Rules All FOTA Teams submit entries for 2010

climb · 29 May 2009, 13:51 (Ref:2471602)

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/75680

.. So now they're all self suspended, like it happened to Williams?

Chatters · 29 May 2009, 14:01 (Ref:2471609)

Surprise surprise...

jab · 29 May 2009, 14:04 (Ref:2471611)

Thank God it's over

Well, as long as they can get the Concorde signed in 2 weeks...

chillibowl · 29 May 2009, 14:29 (Ref:2471628)

not to be all doom and gloom, but is it over or has the battle just shifted to the next year when in all likelihood, the manufactures will be in a weaker position and the FOTA potentially smaller if the likes of Toyota withdraw due to their obvious financial woes.
add a couple of new teams/independents with one year of experience under their belts and i dont think i will care as much if Ferrari choose to leave F1 and really wont care if Red Bull or BMW are not there in 2011- Prodrive and Lola are more then adequate replacements.
also i cant help but feel that this compromise (whatever it is) only serves the FIA's purpose more than it does the teams so i expect next years negotiations to be more public and ridiculous. since taking the helm of FIA, has Max lost a battle to anyone? the teams had a realistic chance to get control of the sport and they lost it because really they have no where else to go and Max knows it.

on the bright side we get one more year where the the big teams get to spend stupid amounts of money!

**Bononi** · 29 May 2009, 15:13 (Ref:2471659)

Don't make any assumptions for the future... that's a battle to be won yet, for now it seems that the FIA has bended under the teams weight...

Marbot · 29 May 2009, 16:02 (Ref:2471688)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bononi

for now it seems that the FIA has bended under the teams weight...

Yeah right!

Max has got exactly what he wanted.He came up with a couple of ridiculous things that got them all hot and bothered,but what he realistically wanted was hidden underneath.

Marbot · 29 May 2009, 16:39 (Ref:2471708)

Q & A with John Howett.And FOTA still aren't interested in budget caps!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/75683

Clever of them to sign up 'as one'.I can see some problems yet,as we await an FIA response.

**Bononi** · 29 May 2009, 17:32 (Ref:2471735)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Q & A with John Howett.And FOTA still aren't interested in budget caps!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/75683

Clever of them to sign up 'as one'.I can see some problems yet,as we await an FIA response.

'We' ? That's interesting.

jab · 29 May 2009, 17:35 (Ref:2471737)

As well as Max saving face, from what I've read it will be a budget cap in all but name so the teams can say a budget cap wasn't brought in

Also, note "all nine teams who are currently members of FOTA" - hmm...

Marbot · 29 May 2009, 17:45 (Ref:2471744)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jab

Also, note "all nine teams who are currently members of FOTA" - hmm...

That makes sense because Williams are the only racing team.

Spritle · 29 May 2009, 18:29 (Ref:2471771)

Considering they signed conditionally, nothing is really over until the FIA responds.

A walk away is still on the table if Mad Max balks at their requests.

phoenix · 29 May 2009, 19:17 (Ref:2471791)

Max only has to keep quiet and make no 'public' decision..... FOTA thinks Max has to make the next move - I believe he doesn't and therefore probably won't. I'll eat mars bars for a week if he does (ok - maybe ONE hat!)

The result will not be 9 teams looking for a new series and several thousand people looking for a new jobs in a couple of weeks time, I'm pretty sure....

The FOTA announcement seems to ignore the teams' committment to Bernie until 2012. And Bernie will not take their breach of contract lying down.

Anyone taking bets on this? I know where I would place MY hard-earned...

Marbot · 29 May 2009, 19:50 (Ref:2471804)

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenix

The FOTA announcement seems to ignore the teams' committment to Bernie until 2012. And Bernie will not take their breach of contract lying down.

Quite right.

Williams have already said that they are commited to F1 until 2012,which is why they signed unconditionally.If the teams want to argue about the how,why,who,where,what and when,then they should have done the same.But for now I'm looking forward to Max and Bernie treating them all as one.

Marbot · 29 May 2009, 23:32 (Ref:2471907)

This James Allen article explains it all quite clearly I think.

http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?T...Allen&id=45999

**Bononi** · 30 May 2009, 00:29 (Ref:2471936)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

This James Allen article explains it all quite clearly I think.

http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?T...Allen&id=45999

I have never thought of that !

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Allen

They want to make cost savings but they want to do so their way and on their terms.

Did I hear that here before ?

**Bononi** · 30 May 2009, 01:49 (Ref:2471955)

"The path is clear, Though no eyes can see, The course laid down long before.
And so with gods and men, The sheep remain inside their pen, Though many times they've seen the way to leave."

I'll let you guess where it's from...

Marbot · 30 May 2009, 09:02 (Ref:2472024)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bononi

I'll let you guess where it's from...

No guessing,Genesis-Firth of Fifth.

HughGJohnson · 31 May 2009, 01:15 (Ref:2472393)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bononi

"The path is clear, Though no eyes can see, The course laid down long before.
And so with gods and men, The sheep remain inside their pen, Though many times they've seen the way to leave."

I'll let you guess where it's from...

Clearly it's The Art of War

That would seem more fitting, at least. My prediction is: more threats, more drama, a temporary resolution and a bunch of rich people making a lot of money. Speaking of these rich people... surely they must realize that if they put that rule book in, they'll be killing the goose that layed the golden egg. It's all a bluff, smokescreen a red herring... right?

Marbot · 31 May 2009, 01:25 (Ref:2472395)

Quote:

Originally Posted by HughGJohnson

Clearly it's The Art of War

Band:Genesis. Song:Firth of Fifth. Album:Selling England By The Pound.But you could be right too!

**Bononi** · 31 May 2009, 01:33 (Ref:2472398)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

All they would have to do is pay back all the money paid to them by FOM and then find somewhere to race other than the tracks that are already contracted to FOM (Bernie only needs 14 cars on the grid to fulfill his side of the contracts remember).Getting permission to race at sub-standard tracks may also prove to be something of a problem.Being chased by Bernie through the courts will be another one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Band:Genesis. Song:Firth of Fifth. Album:Selling England By The Pound.But you could be right too!

And it represents well the situation...

You're somehow sort of a optmistic fella, contracts should be respected, deals should be honoured and FOM will be right on the side of the FIA.
Disneyworld, Star wars and Superman.
And you can't download HD movies from internet.

I'm ordering a pizza...

JeremySmith · 30 May 2009, 01:50 (Ref:2471956)

So what do you think then Martyn? What will be the outcome of all of this...

Oldtony · 30 May 2009, 06:55 (Ref:2471991)

Time to read between the lines again.
The next key step is the signing of the Concorde. That document covers the relationship between the Teams, FIA and importantly FOM the commercial rights holder. The importance in the release is the statement that all parties must sign the Concorde by June 12th.
Williams is under temperary suspension from FOTA, a situation which exists purely because they had already commited to 2012 in order to get their own money out of FOM when they faced financial meltdown before the season started.
The ball is now very firmly in the court of two parties, Max, if he can still rely on FIA backing, and Bernie, if he can afford to negotiate the required financial returns to the teams from FOM and still maintain enough of a share to pay CVC's interest bill.
I'm amazed that James talks of this as being just between FOTA and FIA. Surely he of all people shoul realise the level of importance of the media income to both FOTA and FOM.
The fat lady hasn't even gargled yet!

Marbot · 30 May 2009, 09:50 (Ref:2472048)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

So what do you think then Martyn? What will be the outcome of all of this...

F1 Jeremy,but not as we know it.

We have to wait and see what the FIA's response is,I'm sure that it will be something equally surprising.

Marbot · 30 May 2009, 17:41 (Ref:2472247)

Domenicali's idea of cost cutting seems to be along the lines of limiting the number of parts that you can use in a season.It doesn't actually stop you from spending millions of Euros on each part though does it.

"Then, further reductions have been defined in the area of aerodynamics, with restrictions imposed on the amount of development work, for example, restricting the number of different wings that can be used during the course of the championship."

And I'm sure that 6.5 million Euros will not get you a competetive engine and gearbox package.

"First and foremost, our starting point is the decision already taken by FOTA, to make available to the independent teams an engine-gearbox package at a cost of 6.5 million Euros for the entire season."

Read: It's yours for 6.5 mil Euros,but don't expect it to be up to our spec.

Full article.http://http://www.autosport.com/news...t.php/id/75722

We can only hope that the FIA go with the 'Mercedes plan'.

Canada ALMS fan · 30 May 2009, 20:09 (Ref:2472283)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Domenicali's idea of cost cutting seems to be along the lines of limiting the number of parts that you can use in a season.It doesn't actually stop you from spending millions of Euros on each part though does it.

"Then, further reductions have been defined in the area of aerodynamics, with restrictions imposed on the amount of development work, for example, restricting the number of different wings that can be used during the course of the championship."

And I'm sure that 6.5 million Euros will not get you a competetive engine and gearbox package.

"First and foremost, our starting point is the decision already taken by FOTA, to make available to the independent teams an engine-gearbox package at a cost of 6.5 million Euros for the entire season."

Read: It's yours for 6.5 mil Euros,but don't expect it to be up to our spec.

Full article.http://http://www.autosport.com/news...t.php/id/75722

We can only hope that the FIA go with the 'Mercedes plan'.

I think with the engines frozen 6.5 million Euros WILL get a competitive drive train. (They are close to that figure this year I believe, Brawn anyone???

)The compromise that FOTA has come up preserves the technical integrity of F1. The average fan does not want to see spec cars but at the same time doesn't care or notice if the teams have different aero bits for EVERY race. It sounds like the teams may ban certain materials and standardize some parts to help costs as well. All in all, the solution FOTA has (the little we know of it) is much better than Mosley's. IMO it's not about Max or FOTA "winning", it is about re-creating an F1 that is sustainable but still suitable for privateers AND manufacturers. In that case Max's goal of getting costs down has been a success. It is too bad we have to deal with all the politics of getting to a sensible compromise. I think you are correct in thinking the FIA's response could be equally surprising. Either way, I feeling better about where all this is heading compared to a couple of weeks ago.

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