Bathurst - Seat Belts No Tight when leaving Pits

[Troy]

Watching the race numerous different drivers going out onto to the hot track without the race belts done up correctly. Tightening them up going up Mountain Straight into Griffen's Bend. This should not be happening and is more dangerous then the other small little things that teams get pinged for. Crazy stuff. Should not be aloud to leave pit box until belts are secure.

[chavez]

A possible fix is a move to FIA endurance pit stop regs which allows for refuel and driver change and then change tyres - extends the length of a pit stop for greater safety in this regard.

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by Troy

Watching the race numerous different drivers going out onto to the hot track without the race belts done up correctly. Tightening them up going up Mountain Straight into Griffen's Bend. This should not be happening and is more dangerous then the other small little things that teams get pinged for. Crazy stuff. Should not be aloud to leave pit box until belts are secure.

seat belts are secured, if you watch a driver change they clip the belts in, then adjust them, its the adjustment that is of concern

[Swedish Brick]

Not Canto, they were off his left shoulder as he was mucking around with the cool suit driving one handed. If he crashed like that...

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by Swedish Brick

Not Canto, they were off his left shoulder as he was mucking around with the cool suit driving one handed. If he crashed like that...

I missed that one, but others clip then adjust as the head out, depending on where you are in the pits, closer to pit out, adjust on the run, down the other end adjust before you get to pit exit.

I do agree, as a Marshall and steward it is a safety issue that needs to be addressed. Belts must be adjusted before pit exit, especially if if goes south at turn two, as we have seen over the years,

Something for the powers to sort out. Over to V8 Supercars and CAMS.

[Nicholosophy]

They all had them clipped up but not tightened.

I think it was Dumbrell who didn't have the straps over his HANS device as he went up the mountain. Hit a roo and go straight into the wall at speed you need your HANS device working.

I agree with Endurance-style stops for the Endros and an official monitoring the straps as they leave.

[one five five]

At least they had the buckle plugged in...... time was when a driver would be halfway down Conrod and already completely unbuckled in anticipation of a pitstop.

I get this seems like a much more important issue compared to other rules they enforce, but does enforcing another 'nit-picking' rule really make it any better?

[Gaz170]

V8 Supercars really need an official at the Pit exit with the authority to hold a car from entering the track if the belts aren't properly done.

[banksie]

The image of a driver leaving the pits and entering a race track without their belts properly fastened would concern VESA. Those pictures send a bad message.

Throw in the chat of a driver hitting turn 2 without a brake peddle, every chance VESA will change something.

Maybe slowing down the re-fuel rate to give the drivers more time will be the simple solution.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by banksie

The image of a driver leaving the pits and entering a race track without their belts properly fastened would concern VESA. Those pictures send a bad message.

Throw in the chat of a driver hitting turn 2 without a brake peddle, every chance VESA will change something.

Maybe slowing down the re-fuel rate to give the drivers more time will be the simple solution.

This is exactly why VESA first introduced compulsory fuel flow regulators in the fuel rig hoses - to give the drivers time.

Now that the cars have smaller tanks & also have a high number of compulsory stops, there'd have to be a fair chance of the restrictor size being changed to slow the rate further and get the balance back to having enough time for the driver to fully kit up before leaving the pit bay.

[scudd]

Drivers want less rules and regulations, not more.

I don't have problem with what happened today and I'd guess neither would the lads out there.

There would be hundreds of drivers around the country competing from club days to national events who have their belts done up too loose all the time because they don't understand exactly how tight they need to be and the reason why, or that it can be painful or annoying if you aren't use to it.

Hard to police a 'how tight is tight enough rule' from a pit marshall while the car goes past at 40ks.

As a driver, it's in the front of your mind if your belts are loose and you work as quickly as possible to tighten them.

Storm in a tea cup.

[jiminee]

There is plenty of time for the driver to get buckled in and get the belts tight, if he is ready and standing there when the car arrives in the pit bay. It seems the problems today were caused by teams making last minute decisions to duck into the pits whilst the new driver was still putting his gear on, hence the rush around to get everything completed.

If there has to be a new rule, seems the simplest one would be that for a driver change to be allowed, the new driver has to be standing out with the rest of the crew as the car comes to a stop in the pit bay - easy to enforce and easy enough for the teams to be prepared for. There is really no reason for a driver to not be all ready to go 5 laps before a car is due in, maybe today though the minimum pit stops rule played a part?

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by scudd

Drivers want less rules and regulations, not more.

I don't have problem with what happened today and I'd guess neither would the lads out there.

There would be hundreds of drivers around the country competing from club days to national events who have their belts done up too loose all the time because they don't understand exactly how tight they need to be and the reason why, or that it can be painful or annoying if you aren't use to it.

Hard to police a 'how tight is tight enough rule' from a pit marshall while the car goes past at 40ks.

As a driver, it's in the front of your mind if your belts are loose and you work as quickly as possible to tighten them.

Storm in a tea cup.

Originally Posted by Silver 3

Exactly correct. After you get in--the settling in the seat, means belts can be tightened considerably.What Bathurst shots do not show-- even after being tight as possible after first few tries-- I bet drivers tighten again by the time they get to the Chase. It does not mean they were not tight--it means they can be tightened again!!
Too many "opinions" get air on forum from guys with no idea whatsoever-- and I mean none.

These should be the 2 opening quotes in this thread, with my bold for emphasis, and then the thread closed.

How is it going to be policed? How many cars did not have an incar camera looking at the driver, so we would never know if they were within the rules or not? And the Marshall at pit exit won't be able to check as they go past.

Imagine what could have happened in 2005 if there was no in car camera that showed Ambrose's neck?

[johnh875]

Originally Posted by scudd

Drivers want less rules and regulations, not more.
...

As a driver, it's in the front of your mind if your belts are loose and you work as quickly as possible to tighten them.

Clearly not in all cases or we wouldn't be seeing drivers heading into the top of the mountain with loose belts! I saw Winterbottom in one stop clip the belts in then sit there poised to go from before the time he was given a 5 sec warning from the car controller.

A few years ago they introduced the fuel flow restrictor to ensure there was time to belt in properly, and now the rule re fastening seat belts is being abused, plain and simple. Enforcement is a secondary issue as far as I am concerned due to the obvious challenge although I'd guess a pit marshall could watch for the belt-tightening motions, but more likely in-car cameras can be used to pick it up (aka Ch7 replay lotto - nice one). Still a much better situation than the current when the drivers know they can't be penalised.

[one five five]

Surely we should be taking the drivers word on this)?

Drivers in this thread think the current rules are ok?
Neil Crompton, a big pusher of safety during his driving career, didn't seem to have an issue with it in the commentary?

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by one five five

Surely we should be taking the drivers word on this)?

Drivers in this thread think the current rules are ok?
Neil Crompton, a big pusher of safety during his driving career, didn't seem to have an issue with it in the commentary?

Gods gift to V8 Supercars commentary, who used to criticise marshall etc, I wouldnt listen to him, double standards , like some radio jocks, says what the punters on telly land think they want to hear , if it goes pear shaped, says another thing , old indian saying, "him speak with fork tounge"

[Swedish Brick]

Those saying the belts are OK because they are fastened just not adjusted. Well how do you adjust a tight belt? If its tightened properly, you can't adjust them

[Notso Swift]

If you jump in to a race seat and tighten the belts as hard as you can you will still need to given a good yank after 500 mt.
In sprint races almost every driver coming out on his warm up lap will be seen tugging the harness before the start.

[Silver 3]

Originally Posted by Notso Swift

If you jump in to a race seat and tighten the belts as hard as you can you will still need to given a good yank after 500 mt.
In sprint races almost every driver coming out on his warm up lap will be seen tugging the harness before the start.

Exactly correct. After you get in--the settling in the seat, means belts can be tightened considerably.What Bathurst shots do not show-- even after being tight as possible after first few tries-- I bet drivers tighten again by the time they get to the Chase. It does not mean they were not tight--it means they can be tightened again!!
Too many "opinions" get air on forum from guys with no idea whatsoever-- and I mean none.

[Gaz170]

Originally Posted by Notso Swift

If you jump in to a race seat and tighten the belts as hard as you can you will still need to given a good yank after 500 mt.
In sprint races almost every driver coming out on his warm up lap will be seen tugging the harness before the start.

There is a big difference between needing to tighten the belts, and needing to hook them over the HANS, plug things in, drive 1 handed up Mountain straight, etc.

[Swedish Brick]

Still missing the point of the driver/s with the belts OFF the shoulder

[321Go]

Hang on a minute folks. Let's just wait and see before we jump the gun please. There's been no V8SC driver that has ever been injured because the seat belts weren't done up properly now has there? So no need to implement such rules yet. Just a knee jerk reaction! Wait, and if something does happen, then let's look at it.

[Gaz170]

Originally Posted by 321Go

Hang on a minute folks. Let's just wait and see before we jump the gun please. There's been no V8SC driver that has ever been injured because the seat belts weren't done up properly now has there? So no need to implement such rules yet. Just a knee jerk reaction! Wait, and if something does happen, then let's look at it.

Sure, lets wait for someone to die before we fix the problem

[321Go]

Originally Posted by Gaz170

Sure, lets wait for someone to die before we fix the problem

Sorry, was just saying how things are these days, which is mostly a reactive world to a issue that is mostly preventative. Wait till something happens and then look at fixing it. Was a tongue and cheek post.

[Gaz170]

Originally Posted by 321Go

Sorry, was just saying how things are these days, which is mostly a reactive world to a issue that is mostly preventative. Wait till something happens and then look at fixing it. Was a tongue and cheek post.

That's ok, I work in an industry where this is usually the case. Very annoying.