Tell me this is a joke!

Dov · 6 Jan 2004, 20:57 (Ref:829834)

From another forum.....it can't be true.....it just can't!!! http://www.terra.com.mx/Cart/articulo/123742/

05/01/2004 Notimex.-Indianapolis. - Open Wheel Racing Series, propietary future of series CART, initiated talks with Tony George, owner of Indy Racing League (IRL), to fuse both categories as of the next season. In the middle of a legal process to take possession from the Champ Cars, which will take all this month, the company Open Wheel has glided to be united to the IRL, that from 1996 has been their main rival and who now enjoys an attractive financial situation. The initial idea, according to Paul Gentilozzi, partner of Open Wheel, will be to conform a calendar of 20 dates, 10 of which they will be made in ovals, where the IRL runs exclusively, and the other 10 in mixed circuits, is to say street, temporary and permanent. "we already talked with Tony (George), this it is the best moment (for the fusion)", assured Gentilozzi, one of the owners of the new proprietor of CART, along with Kevin Kalkhoven and Gerald Forsythe, that also have equipment in the Champ Cars. Gentilozzi emphasized that the possible fusion would give origin extremely to a category hard, which would offer a great series to the public, when having in its rows to many of the figures that left the CART and they were united to the IRL, that includes in their calendar the 500 Miles of Indianapolis. The IRL, that runs all their season in the United States, was created in 1996 by Tony George, who in addition is proprietor of the automobile race track of Indianapolis and that separated of the CART after one long series of legal disputes. The Championship Car Racing Teams (CART), that lived its better years at the end of the decade on the 90 and until 2001, also runs most of its campaign in American tracks, but in addition it visits Canada, Mexico, Australia, Germany and England.

The Snout · 6 Jan 2004, 21:11 (Ref:829842)

Good to see Mexico has taken up recycling, good for the planet and newspaper headlines it seems.

Fogelhund · 6 Jan 2004, 21:12 (Ref:829844)

It is the only source reporting that so far, at least that I can find.

I find it hard to believe that there are plans to fuse the series as of 04'. Which cars would they run? A bit late in the game to make chassis changes. The IRL cars aren't ready for the road AFAIK, and be damned if the IRL guys are going to purchase CART type chassis either.

Then there is the little matter of schedule. There is the Long Beach/Motegi conflict. How exactly does IRL get out of 6 of its contracts for the year?

For 05' though, this makes perfect sense, and if done correctly is the best thing for Open Wheel Racing, and brings it back to the type of schedule when the series was much more significant in the eyes of the average Joe Q public. I know that some of you hate TG, but if this is what it takes to keep quality Open Wheel Racing.... so be it.

vatuloa · 6 Jan 2004, 21:15 (Ref:829848)

At thisd time of year you have to be a bit skeptical and all articals. Everything will change in 90 days

Liz · 6 Jan 2004, 21:17 (Ref:829851)

I hope they anounce it in time for me to do a "farewell tour" of the CART series for '04.

I'm not the least bit interested in a "fused" series under the leadership of Tony George.

The Snout · 6 Jan 2004, 21:20 (Ref:829853)

Quote:

Originally posted by Liz
I'm not the least bit interested in a "fused" series under the leadership of Tony George.

I don't think Tony George is either.

Liz · 6 Jan 2004, 21:30 (Ref:829867)

Good.

GP Racer · 6 Jan 2004, 21:50 (Ref:829886)

Well, I hope its true, its what I've been wanting and predicting would happen. I've got my fingers crossed!

Its the only direction it can take, and its for the good of all of us who like open wheel racing. Don't be so quick to judge this thing, and shut yourself off to the idea of it, you may regret it later...

Tenoch · 6 Jan 2004, 22:02 (Ref:829898)

This isn't an article written by Terra.com its made by notimex short for noticias mexicanas "mexican news" its a news service like AP or reuters. All it says is they want to talk so I'm not losing my head over this.

GP Racer · 6 Jan 2004, 23:53 (Ref:830029)

By Dovs translation(I didn't know he spoke Spanish!) it sounds as though they have already spoken.

While I'm not losing my head over this either, at least until somebody else can confirm it, I think if true, it does point to the direction of one series, which is huge!

Dov, I remember you telling me you fought hard in this forum with a petition to create one series last year. So why wouldn't you want to see it finally happen? If its the TG thing, at least wait to see how it turns out.

Snrub · 7 Jan 2004, 00:09 (Ref:830047)

If it's true, long term this could be for the best, but the racing will suck in the short term.

zerO · 7 Jan 2004, 00:30 (Ref:830061)

Hey Dov,
that is a very badly composed, written and timed blend of rubbish that we've been hearing from PG for many months now. Don't lose any sleep over it.

The OWRS/IRL merger is not even possible before 2006 - due to IRL's contractual obligations. The only way it could somewhat be possible in 2005 is if OWRS had "expired" and some teams would jump the fence - TG is very adamant about the "NO MERGER" ?!?! Yes, he could switch his tune tomorrow, but it isn't as simple as that silly Mexican article portrays it.

There is an old Polish adage (was loosely translated on "Banacek" once): "A paesant walks by a wooden fence and sees A.S.S. written on it, he glances it with his hand and gets a splinter stuck in one of his fingers. - The moral of this story is: Do not believe everything that is written ?!

zerO

MLM · 7 Jan 2004, 00:55 (Ref:830077)

I'll believe it when and if it happens.
And if it does, I'll decide on what to do.In the meantime, I'm not going to have a "meltdown" over it.

And if it would happen, I don't think I'll have a major meltdown.
I just hope they would use the CART/Champ Car specs and NOT the IRL specs (or we might see quite a few bad wrecks/injuries

)
Let's just see what happens...or not happen.

Dov · 7 Jan 2004, 01:28 (Ref:830090)

Quote:

Originally posted by GP Racer
Dov, I remember you telling me you fought hard in this forum with a petition to create one series last year. So why wouldn't you want to see it finally happen? If its the TG thing, at least wait to see how it turns out.

Some of us did fight hard to unite both series, but most (not all) CART fans agreed that for this merger to happen, TG could not be involved in it. We were hoping that maybe some ex-drivers could run the new series....Mario Andretti, Emmo, A.J. and Gurney were some of the names mentioned. Guys that really care about OW racing in NA.

Dov · 7 Jan 2004, 01:52 (Ref:830103)

Quote:

Originally posted by zerO
There is an old Polish adage (was loosely translated on "Banacek" once): "A paesant walks by a wooden fence and sees A.S.S. written on it, he glances it with his hand and gets a splinter stuck in one of his fingers. - The moral of this story is: Do not believe everything that is written ?!

(1)This is the second time you have told me this story and I'm getting a little tired of it! (2)Anybody who has been on the CART forum for the past year knows how much I hate TG and the IRL. In fact, I believe that some people in this forum think that I might be a member at CW.....I'm not, but I am a fan of their website. I do go over their a lot to read what they have to say, that doesn't mean that I agree 100% with every thing they have to say, but they are passionate about CART and at least with them I know what side of the fence they stand on! (3)Just because I am PRO-CART doesn't mean that I am going to close my eyes to the problems it's going through. Btw, I don't believe everything I read, but I'll continue to post articles regarding CART....positive or negative! Maybe you need to open your eyes a little more and come to the realization that CART is in serious trouble, but like you I am hoping for the best.

P.S. GP, I didn't translate that article....can't speak a lick of Spanish. Sometimes I can't even speak English!

suzmac · 7 Jan 2004, 02:51 (Ref:830130)

With or without Tony George...I would never like to see these two series "fused". That's just my opinion!!

Sue

Jay · 7 Jan 2004, 03:51 (Ref:830165)

That sounds very questionable, and the fact that it's only coming from this one spanish source is quite odd... there's nothing from CART or OWRS or anything on any English news source. That said, we'll see what happens.

I don't blame OWRS for trying to make amends with the IRL, but a complete merger would susprise me. There were brief talks in the past, so I wonder if this might just be an old report rehashed? Anyway, we'll see what happens... what comes, comes...

GP Racer · 7 Jan 2004, 04:17 (Ref:830181)

I agree jay, its been quite a few hours now, and still no one else has confirmed this story, so chances are, this article probably shouldn't be taken seriously. The question is, why would a countries national news agency report a story like this if it weren't true, at least to some extent?

I must say that I did get alittle excited when I first read it though, because as most of you guys know, I'd like to see a merger of some type.

One Series, One Direction
(hows that for a marketing slogan?!)

macdaddy · 7 Jan 2004, 04:31 (Ref:830187)

No big secret...
All I want is CART with some of the IRL's tracks.
Remember the word "diversity"?
Of course, I'd like some of the sponsors back...
But not necessarily the associated team owners...

In a nutshell, I'm not sure what I really want.

Ian-S · 7 Jan 2004, 04:55 (Ref:830199)

Quote:

....assured Gentilozzi, one of the owners of the new proprietor of CART.....

Just read that bit outload if in any doubt, I didn't think OWRS actually own CART.... yet.... if ever....

f1manoz · 7 Jan 2004, 07:11 (Ref:830242)

Tony George can go take a long jump off a short pier if he thinks I'm going to watch anything to do with his series.

CART_4ever · 7 Jan 2004, 12:34 (Ref:830390)

I hate to see this happen, but like Fogulhund says - if that's what it takes to keep open wheel alive and keep our favorite drivers racing... but with that said I'll always despise Tony George for what he did.

gaines · 7 Jan 2004, 14:26 (Ref:830553)

What if Tony George hadn't of done what he did? Do you guys think CART would still be going strong or do you think Penske, Ganassi and the rest of bad politics mixed with the horrible management we used to have would have shot the cost of racing to near F1 proportions? I don't agree with what TG did but let's face it, the series was out of control, had it not gotten into that state in the first place TG wouldn't have done what he did. He was just one of the sharks in the shark tank. Given the same chance Penske, Ganassi and some of the others would have done the same thing. Maybe not the same way but they would have held the Indy 500 up for ransom and tried to grab all the power. I guarantee it. It's just a shame a bunch of millionaires act like little kids. TG's pitiful, "It's my ball and I'll go home if you don't like my rules!" Indy 500 tactics and everybody else's, "It's not fair (Insert Honda, Toyota here) gets more money than I do, (Insert Rahal, Penske, Ganassi, Forsythe, etc) get more privileges than I do." **** screwed up the series. Yes TG is a bunghole and a half but he's not the only one!

suzmac · 7 Jan 2004, 15:16 (Ref:830595)

Quote:

Originally posted by macdaddy
No big secret...
All I want is CART with some of the IRL's tracks.
Remember the word "diversity"?
Of course, I'd like some of the sponsors back...
But not necessarily the associated team owners...

In a nutshell, I'm not sure what I really want.

Good to see that you admit that you don't know what you want mac!! LOL But I don't agree about the tracks....I wouldn't want to watch oval track races all the time...that's why I like the Champ Car Series because of the variety of tracks!

Sue

GP Racer · 7 Jan 2004, 16:11 (Ref:830660)

Quote:

Originally posted by gaines
What if Tony George hadn't of done what he did? Do you guys think CART would still be going strong or do you think Penske, Ganassi and the rest of bad politics mixed with the horrible management we used to have would have shot the cost of racing to near F1 proportions? I don't agree with what TG did but let's face it, the series was out of control, had it not gotten into that state in the first place TG wouldn't have done what he did. He was just one of the sharks in the shark tank. Given the same chance Penske, Ganassi and some of the others would have done the same thing. Maybe not the same way but they would have held the Indy 500 up for ransom and tried to grab all the power. I guarantee it. It's just a shame a bunch of millionaires act like little kids. TG's pitiful, "It's my ball and I'll go home if you don't like my rules!" Indy 500 tactics and everybody else's, "It's not fair (Insert Honda, Toyota here) gets more money than I do, (Insert Rahal, Penske, Ganassi, Forsythe, etc) get more privileges than I do." **** screwed up the series. Yes TG is a bunghole and a half but he's not the only one!

You make some valid points gaines.

I think that most of the people here feel that there were many problems, with or without TG. As for myself, I don't really see any of them as the boogeyman, what I see are businessmen going about the business of making money.

We all make decisions in our personal lives, that we feel are the best ones for ourselves and families. They may not be popular with some people in our lives, they may even upset some of them, but we make them anyway. Its really the same with these guys, there going to do what's best for them. The only real difference is their decisions affect alot more people, but the process is the same.

Do we know what we would have done if we were in TG's shoes back in 94? If you owned Indy and the 500, and you felt it was being threatened, how would you have acted? If you were Andretti, team owner, and you thought your series was going out of business, and you had your company and all its employees at stake, how would you have acted?

As a fan, those decisions may look easy to make, but from a business standpoint, they are much more difficult. I'm a fan of racing, not of series owners, and whoever can provide a stable series, and good racing, I'll be there.
I see no difference between Gentilozzi and George. One persons saviour, is another persons devil.

The only thing I want is one series, period...

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