So what is wrong with the Williams this time?

[GTRMagic]

The race in Istanbul has me curious about the 2 Williams cars, and their setup options for the circuit.

Watching the race live at f1.com (our local network is around an hour behind the live timing), the commentary suggested Mr Heidfeld had a right rear tyre failure, presumably as a result of contact with Mr Massa....

... while Mr Webber had a right rear tyre failure all on his own... pitted to replace the tyre, had a bangup with Mr Schumacher.. where it was suggested the blue car was entitled to the corner and then the right rear let go once again as the car spun into the gravel a short time later..... and then onto retirement....

My question here is whether the bangs with the other cars did something to each of the Williams on the same corner of the car... or indeed if there may have been a setup issue that caused the 3 tyre failures on that corner of the car.... or a casing failure only happening on the 2 blue and white cars...

.. either suggestion isnt particularly palatable.. a badly setup car or a damaged one allowed to rejoin the race....

What is the problem this time... what will it take for Williams to pull the proverbial finger out and fix these kinds of things....

(Spoken as a frustrated BMW and Williams fan.... )

[fazzaz]

Commentators on SPEED reported that Williams said the problem was the rear wing end plate touching the right rear tire (only in long left-hand corners?) and cutting the tires.

It seems odd to have this problem, to say the least.

[Dixie Flatline]

Webber catches out Schumi and breaks his nosecone. It really is going so pear-shaped for Williams this race, isn't it?

[Kicking-back]

Sam Michael has said they are investigating the problem, so it's unlikely any of us will know what it is.

[alfasud]

They need a chicane on turn 8

[emjaya]

At least with Webber,he lets his me know early in the race if I can go to bed and watch the race tomorrow.

[flor]

must have been BMW's fault

[BootsOntheSide]

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

I was amazed that they took so long to withdraw the cars. It was neither safe nor competitive to race under those circumstances.

[Kicking-back]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

He didn't say it was Michael's fault, but he said Michael could have avoided it.

Similar to what he said about Webber in Malaysia and was (wrongly) castigated for on here.

[Wrex]

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

and was (wrongly) castigated for on here.

Your really must learn to use "IMHO" more often KB.

[maximus]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

So Webber should have just stayed behind MS even though he was faster? MS should have been more aware and either just let Webber go (if Webber was a lap down it wouldn't have hurt him), or given him more room. That incident is definatly more MS's fault than Webbers.

[strider]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

Strange that Mark Blundell came to the same conclusion, then. At the time Webber was recovering from a pit stop. Why should he not try to unlap himself from TGF? It's motor racing, you know.

[D.R.T.]

Originally Posted by foxy mole

Strange that Mark Blundell came to the same conclusion, then. At the time Webber was recovering from a pit stop. Why should he not try to unlap himself from TGF? It's motor racing, you know.

It was a bit of surprise last night, I have never heard Brundle say so many positive things about Webber at one race. You can always count on Blundell though.

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

I was amazed that they took so long to withdraw the cars. It was neither safe nor competitive to race under those circumstances.

Boots.. It was Michael's fault IMHO of course.

[mp356a]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Webber was a lap behind Michael when he ran into him, which is inexcusable. How Brundle worked out that the incident was Michael's fault I don't know.

I was amazed that they took so long to withdraw the cars. It was neither safe nor competitive to race under those circumstances.

Hobbs on Speed Channel certainly thought it was Michael's fault.

[Kicking-back]

Everything I say is my opinion!

[Knowlesy]

Michael could have given room and kept his position. Not that it matters a great deal to either driver I guess......neither would've scored points.

[BSchneiderFan]

Though, from what I saw, Webber's front wheel was broadly in line with Schuey's raer wheel, which might indicate that Webber was being, well, a little optimistic, at any rate.

[Kicking-back]

Webber hit the middle of the sidepod, so was at least alongside halfway

[mp356a]

What I find frustrating is the fact that IF they knew it was the end-plate, why did they not make an "adjustment" and send the cars back out? They could have easily stayed in front of Michael's Ferrari which might prove useful at the next qualifying session.

[Kicking-back]

Well, I suspect they couldn't be sure what it was so there was no point taking a risk.

[mac]

I don't get why Schumacher was defending his position so vigorously against a guy a lap down who was clearly quicker than him. Would the smartest thing not have been to let him through and continue on with the race.

Mark did mention that Michael was weaving around in the braking zone and changing his lines, and as a result he did not feel particularly sorry for him after the incident.

Perhaps Michael was bored circulating on his own, with no real chance of points and wanted to spice up his race.

Up until his first tyre drama, Webber had been flying and quickly passed both Red Bulls - a total shame that neither Williams could reach their full potential.

[johnh875]

In the interview later in the race Schumacher said he lost sight of Webber. Hmm, maybe that was because he was no longer behind him! I suppose Schuey has not had a lot of practice at being overtaken in recent times though

[mp356a]

Originally Posted by johnh875

In the interview later in the race Schumacher said he lost sight of Webber. Hmm, maybe that was because he was no longer behind him! I suppose Schuey has not had a lot of practice at being overtaken in recent times though

That sounds oddly familiar. Didn't he say the same thing when he ran Nick off the road earlier this year? Maybe it's a mirror-malfunction or maybe the Williams cars are hard to see.....

[twig]

It's difficult to judge with the claim that Mark "was around TGF's rear wheel" - as Mark may have been braking to avoid the incident, thus making him a bit further back on Schumi's car.

It was however, optimistic of Mark, as he did have a much faster car, and could have waited - although both parties in this situation were at fault.

I'd still like to take this as an opportunity to say cheers to Mark for this weekend - almost a good quali for him, one fairly good, and one really good pass on the RB cars, and he would have been a hero had it of worked on MS. Damn shame for Williams though.

Is it possible to say something to the extent of "now we know where the speed was coming from" with the Williams'? I know you essentially sacrifice durability with speed - was there no trade off - was the speed genuine, and this was just another problem completely seperate to the performance of the cars?