; they might offer a bit of advice on the rebuild - you never know!

[Carsten]

Cheers guys!

Yep, I know one of the teams in question and apart from wanting to stay away from the politics, I have access to a fully buildt car and hopefully enough tech help.
I'd love to track somemore history on my car and am looking forward to getting stuck in with the project, and currently am doing research and getting bits ordered.

[Pete Stowe]

Originally Posted by Carsten

I'd love to track somemore history on my car and am looking forward to getting stuck in with the project, and currently am doing research and getting bits ordered.

Chris Lord in his ProSport/LM3000 was the outright winner of Special GT races at Castle Combe on the following occasions :
5-May-97
25-Aug-97
28-Mar-98
8-Aug-98
12-Sep-98
7-Oct-00

In 1998 he was the winner of Class A in the National Mobile Windscreens Castle Combe Special GT Championship.

During 97-98 he ran as #6. The programs of that time give his home town as Paignton. (He’s not been appearing in the CC Saloons championship though).

You could try Steve Clarke ( www.photodirectuk.com ) or John Gaisford (01225-743400) for photos

[Robin_D]

I saw that there was 2 for sale in Dailysportscar.com classifieds.

May be worth taking a look.

Cheers and Good luck.

[Randy]

I can't believe you put this thread in motorsport history Carston .

Would be interesting to trace back some of the cars histories though. Not too sure the origins of Simon's car prior to Bob Light either.

The Prosports certainly are a great little car although all the sentiments about the engines are fair, they are a bit of a tractor engine.

[Simon S]

Originally Posted by John Turner

Welcome Carsten. There were a couple of LM3000s entered early on for this year's British GT series. Following issues over their eligibility raised by fellow competitors, despite their (contentious?) acceptability in previous seasons and an SRO 'fudged' compromise, they had pulled out before mid season. One of the drivers, who was pretty miffed, with some justification, actually posted on the GT forum but not sure he is still around, here. Might be worth looking either of these teams up; they might offer a bit of advice on the rebuild - you never know!

Still here (despite the censorship )

[Lightning Bug]

Someone told me that they were at Snetterton the day the first ever Prosport race took place - there were only a few entries. The paddock announcer said: "Attention paddock, attention paddock. The Prosport drivers' briefing is about to take place. In the phone box!"

Not sure if it's true but love the story.

[greenamex2]

Originally Posted by Carsten

Hiya,
I am new to the forum and hopefully a 1992 race car qualifies for this forum.
I want to know if anybody used to race these cars. I am currently rebuilding one to run as a trackday car so would like to hear from ex-owners or engineers who worked on them. I beleive I have the ex Chris Lord car and would love to locate him for a chat about it or even some pics of the car racing.

I basically have a billion bits with no instructions so will have a hoot the next year rebuilding it.

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2778...38875285nXZLvm

Thanks in advance

If you get stuck on the engine side my engine builder built a lot of them so may be able to help. I can't give you his number but I could pass on your details.

Funnily enough one gets mentioned briefly in this months Circuit News.

[Carsten]

Thanks for the info so far, I am going in a different direction in terms of powerplant and using a modern, lighter engine that will have same bhp as the original spec. The FT200 box puts some limits on how wild I can go on Torque and my choice stays within that number.. but I will need to get a custom bellhousing made up alas.
The car also never came with the original ECU anyway, so figured I might as well upgrade it to an of-the-shelf reliable production engine, making it lighter in the process.

Nobody said it was going to be easy

[greenamex2]

Originally Posted by Carsten

Thanks for the info so far, I am going in a different direction in terms of powerplant and using a modern, lighter engine that will have same bhp as the original spec. The FT200 box puts some limits on how wild I can go on Torque and my choice stays within that number.. but I will need to get a custom bellhousing made up alas.
The car also never came with the original ECU anyway, so figured I might as well upgrade it to an of-the-shelf reliable production engine, making it lighter in the process.

Nobody said it was going to be easy

My engine builder reckoned the original V6 was good for 340BHP but after that the blocks started to break. With a custom made ali block it made over 390BHP and was a good deal lighter. And didn't break! There was talk about producing a batch of blocks but nobody could be bothered, the Jag and Nissan V6's are better engines anyway and come with 'free' ali blocks.

My Nissan V6 (if it ever gets finished) is essentially a copy of the LM3000 engine (same valves, compression, intake, exhaust etc). It's going to be interesting to see what effect 8+ years of progress in engine design has had.

[kelvin88]

Last time i saw Chris Lord he was doing the Castle Coombe GT championship. If he still has his Cosworth he might be doing the saloon series at Coombe. Must be someone here that knows.....?

[Thundersports]

Carsten Meurer? I think your car may be eligable for the Group C invitation class I have seen Michael Millards car out there, afriend tested on back in 1991ish and his thoughts were it lacked grunt so a more powerful engine would be advisable! I seem to remember the Brands Hatch group had some involvement at the start and put up the prize money, however I don't think the grids got above 10 cars.
The drivers teej mentined did compete in the cars; the late Euroboss, sometime F3000 driver Frederico Careca, Zwaart the Euroboss champion and the late Mark Newman who raced in British F3000. Tony Trimmer did a fair bit of development work for them in the cars early stages you can find him lurking around Brands Hatch racing school. Good uck.

[MikeHoyer]

Klaas Zwaart also owns the Ascari sportscar company, who's KZ1R's competed in some British GT events this year. I know at Silverstone at least they were on track with a Prosport.

It's an oddity in British GT really, didn't realise at first how old it was...

[fausto]

Hello! You can possibly find something about the Prosport 3000 here: http://tentenths.com/forum/search.php?searchid=244553
(can't guarantee there's something in every thread, though), I also remember a 10/10ths member worked as race engineer on Chris Lord car, if I'm able to make up my mind and remember who he is I'll let you know

[John Turner]

Ok guys, you know what comes next! How many were built and who were they originally delivered to?

[Carsten]

wow..great info there. I did the right thing joining this BBS.
Thanks for that !

I have heard numbers between 20-30 buildt in total but I could track down how many chassis were made but that doesnt equate to actual cars ( replacement chassis etc..)

I would really like to talk to Chis Lord if he is around though..

[Ian Sowman]

I only have programmes back to 1996 with me here - I am visiting the parents tomorrow so may peruse the previous ten years there.

But in 1996 the BRSCC Pro-Sport 3000 Championship visited Mallory Park on 11 August for a 22-lap race (then that would have been considered something of an endurance event by club standards!).

Sixteen cars entered and qualified in the following order:

Eugene O'Briene (De Wallens Racing), William Hewland (Hewland Engineering Motorsport), Michael Millard (Gold Center Jewellers), Nigel Greensall (Nigel Greensall Motorsport), Tom Reeve (HEM), David Jacklin (Mark Bailey Racing), Phillip Bullman, Nigel James, Barry Shaw, Kevin Sherwood, Phill Armour, Geoff Janes, Dave Brunsdon, Chris Gilbert, Chris Lord and Gene Gibson.

Unfortunately, I can't find in my archives the race report and results I produced for that one.

For the equivalent meeting on 7 September 1997, the entry was down to 11, but with one withdrawal. Millard, Gilbert, Brunsdon, Lord, Shaw, Tavo Hellmun (Mark Bailey Racing), James, Bob Light, Martin Harrison, Armour and John Lee were the entrants, although Brunsdon withdrew.

I have found my report on this meeting, but clearly the 25-lap ProSport 3000 race didn't make much of an impact as it didn't get a mention.

A few weeks later, on 26 October, the championship finale took place at Donington Park. There were 12 entries this time - John Barnard being the extra one. According to the points in the programme, Michael James had already wrapped up the title quite convincingly.

By 1998, for the Mallory Park meeting on 21 June, the championship had been re-named "BRSCC Sportscar LM3000/Protosport EVO 3 Championship". EIght cars entered the LM3000 class - Nigel James, Millard, Armour, Brunsdon, Gilbert, Barnard, Lee, Howard Spooner. Mat Howard entered the Protosport EVO 3 class (of which I have no recollection whatsoever!), but he withdrew. Nigel James took the win to extend his lead in the points.

Another change for 1999, to the "Open Sports Car Championship" - a title that would be revived for 2005 by the BARC with no success whatsoever. This time there was a nine car grid for a 30-minute race at Mallory Park on 3 May - six LM3000s for Millard, Brunsdon, Jonathan Jones, Armour, Lord and Spooner, as well as three Radicals in a separate class.

At the end of the year, on 17 October, the championship visited Donington. A few more LM3000s were out - 10 of them - with Harrison, Gilbert, Barnard and Lee the additions. Two Class B cars - a Mallock and a Phantom.

And that, as far as I can remember, was pretty much that...

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Ian Sowman

By 1998, for the Mallory Park meeting on 21 June, the championship had been re-named "BRSCC Sportscar LM3000/Protosport EVO 3 Championship". EIght cars entered the LM3000 class - Nigel James, Millard, Armour, Brunsdon, Gilbert, Barnard, Lee, Howard Spooner. Mat Howard entered the Protosport EVO 3 class (of which I have no recollection whatsoever!), but he withdrew. Nigel James took the win to extend his lead in the points.

...

The Protosport Evo 3 was an open topped version with, I think, a 2 litre Cosworth engine of some description. There was a yellow one for sale for quite a while recently on another web site!

This link shows a picture of one being sprinted:

http://www.ianhardy.net/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=609

I have seen that the recently ex British GT ProSport 3000s are currently for sale - £55K for the pair I think, with a shed load of spares.

[Lola]

I believe a guy called Dave Brunsden did try to revive the championship around 1998? Last time i heared of him he was i think in Tewksbury (went to look at a rf88 he was selling). Maybe try and get in contact with him as he seemed very enthusiatic about the Pro-sport concept.

[greenamex2]

Oh yeah, and these guys do spare for LM3000's -

http://www.lynxae.co.uk/

I think they were involved in racing them.

[Ian Sowman]

I found a couple of older programmes today.

I think 1992 may have been year one for the Prosport 3000s. At Mallory on 21 June there was a race for the Prosport 3000 Championship and Midsports Trophy over 25 laps. Just six cars were entered in the Prosport class, for Eugene O'Brien, Friedrich Glatz, Mike Millard, M. Newman, Peter Hardman and Klaas Zwart. Hardman beat Glatz and O'Brien, establishing the lap record at 44.44s (109.46mph). The Midsports entry comprised Mike Wrigley (Bennett B16), Ian Flux (Chevron B8 - he finished fifth overall), Murray Lewis (Sutol 23B - presumably some kind of Lotus replica) and George Douglas (Ginetta G12).

Things were little better on 30 August 1993, with seven cars entered in the Prosport class, with Class B of the championship now being for Sports 2000 (Richard Casswell's Shrike P15, Glenn Dudley's T87/90 and Andy Storer's Chevron B52 being the three entrants). In the main class, Hardman, Millard and Zwart were now joined by Thorkild Thyrring, Paul Gibson, C. Taylor and Matt Aitken. I don't have results, but Hardman started from pole and was leading the championship.

I don't see a good reason why this isn't called the 'Anorak Forum', you know...