Castle Combe saloons (02.10.04)

alfaman · 4 Oct 2004, 02:06 (Ref:1114486)

Just wondering what people thought about the incident towards the end of the Castle Combe saloon race on Saturday.

For those who weren't there....

It saw Gary Prebble's Rover and Mark Wyatt's Astra clash at Quarry and put both out of the race.

Prebble's car went into the wall whilst Wyatt's was stuck on the track.

Gary Prebble was so incensed that he jumped out of his car and ran on to the track and stood in front of Mark Wyatt's car making various "gestures" before being guided away by marshals...

A bit of a Martin Schanche moment I thought!

It was entertaining and got a huge cheer from the Quarry crowd but running on to the track is also a bit of a no-no...(to say the least)

This did affect Prebble's title challenge - but unfortunately the commentators couldn't work out if he'd lost the championship or not because of the DNF.

So is his behaviour acceptable in the heat of the moment? Or do people think he's endangering himself and the marshals by his actions?

M Greenslade · 4 Oct 2004, 09:08 (Ref:1114668)

As the observer involved in the above incident I can assure anyone who wishes to know that a full and factual report regarding this incident was submitted to race control and the appropriate action by them was taken by them. With regards to the above comments I have no desire to make my thoughts known publicly and would expect the same response from my crew - Balders

Redracer77 · 4 Oct 2004, 12:52 (Ref:1114839)

I videoed the incident on my little camera. It was very funny but very dangerous. You could tell that Wyatt had made up his mind to overtake well before Avon Rise!!!

He went down the inside and Prebble closed the door. 100% racing accident. But Prebble was out of his mind running in to the track as he wanted to stop Wyatt from completing the race but the rest of the cars were coming over the hill really fast and he could have been killed if another car had jumped on the brakes because they had missed the yellows.

Prebbles car only slightly touched the wall and could have driven on but all he wanted to do was get to Wyatt. He must have been thinking what to do if contact was made rather than let him by and race for the championship.....

G_Ilott · 5 Oct 2004, 12:49 (Ref:1115873)

What do you think caused so many crashes on Saturday compared to other meetings? The changeable weather or the wrapping up of several championships? Seemed like every race was stopped at least once.

b1ackcr0w · 6 Oct 2004, 09:13 (Ref:1116623)

I don't think the wrapping up of championships had much to do with it. Most of the championships on that race card are well known to be very competitive.

I think the conditions were much more the cause. For much of the day, because the track kept drying and then getting rained on, the exact grip level must have been impossible to judge. For most of Saturday, every lap would have been a new adventure.

Lee Purnell · 6 Oct 2004, 11:50 (Ref:1116789)

It sounds like a bit of a crazy moment!

Not 100% sure, but I think there may well be a bit of history between Messer's Prebble & Wyatt? Must be nice to have enough cash not to worry about damaging a car like Wyatt's Astra!?!

I have heard lots of different numbers, but I am sure it has cost them in excess of £50k to build. Especially when you bear in mind that the engine was probably a good £15k and they had to bin one after a few races last year!! To be able to "make your mind up to overtake before Avon Rise" is Very brave to say the least!

Still, I digress slightly… The point is, Gary was a bit foolish by the sounds of it!

G_Ilott · 6 Oct 2004, 14:22 (Ref:1116993)

I'm amazed anyone overtakes up to Quarry - it's so bumpy. I went around for a 'white knuckle' ride in a Subaru earlier in the year when my brother was at the race school and Avon Rise was worse than my drive to work on Dorset roads (well-known for their lack of maintenance and general ****-ness).

Admittedly, I don't approach corners at quite the same speed... if a copper's looking

Redracer77 · 6 Oct 2004, 15:58 (Ref:1117095)

It is a great overtaking point. If you have a good drive through Camp you can slipstream well and go for the inside over the curbs. You then have more road to brake on as well

Al Weyman · 6 Oct 2004, 17:48 (Ref:1117210)

£50k into an Astra!!! When that Castle Coombe series began it was after we went there in the Falken (now Toyo Mod Prods and they liked it so much they more or less copied our technical regs (at the time) and we were never invited back but it has always amazed me how much guys will shell out on what is essentially a one circuit club championship that was put together for a bit of fun, madness.

R59 · 10 Oct 2004, 11:24 (Ref:1120224)

Â£50K into an Astra - is that all.
I remember Paul Berman in Super Road Saloons (and Castle Combe Saloons) turning up with three cars. One for Class C Supers and one for Class C Castle Combe Saloons,and one for Class B Supers, plus one of for his mechanic in Class C Supers. Each car was supposed to have cost circa 50K to build. All Pug 205's. Allegedly he had more cars too...

But when you pay experts to build your cars, that's the sort of bills you should expect, even for a clubbie car.

Back to the thread, and the actions were typical of boiling adrenaline. Overtaking into Quarry, making your move through Avon Rise, is one of the few places to overtake, and given the blood hungry crowd that mass at Quarry, just to see the "action".

I'm sure the observer's report showed racing incident, followed by moments of lunacy, or words to that effect.

Al Weyman · 10 Oct 2004, 13:23 (Ref:1120301)

No you have got that wrong 59, Paul also had one especially for the ModProds on Falken rubber, he also had a TVR Tuscan racer. I still think to spend 50k on a 2 door Eurohatch is just plain daft. We used to have a buying plate in the ModProds but that was stupidly voted out by the membership when guys wanted to start bringing ex-BTCC care downgraded (or so we were lead to believe) to our regs. That was the start of the rot, guys overspendig, can't you see this is one of the reasons you are now getting fields of 10 or 12 cars (except funny enough budget Hot Hatches, I wonder why) when about 8 or 9 years ago we filled (with reserves), 3 grids at Mallory Park and I had over 130 registered members who were all serious about racing a car in the chaionship.

R59 · 10 Oct 2004, 20:44 (Ref:1120570)

Oh, Sorry Al, I forgot that one!! Not forgetting the modified 308...
Last heard - doing nothing more than track days.

I agree with you on those sentiments. Like Mod-Prods, the Super Road Saloons (where Mark Wyatt used to race) was a very well supported series, where the 1400-1800cc class was very well supported, filling grids on it's own with reserves, then the rule fiddling started.
The rest is history.

Rob

Al Weyman · 10 Oct 2004, 21:01 (Ref:1120581)

He used to pop into my graphics shop for decals for his 'fleet' and it was usually a bit of a shipping order as they were all decked out the same, haven't see him around for two or three years.

alfaman · 11 Oct 2004, 15:10 (Ref:1121123)

I noticed that the Combe contingent made up at least a quarter of the Toyo grid at Thruxton on Sunday.

And Gary Prebble won!

Some small compensation then...

Lee Purnell · 11 Oct 2004, 15:28 (Ref:1121139)

Just had a look at the results of that Toyo race, how on earth did the front pair get 30 seconds clear of the field in a 10 lap race???

I know Prebble is quick, but that's mad!

greenamex2 · 11 Oct 2004, 17:01 (Ref:1121235)

Thruxton is a long fast circuit (10mph average faster than Castle Combe) and regretably most of our cars that are generally faster on the more open faster circuits were missing. It would have been good to have seen Chris Randall, Neil Philpotts and Gerry Cain (with a working car) up the front battling with Gary and Nick Williamson.

And for some reason the Cox's were struggling a bit.

Gareth Porter has also promised to get a Nick Williamson spec engine for next year and there are a number of similar spec 205's being finished off so hopefully things will be a lot busier next year.

Dan Friel · 11 Oct 2004, 18:11 (Ref:1121297)

Having spent yesterday at Post 15, you could certainly see who spent money on their engines! That combined with total committment and Williamson / Prebble were pretty mighty through Church corner..

Al Weyman · 11 Oct 2004, 18:38 (Ref:1121316)

It's a Camaro circuit (in the dry), I put my old 2nd gen beast on pole there one year in the ModProds (only time I ever did) and I recon she was pulling about 157mph down the back straight. Come the race, it naturally rains so that was the end of that. I was going to try to make that race but the MSA are insisting I take that ARDS test thing because I let my licence expire over the 3 years and I just can't be asked at the moment as I am too busy, maybe next year, no wonder they can't get cars out there, just too may obstacles put in the way now.

Sorry to hear Gerry Cain's Rover was sick, I lent him so Camaro roller rockers to get him out of trouble for the race, hope oe never let go!

greenamex2 · 11 Oct 2004, 19:32 (Ref:1121377)

Al - Gerry finished the race but according to my pit crew backed off. I know he didn't want to upset anybody still battling for the championship so maybe he was just sand bagging.

You are right about it being a power circuit. Due to my proper engine blowing up I only had a top speed of 107MPH, I didn't seem to have to brake very much! At least I bedded my new disks in nicely.

Al Weyman · 11 Oct 2004, 20:27 (Ref:1121453)

Gerry does not know what sandbagging means, if he could have won he would, he must have had a problem.

R59 · 15 Oct 2004, 19:20 (Ref:1125502)

107 Denis?
Blimey. Fully flat through church at pedestrian pace!

Last year was the first time I had driven (in a race) at Thruxton for the best part of 13 years. It took me a couple of laps to get the feeling back from the car (bottle from the driver!) to take Church flat in 5th again.

Follwing the first lap bashing I got in the complex, and the subsequent visit to the tyres, it took a few more laps before I felt confident to drive the "crab" flat through Church again.

Al- 157 down the "straight", and for a "shopping car" too (road tyres and all that!). Scabby Nova was pulling about 130-135 down there.

There was a time when Mod-Prods were quicker than the Castle Combe cars, but alas, not anymore (other than Nick Williamson's rocket propelled 205)

Rob.

Al Weyman · 15 Oct 2004, 19:38 (Ref:1125514)

Well if they are quicker it is probably down to the regulations, It is all relative anyhow as long as all the cars competing in the race are built to the same set of regs the fact that one series may be running a few seconds faster than the other is largely irrelevant.

Gerry did have a problem incidently, his engine oil pressure was flutuating badly so he backed off rather than risk it.

R59 · 15 Oct 2004, 19:49 (Ref:1125521)

When you look at the cars at Castle Combe, and those that are out in Mod-Prods, the Castle Combe ones are in general, newer models, more advanced engines.
When you consider that cars like my Nova, Denis' Toymota, Gerry's Rover, and even Nick's Pug, are all 15 years old, or more!
I haven't had a copy of the regs for Combe for a while, but there used to be an age limit, which precluded many of the cars that used to run in Mod-Prods, and Super Road Saloons.

If I think back, Tony Dolley's Corset used to emit something like 220bhp, which puts my 190 in the shade. Though he does have a spare set of valves, and a spare cam compared to mine.
And it's spec would meet Mod-Prods.

Rob.

Al Weyman · 15 Oct 2004, 19:53 (Ref:1125524)

I know they had a capacity limit that is why I could not race the chevys there, I dont think the v8 Rovers could either.

R59 · 15 Oct 2004, 20:07 (Ref:1125528)

According to the reggerlations, max 3000cc, nowt older than 1990 (or in production in 1990).

That keeps me out!! (hooray they shout!)

Rob.

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