Why the angst between bike marshals and car marshals?

[robbo75]

Morning peeps,

I've been marshaling for a few years, but am taking part in my first bike event at combe this coming saturday.

Which brings me to ask why there appears to be tension between bike marshals and car marshals?

Any opinions please?

Cheers

[stroller]

Never really come across any real animosity between the two sets of Marshals.
I know a lot of people do both disciplines, but I think a lot of the perceived problems are that those who only do one or the other are probably unsure of what the duties are and how they are carried out.
Did the Plum Pudding meeting a few years back (mixture of Cars & Bikes) and the main problem then seemed to be that the Bike Marshals seemed very reluctant to get involved with dealing with anything with 4 wheels. Don’t know if the problem was that they were unsure as to what to do, or the thinking “it’s cars – leave it to the others!”

Can’t say it’s a mutual distrust – just perhaps lack of “crossover” of information.

[BeeJ]

I think like Stroller that it is more of a lack of understanding between the two disciplines. I had a big barney with a Bike marshal that was running the post at the Plum Pudding. At the begining of the meeting we came to an agreement that the Bile marshals would take charge for the Bike sessions and the Car marshals would take place during the Car sessions. We had a Red flag during one of the Car sessions, heard it on my scanner so waited to see other Red flags go around the circuit, the Bike marshal then started demanding I put the red out althought I could not see it at any other posts. When I saw it at the post before mine, as that was closer to start finish line, I displayed mine.

The bike marshal then commenced to give me a dressing down and would not accept that we wait until we see a Red as it always starts at S/F line, and also would not back down when we said "but at the begining of the day we said that car marshals would run car sessions and bike marshals would run bike sessions"

So a lack of understanding caused a car vs bike marshal argument on post even though we thought we had covered that off by the agreement at the beginning of the meeting.

[Nighthawk]

Never come across any problems between the two sets of Marshals.

[gravel_monkey]

it definetly does exist. i know this from working with bike marshals at trackdays. in all honesty i dont think it is anything personal at all, it just seems to be a lack of knowledge over each set of procedures and what is deemed safe and unsafe.

[Nighthawk]

I think its a lack of understanding of each discipline that causes arguments between marshals....

[Motorsportgirli]

many of the marshals at croft are bike marshals and have never encountered a problem, they infact help you understand the differences in the two disiplines

Although saying that we have a couple of guys who do both and spend the whole time at car meetings saying "i hate car racing" makes me wonder if they do the same at the bike meets? Thats the only time i have had a negative experience and i did ask why they where there if they didnt enjoy it but recieved no response!!

[Woolley]

I don't do bike meetings because I'm not too keen on clearing up the sort of accidents bike marshals deal with, and my experience of cars doesn't help - in fact it probably hinders since what is normal for cars is not for bikes and vice versa. On one occasion where we had bikes at a car meeting I was fortunate enough to be on a post where we had a regular bike marshal, and although I was I/O at the time (well, I think I was, it was a long time ago) I was happy to declare myself a novice for this discipline and hand over control to him.

A marshal is a marshal is a marshal, and I don't understand the antagonism that sometimes exists between disciplines, circuits, colours, etc. You just have to appreciate that if you're doing something or somewhere new, the regulars probably know what they're doing under their systems and it's your job to understand it and fit in as best you can.

[Nighthawk]

well said Woolley

[Col_Rugby]

Maybe these threads might help a little

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=110096

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105780

2nd thread goes on to explain some of the feelings between bike & car marshals.

Most of us get on really well, but as in normal life there are personality clashes, I'm better than you views, mines bigger than yours etc etc. You get the picture.
Unfortunately we only remember the ones who don't get on or the ones that cause arguments not the ones who work together well & have a good safe day on the bank.
1 thing though, bike marshals do have a bit missing ( I do both)

[Beeny-like]

I agree wholeheartedly with Woolley.

I marshal mostly car meetings (around 45 days a year) but I LOVE bike racing and started adding a few to my volunteering form a few years ago. I relish the WSB and BSB at Silverstone and cannot wait for us to host Moto GP.

I have been very warmly welcomed at bike meetings (in spite of wearing black) and have never encountered any animosity whatsoever.

Cars and bikes are VERY different disciplines and different rules, therefore, apply. We need to respect those who know best in a given situation and be willing, sometimes, to take a back seat and simply assist.

We meet all sorts of people along the way ... in our working, professional, personal and volunteering lives. There are, inevitably, good/bad/indifferent ... and numpties! Let's just all enjoy what we enjoy and, most importantly, DO IT SAFELY (please).

Donna

[MattFord]

I did a couple of club meets last year at Brands and the BSB at Thruxton this year. Never had a problem.

Under the probans we are all the same.

[HairyDJ]

Bit like bike riders & car drivers - most get along fine, but some of each carry enormous chips and are best avoided. Me? I'm scared of bikes ....

[PVDA]

Originally Posted by robbo75

Which brings me to ask why there appears to be tension between bike marshals and car marshals?

More like a friendly banter down here.

The hands & feet level marshals from both sides get along quite well here in Victoria as many do duty at both types of events and it's usually no more than the usual stirring you get between rival footy teams.

[The Fat Clerk]

No probems here @ Mallory, there's half a dozen or so of us who do both. we no angst at all.

[haystacks]

Matt, you had better ask some of the lady marshals that.

[ss24355261]

steve swallow
I do the Plum Pudding on the same post every year i have mostly the same crew every year. I dont have any problems with tham at all its head down and get on with it.

[MADMAX999]

I have done cars and bikes for 33 years.

Bikes can be a bit more hands on and for me more exciting (and dangerous).
It tends to be car marshals that express opinions on the topic, especially if it's a combined meeting!

It does not matter as we are all Motorsport Marshals, so lets continue the good work.

[gwar]

Originally Posted by robbo75

Morning peeps,

I've been marshaling for a few years, but am taking part in my first bike event at combe this coming saturday.


Cheers

Looks like we,ve just been voluntereed for this one, hope to see you there....got my new 10/10ths badge..

I,m just a volunteer who loves me motorsport, like the rest of you.
What else is there to do on a saturday....

[TFHarv]

I have done both bikes and cars this year and find the bike incidents tend to be more dangerous with more serious injuries occurring more often where in cars it seems to be less often serious injuries ( it does say something to have 4 wheels and a roof sometimes ).

The flags are different and I think that both would benefit from an exchange in practice ( safety cars being a biggy here ).

I don't think the marshals are any different between the disciplines but I do here a lot of bike marshals saying they don't like car racing.

I think if you like cars, do cars, if you like bikes, do bikes if you like both do both, but remember there are different skills involved and you have to keep both sets separate to ensure you do your job correctly and safely.

[robbo75]

So.... just had my first day marshaling at a bike meeting.

Apart from the pork pies I am happy to report that bike marshals are (for the most part) also human beings!! I know - hard to believe isn't it!!

Seriously though, I had an excellent day - thanks to the guys at Avon Rise!

[The Fat Clerk]

If any of you want to see Bikes at their best - try Darley Moor, oh and you get SuperKarts thrown in as well!

[gwar]

Originally Posted by robbo75

So.... just had my first day marshaling at a bike meeting.

Apart from the pork pies I am happy to report that bike marshals are (for the most part) also human beings!! I know - hard to believe isn't it!!

Seriously though, I had an excellent day - thanks to the guys at Avon Rise!

We to had a brill day at coombe, westway and bybrook,
Bybrook had a family pack of pork pies i think...
A good mix of car and bike marshals and from what i saw they all did a fantastic job together as a team in some very trying incidents.....and indeed high praise from race control to all involved.
A really good day...were all orange thru and thru, and i,ll have a drink with any of you.....

[Roger Lovelock]

Originally Posted by gwar

We to had a brill day at coombe, westway and bybrook,
Bybrook had a family pack of pork pies i think...
A good mix of car and bike marshals and from what i saw they all did a fantastic job together as a team in some very trying incidents.....and indeed high praise from race control to all involved.
A really good day...were all orange thru and thru, and i,ll have a drink with any of you.....

Spend the day at Esses and also had a good mix of both disciplines. I think that car and bike marshals can learn from each other.
As above were all orange thru and throu, and would also have a drink with of you

[gravel_monkey]

thinkin back when i have done plum puddin its always been a good mix of cars and bike marshals and always a great crack, do remember some very nice guys explainin what they do and why, same when i do the track/test days at anglesey, iam always in the bar after with the bike guys.