Unsung heroes

[LYNX]

There are many volunteers that make it possible for us to race - Marshalls, Stewards, CofC, medical, etc etc. I know very little about what motivates them to do it, nor the training they undergo - I am sure I am not alone in this and would like to hear the what, why and when i.e. the stories behind the orange and others............?

[LYNX]

Probably not too many of them read this forum! So any information gratefully recieved!

[Eddy V]

Me, I marshal for the money and the power to annoy drivers that you have as an observer.

Seriously, I started racing a very long time ago and took up marshalling at the very same time, for one day only (long story), to make a few friends happy.
I didn't really want to marshal, but I liked it after all. I marshalled and raced just for the love of the sport.

Clerked as well, but didn't like the politics, so I pulled out after a few years.

After I stopped racing I kept the orange things on and stood on the bank nearly every weekend, as I got hooked badly by the friendship and fun you can have on post, being close to the action (sometimes too close) and getting the feeling that for once you have made yourself useful.
Some years ago I picked up marshalling in the UK and I do that about every third week or so, again because over here (UK) you are still made welcome, unlike in my home country.

Short: just for the sheer fun, friendship and great people you meet. And the donuts.
But I hate it when it rains! And never do big events anymore.

But me an unsung hero? No way!

[DaveGT6]

Originally Posted by Eddy V

After I stopped racing I kept the orange things on and stood on the bank nearly every weekend, as I got hooked badly by the friendship and fun you can have on post, being close to the action (sometimes too close) and getting the feeling that for once you have made yourself useful.
Some years ago I picked up marshalling in the UK and I do that about every third week or so, again because over here (UK) you are still made welcome, unlike in my home country.

Short: just for the sheer fun, friendship and great people you meet. And the donuts.
But I hate it when it rains! And never do big events anymore.

But me an unsung hero? No way!

Too right you guys are unsung heroes! Without marshalls none of us prima donnas would get to race!

This season the CSCC sort of coerced us drivers into marshalling at Cadwell park and boy am I glad that I did. Although I have a sneaking suspicion that the regular guys gave me all the hard work to do (50m of concrete to scrub in was hard work - especially the second time!) it was great fun and gave a real insight to what the orange heroes do. I think all drivers should have to marshall once per XX? years to get a sense of perspective/reality and to reintroduce some respect for the guys and gals that make it possible for us to set fire to £50 notes in the name of motorsport!

Lynx - I think you should probably have posted this on the Marshall's Forum to get a good response - perhaps the Gods will move it?

[LYNX]

DaveGT6 - take your point - though I am interested in everyone who makes it possible to race, not just the Marshalls - important though they be!

[Robin_D]

I'm another marshal, I'm 23 and have been marshalling since the age of 16. Started because I wanted to become involved and couldn't afford to race so it seemed perfect.
It fits in well with Rugby and after a rubbish week at work you can just let your hair down.

Laying down cement dust is something we have to do almost every week. It's a pain but needs to be done, otherwise we get busier

[johngee]

I got hooked on motor racing when my father took me to Brands Hatch when I was about 10. Tried my hand at driving (twice, once in saloons and once in FF) but, frankly, I was rubbish ....and I thought I'd better stop before I did any serious damage! Became a marshal, just to get closer to the action and was then offered the chance to train as a Clerk. To me, it's just helping other people to do what I can't do myself. I get a huge feeling of pleasure (well, I don't get much in life ) when a meeting runs well and I feel that I've contributed to that and sad (believe it or not) when I can't reason with a driver that's broken the rules and it has to go 'judicial'...because I'm still stupid enough to believe it's a sport (which may explain why I don't do 'certain' categories of meeting ) . Oh yes, and I get to meet a lot of really great people.
I'm very proud of that 'tag' round my neck and still get a buzz driving into the paddock on the morning of a meeting...and when either of those things stops, I'll quit!
Went to Le Mans this year - we were sitting in a stand and my g/f looked up at race control and said "This must be killing you - that's where you want to be...making it happen" ...and she was right!
That's the best I can do in explaining why I spend more than 40 days a year doing it!

[Steve Wilkinson]

My 'involvement' with motorsport started when I was 10 and my Dad took me to Oulton Park. I confined my involvement to spectating until the 1990s when in a rash moment I sent a letter to the editor of a magazine & suddenly I became a photo-journalist! I then sort of crept into competing as a result of an invitation from a friend to share his Caterham. Subsequently I was co-opted onto a championship committee and I am now a Club Committee member and help out during the Winter with a bit of marshalling om rallies whilst keeping my hand in behind the wheel during the summer.

Why do I do it? I just love the sport. I want to be involved and I want to get close to the action. I have the greatest of respect for the guys who stand out in all weathers throughout the year and feel that they are undervalued by some in our sport.

My local club instigated a Marshal of the Day award at our events which is some small way of recognising the efforts these people put in. Long may they continue. However we all need to help with either doing a spot of marshalling or helping recruit marshals from within our friends and family. Without the "Tango Troop" there would be no motor sport, something that is far too terrible to contemplate!

[terence]

As a driver,one thing I find unacceptable is on the "Slowing Down lap"is the amount of driver's who do not bother to acknowledge you people who have given thier spare time,probably travelled a long distance,just to see us playing with our toy's.A BIG thankyou to all of you,for whatever reason you have for being there.

[LYNX]

Thanks to those who have posted - could they kindly give a synopsis of how they are trained and prepared for their role in the sport.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by LYNX

Thanks to those who have posted - could they kindly give a synopsis of how they are trained and prepared for their role in the sport.

A very brief synopsis:

Marshals - mainly 'on the job' training with the addition of formal Training Days. There is a progressive grading structure and the details are very well explained on the BMMC website. Not all marshals are members of the BMMC, although many are. Those who are not, tend to follow a similar training/grading path with their own clubs (BRDC Marshals Club, BARC, BRSCC etc.). Marshals are registered with the MSA but not licenced as such.

Rescue Vehicles - The crews are all marshals who are specially trained and licenced by the MSA

Scrutineers - I think mainly (exclusively?) come from an automotive engineering background. Again mainly 'on the job' training with a grading/licencing structure and regular seminars, all administered by the MSA.

Timekeepers - I'm not certain but I believe similar to scrutineers with grading/licencing by the MSA. I think many timekeepers now have an IT background, given the technology they use.

Clerks and Stewards - I think I explained in another thread about the Appeals Procedure.

Medical - I like to think are already qualified . The majority are specialists in trauma and A&E.

They're the main categories but who have I forgotten?

[Robin_D]

Breakdown aswell John. I can't speak for anyone else but I think the guys and gals at Silverstone are volunteers also.

[Eddy V]

I'm very well trained. I can sit up straight and roll over.
Wrong thread.

Like John says, you can't really train in advance as a marshal, either you have it in you (like racing) or you don't. So most of us learn on the job and thankfully there is a lot help out there nowadays.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by Robin_D

Breakdown aswell John. I can't speak for anyone else but I think the guys and gals at Silverstone are volunteers also.

Very true Robin but I think that's unique to Silverstone. As far as I know, at most other circuits, recovery vehicles are manned by the operator and I don't know their status i.e. if they're volunteers or being paid. Whatever, they're still part of the team, and do a damn good job but I don't know what training they receive.

[Tim the Grey]

I last Marshalled back in about 1983 or so.
Sadly, my Dad dies, and I found it ever more difficult to get to events. As said elsewhere, there is a great feeling of cameraderie, and also achievement when you gain that next badge, or get a verbal pat from the Observer on post.

Plus, you have a ringside seat, for free...

[The Flagman]

Hello, my name is David and I'm a flagaholic......

Been marshallling 35yrs officially - more if you count pushing on trials with my dad since I was 6! It was his fault took me to Prescott, Shelsey, Silverstone etc. I was hooked.

Since then very few motor sport disciplines have escaped my attention. These days mainly karts (all year round) and historics (great cars - proper racing). Never done a GP though.

What motivates?
Friendship - met some great people over the years, especially on events lasting several days where downtime is spent together.
Distraction - you concentrate so hard as a flaggie. Its exhausting but is a total escape from the other world.
Memories - its great to see youngsters progress through Karts into cars. You can really see the talent very early on. In historics we have some interesting talent in dads cars - will be interesting to see them progress.
At any historic meeting there are cars that take me back to the time I spent with my late father. Its a good trip.
Communication - love it when you see drivers responding to the flags and you feel you've helped things along.

Unsung hero - don't think so. I feel I rather selfish about taking from the sport exactly what I want. It just seems to benefit all round. Keep bringing the cars out so I can wallow in nostalgia. Thanks.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by The Flagman

Unsung hero - don't think so. I feel I rather selfish about taking from the sport exactly what I want. It just seems to benefit all round.

Funny that - I feel the same way - just didn't want to admit it!

[John Turner]

Welcome, David. Great first post.

[terence]

I don't think that being selfish has anything to do with it David,if you or you're colleges were not out there,in the sometimes awfull weather,what could we do?.

[Stephen Green]

I have been marshalling for over 20 years (I think) and it all started when I saw an advertisement for marshals in a BRSCC programme at Brands Hatch.

What do I get from it? Well it's a hard one to answer really. I have met many new friends, lots of whom have helped me through troubled times. I have been fortunate enough to be able to visit circuits in other countries and marshal there too, but most of all it's the sheers excitement of watching good, close racing from the best vantage points on the circuit.

It is also really great to be able to meet and speak to so many of my heroes; Nigel Mansell, Derek Warwick, John Surtees, Murray Walker and many more over the years and the surprising thing is how 'normal' they are when they chat to you. Now that is not something you are likely to encounter as a spectator.

It is my firm belief that all volunteers take part because they have an underlying love of motorsport, you only have to look at what we all rush home to watch on the TV after a great day at the circuit.

Marshalling in particular transcends boarders as whitnessed by our great friend Eddie, who regularly come over to England to marshal. There are also guys fron Holland, Canada, USA and South Africa who when on holiday pack their overals in the hope there is a race meeting at which to officiate.

As has been pointed out earlier in this thread, when drivers do marshals they are often surprised by the warm and friendly welcome they are given. It makes me feel proud to be part of such an excellent group of people.

[LYNX]

If a driver wanted a day as a Marshall to see life from a different perspective who would be the best person/organisation to approach?

[Gerryc]

Originally Posted by LYNX

If a driver wanted a day as a Marshall to see life from a different perspective who would be the best person/organisation to approach?

LYNX - Various ways:
Talk to the Marshals Club via Stephen.
Talk to the circuit or Series or Club you want to marshal with.
Just put a request on the Marshal's forum here saying where in the country you live and what weekends you are free.

All of the above will get you lots of advice, lots of offers of assistance, lots of (friendly) abuse and will get you marshalling whenever you want. PM me if you need any specifc details.

Cheers

Gerry

[JimW]

I used to go to spectate with my parents. When I was at University I went to Brands/Lydden a few times then saw an article in Motorsport(?) which introduced me to the Marshals Club and through them I started at Brands, initially with the BRSCC. Over the 40 years since then I have done most circuit jobs and some others, in this country and a few others.

Currently I work as observer, course marshal and rescue crew, including running an independent rescue unit. Sorts of event include race, rally and sporting trial so far this year.

For many years I have enjoyed delivering and organising training for circuit and rescue.

Rescue training takes an experienced marshal (race or rally) and gives specific training in formal sessions on extrication techniques and tools. Building on (ideally) a First Aid Certificate, advanced training and practice in the medical equipment carried. Also actions in support of the doctor on the unit. Many crew will additionally take some other qualification such as EMT or First Responder.

During the time it will take this trainee to get attendance signatures at ten meetings they also have to complete around 40 on-unit short periods of instruction from the crew chief/medic. Once this is all complete, the trainee completes satisfactorily an assessment, both oral and practical, and then gets a licence from the MSA. Licence holders are re-assessed every three years.

Why do I do it?

Because I enjoy being closer to what is going on (I'm not good at being a member of the general public ) and because I enjoy the opportunity sometimes to contribute very directly to the conduct of the event and the safety of competitors.

It is very different from the various day jobs and gets me out in the fresh air and doing different things. Blessedly free of Health and Safety obsessions, even when we are working carefully and skilfully to look after proper concerns for our safety and the safety of others.

Many of my closest friends have come from contact within the sport.

Provided you avoid FIA championship events, the whole sport is pretty free of pomposity and people with too exaggerated an opinion of their importance in life. (And you can always avoid them the second time. )

Regards

Jim

[LYNX]

Thanks Jim - yours and similar involvement much appreciated.

[John Turner]

The following post has been copied from another thread at the request of LYNX

Originally Posted by Johngee

...... this is a personal view but I believe accurate.
Firstly Clerks of the Course. Suitable people to train are identified, usually by experienced clerks, in a number of ways - some have a marshalling background, some have experience as competitor. The ideal person has to have a basic mix of certain attributes - operationally able to do several things at once (surprising there aren't more lady clerks ) , not flap, have good 'powers of leadership', and a certain undefinable 'presence'. Judicially they should have clarity of thought, the ability to 'think and analise', a bit like a lawyer, a sence of balance and fairness and, I believe, the ability to calm and diffuse difficult situations. Not a nice thing to say but remember that they may have to deal with and manage a fatality (fortunately very rare).They should NOT be a control freak or on some sort of 'ego trip'.
Having identified this 'paragon of virtue', they are proposed, to the Appointments Panel at the MSA and, assuming acceptance, get a probationary licence (which only allows them to 'Assist'), commence a modular training programme, which ensures that the trainee has a good understanding of all the elements that go to make a meeting run successfully, spread over at least 6 events and each module has to be 'signed off' by the senior clerk and MSA Steward concerned. They then need further meetings and letters of recommendation to the Appointments Panel, before being issued with a National B licence (i.e. to act at National B events). I'm not going through the subsequent upgrade path but it takes several years to progress and International licences are only issued on a 'justified basis' i.e. if the club(s) you work with organise International meetings. Clerks licences are discipline specific - a race licence doesn't allow you to clerk karts, hillclimbs, sprints, rallies etc. Clerks (and Stewards) HAVE to attend a 1 day seminar every 2 years......and you can lose your licence if you don't!)

MSA Stewards come from a variety of backgrounds - a few are also clerks (a VERY personal opinion but I think being both enables you to to both better - but then I would say that, wouldn't I? ) - but it's all about an understanding of the rules and process and the ability to remain, in the background and be able to advise and support the various specialist organiserational disciplines. Also, of course, to 'hear' appeals (with the other two club stewards) and deal with very serious offences like assault. Potential MSA Stewards are always interviewed by the Appointments Panel - it's a tough interview, not a 'right of passage' and have a similar training process as a clerk with mentoring from experienced MSA Stewards. MSA Stewards tend to be 'mature' (I can't recall any below the age of 40 but I may be wrong) and are appointed to a variety of meetings - unlike clerks, we do anything - karts, rallies, autocross etc. It's a good process and works - in over 20 years, I can't recall an MSA Steward who was anything other than fair, supportive or below the standards expected by the MSA.

Lynx - I can't speak well for other countries. I believe their clerks follow a similar process. Stewards in Germany, I've found excellent, in Belgium, they're very 'Belgian' and in France they have very good lunch arrangements

Feel free to ask anything else but I think there's enough here to get me 'struck off'