Alonso's pass - Page 5

Rockmunky · 24 Jul 2007, 09:39 (Ref:1971888)

I think we should too. We're never satisfied, one minute we moan that all the drivers are corporate robots and that there's never enough close racing. The next minute, when there is some decent racing with the slightest bit of contact, and a little heated discussion about it between two supposed corporate robots, we still moan and try to find fault.

Felipe Rulz · 24 Jul 2007, 10:26 (Ref:1971942)

Sorry if somebody already posted this, but I didn't read all the replies. This is the best response to the whole thing that I've heard.

Felipe Massa “I was really surprised when he came to say that I did that on purpose. I would never do something like that on purpose. Like I said in Barcelona, it was normal, here it was normal and it’s going to be like that. So if he was a little bit unhappy, it’s not my problem."

It was hilarious.

I loved it.

Go Felipe!

JamesH · 24 Jul 2007, 10:37 (Ref:1971958)

Quote:

Originally Posted by LampCord

I can't honestly say that I would have acted any differently then EITHER of them after that race. I commend them both for not allowing it to come to blows.

Its only natural that in the heat of the moment with so much on the line and in such difficult conditions that emotions would run high after a late race pass with contact for the lead.

How they behave towards each other in the coming races and seasons after they've both had a chance to calm down a bit will say a lot more to me.

Absolutely. Imagine you are Alonso, you just pulled off a great overtake and think you are clear then suddenly you feel a big thump on the side of the car. A bit forward or aft of that and you could easily have gone off or had a puncture - you immediately think someones trying to punt you to get the place back whether its true or not (I know, I've been in similar circumstances). It's bound to put you in a bit of a mood, but once seen in video I am sure neither driver will have a problem with what happened. Just a bit of end of race emotion (and its was a pretty topsy turvy race already).

James

Mr V · 24 Jul 2007, 12:57 (Ref:1972095)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljakse

IMHO, that 'tyre vibrations' is just an excuse for his pure lack of speed in wet, and after reading this thread, I'm curious if anybody shares that opinion?

Massa was quick enough at the start of the race when the wet weather conditions were far worse. I'll go along with Ferrari and Felipe's tyre vibrations reason.

Mr V · 24 Jul 2007, 13:01 (Ref:1972102)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Hans

Their overtaking moves on Fisichella and Alonso we're geniune heart-in-mouth moments for me. Thrilling stuff.

Errr, don't you mean Massa?

The race was great for overtaking, but overtaking a slower car using a McLaren isn't as good as say, Heikki getting past Wurz, in the dry, on comparable fuel loads.

I also thought Webber's overtake on Winklehock (candy from a baby

) and DC, at the same time was good, if not a touch cheeky

Super Hans · 24 Jul 2007, 13:12 (Ref:1972108)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr V

Errr, don't you mean Massa?

Yes! Oops.

Inigo Montoya · 24 Jul 2007, 13:17 (Ref:1972113)

Beautiful pass by Alonso, and nothing naughty from Massa. Alonso was just pumped up after his win, and IMHO said something stupid.

It was interesting that the argument between the Spaniard and the Brazilian during the weigh in, took place in Italian!

littleman · 24 Jul 2007, 13:50 (Ref:1972133)

Used to think Alonso was the complete driver, but sadly, in recent times, he's displayed too many outburst's of the 'spoilt brat' syndrome.

In my view he was fortunate to pull that move off on Massa. Schumacher or Senna would have run him out to the grass and hung him out to dry!

Massa was extremely polite and that's why Schumacher climbed straight off the pit wall - probably thought he was a wimp!

Mr V · 24 Jul 2007, 14:06 (Ref:1972161)

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleman

Massa was extremely polite and that's why Schumacher climbed straight off the pit wall - probably thought he was a wimp!

Or maybe Michael needed to go and freshen up and get changed to present Ron with the trophey on the podium?

littleman · 24 Jul 2007, 14:16 (Ref:1972168)

Nah! Schumacher would have stayed on the pit wall to cheer Massa over the line - he looked totally unimpressed to me.

**Bononi** · 24 Jul 2007, 14:29 (Ref:1972178)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inigo Montoya

It was interesting that the argument between the Spaniard and the Brazilian during the weigh in, took place in Italian!

I agree with that... well, I always said brazilians are more italians than iberians...

Inigo Montoya · 24 Jul 2007, 15:03 (Ref:1972197)

I also think that Italian has some very, shall we say, "colourful" swear words. That makes it a good choice for such discussions

**Bononi** · 24 Jul 2007, 15:58 (Ref:1972249)

Actually... in love and swearing is hard to beat the italian language...

Oh... in the end, both are very useful...

OJB · 24 Jul 2007, 16:10 (Ref:1972252)

I do wonder what the fuss is about - superb pass by Alonso, some contact because Massa probably ran a smidge too wide but there was a McLaren sized gap there and Alonso took it. It didn't look controversial at all to me...

If the two had gone off then there would be more to say, but to me that looked like how racing should be - hard, competitive and exciting!

Massa will look annoyed - he led for 50 laps and lost out with 5 laps to go, Alonso probably had an adrenalin overdose and went a bit crazy at him for a brief moment. I'm sure they'll get over it

Knowlesy · 24 Jul 2007, 18:24 (Ref:1972340)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr V

Massa was quick enough at the start of the race when the wet weather conditions were far worse. I'll go along with Ferrari and Felipe's tyre vibrations reason.

I certainly believe that too, no reason to doubt it.

But comparison with the first wet segment is difficult. It was very brief and so randomised with the waterlogged bits that it was hard to say if some were backing off in anticipation of a stoppage or whatever.

**Bononi** · 24 Jul 2007, 23:00 (Ref:1972586)

No matter what happened in the track and then that discussion before the podium, it's all settled now.

Felipe didn't accept Alonso's apologies.

**Born Racer** · 25 Jul 2007, 09:12 (Ref:1972852)

I've been pondering this and have been wondering a few things.

When Alonso accused Massa of deliberately hitting him is he referring to the pass he made? Or did they actually touch at Turn 1 just beforehand? (It was certainly close)

Or was Alonso criticising Massa for running him out so wide at Turn 1? If so, this is obviously a different criticism of him he was making from when he pointed at his sidepod, which would suggest he wasn't too impressed Massa ran into him during the pass?

Or was Alonso trying to wind Massa up to inflict some long-term pyschological damage? It certainly looks like he's trying to wind him up when he gives him the sarcastic thumbs up and then punches his fists towards the camera in celebration.

Super Hans · 25 Jul 2007, 09:17 (Ref:1972857)

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleman

Massa was extremely polite and that's why Schumacher climbed straight off the pit wall - probably thought he was a wimp!

Surely a good thing. I'd rather see a driver race fairly, than punt a rival off the track. Massa should be respected for giving Fernando racing room.

Dutton · 25 Jul 2007, 09:27 (Ref:1972862)

To be fair, Michael, in the vast majority of situations, would give people just enough room to live (but no more), but would not be unfair about things. There were occasions like Silverstone '03 when he pushed it over the edge, but, if we are honest, these occasions happened a lot less than the others when there was not a problem.

He would also, IMO, not complain about things that went against him (such as Hock and Austria '00, Nurb '03, Arg '97).

Having said that, though, he was subject to occasional (and I truly interpet it to be occasional) bizarre interpretations: his comments regarding Trulli in Australia '01(?), for instance.

**Born Racer** · 26 Jul 2007, 11:15 (Ref:1973831)

So can anyone fill me in on the following-

When Alonso accused Massa of hitting him deliberately, is he referring to the moment when he made the pass or the thing at turn 1 shortly before?

Did they even collide at turn 1? (presumably if that is the incident Alonso is referring to, they must have.)

**Born Racer** · 26 Jul 2007, 11:20 (Ref:1973835)

Actually I've just seen someone's transcript of the Italian (I speak some Italian myself, but it's quite hard to hear what was said) and apparantly Alonso never accused Massa of hitting him deliberately. He actually pointed out that he damaged his sidepod (hai rotto tutto il deflettore, guardalo! ) "You broke my sidepod, look"

Now I'm very confused

I know some might say this is irrelevant, but I think it's interesting to work out what they were thinking at the time. It's interesting pyschology from the heat of the moment and useful to know to understanding these sportsmen.

Inigo Montoya · 26 Jul 2007, 11:24 (Ref:1973838)

I watched it live here on italian tv. You could clearly hear Alonso's first words were:

Lo hai fatto apposta come a Barcellona

You did it on purpose just like in Barcellona.

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