Should NASCAR follow NFL to the UK?

[Stephen H]

The French race car series have an oval on their calendar for 2012. Don't remember seeing them have an oval race before? Think they used the road course at Daytona.

From what I can make out its a tempory oval at an event at Tours, tickets seem pricey too.

As this year, they are back at Brands with the DTM for 2012.

If they are feeling the need for an oval race, shame they are going to a temp 600m oval when we have Rockingham, the Eurospeedway and Venray in Europe.

When they came to Brands, the drivers seemed pleased to race in front of a crowd.

If there is a connection between race car and NASCAR, maybe the best we could hope for is a current or former NASCAR driver guesting in a French racecar, if the series could be temped to a permanent european oval.

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by Stephen H

The French race car series have an oval on their calendar for 2012. Don't remember seeing them have an oval race before? Think they used the road course at Daytona.

From what I can make out its a tempory oval at an event at Tours, tickets seem pricey too.

According to their site it's a temporary 600m oval indoors. Not sure how much it will resemble this, which certainly looks like an interesting concept.

[Down F0rce]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

According to their site it's a temporary 600m oval indoors. Not sure how much it will resemble this, which certainly looks like an interesting concept.

The Racecar Series run full scale stock cars - the cars in the video you posted are a wee bit smaller than that:



I can't see the full field running on a 600m track, unless they do it in heats.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by chunder

But, NASCAR is so utterly American, far mroe than NFL and NBA, it is baseball, no one here gets why the Yanks like it!

I am no Nascar fan, I did used to watch it growing up in the 1980's and 1990's and have been to races, but I can't say I follow it regularly.

But I think you have to see it in person to understand why people like it. When 40 V8 powered cars punch through the air in front of you at 190 mph, you'll get it.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

Yep, I've been to 7 Formula 1 Grand Prixs, 4 ALMS races, various Grand Am races, 2 Le Mans, and various AOW races as well as NASCAR, and out of all of those, NASCAR is by far the best spectator experience, especially on the short tracks.

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by JHamilton

I've had an even better idea. Bring Nascar over and have the Bears and Packers play in the infield at the same time. Only serve corndogs, fried snickers bars, and budweiser.

OT, but I came across Bowman Gray stadium online the other day. Home of the Winston-Salem State Rams. There is a quarter mile oval around the field.

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by Down F0rce

The Racecar Series run full scale stock cars - the cars in the video you posted are a wee bit smaller than that:

I know that, IIRC they're Minicup cars - little generator engines. They certainly look like a grade one barrel of laughs though, I'd like to see someone take a fleet of them over to the UK and race them in arenas and so-on on Wednesday nights, according to their figures it really is low cost motorsport. I've now got the mental image of 50+ of them racing on a road course (in that terms of size) around the Millennium Stadium ...

I can't see the full field running on a 600m track, unless they do it in heats.

I think it's going to be in heats of 12-14 or so. I suppose at 600m it's only 200m shorter than Bristol and Martinsville, but indoors and with less experienced drivers. I don't think a full field would exactly be a sensible idea ....

Originally Posted by JHamilton

OT, but I came across Bowman Gray stadium online the other day. Home of the Winston-Salem State Rams. There is a quarter mile oval around the field.

And people already complain when there are running tracks around football stadia ...

[FIRE]

Late models at Bowman Gray (1/4 mile / 400m):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1BFXST_c8o

[Minicross424]

[QUOTE=duke_toaster;3002036]I know that, IIRC they're Minicup cars - little generator engines. They certainly look like a grade one barrel of laughs though, I'd like to see someone take a fleet of them over to the UK and race them in arenas and so-on on Wednesday nights, according to their figures it really is low cost motorsport. I've now got the mental image of 50+ of them racing on a road course (in that terms of size) around the Millennium Stadium ...QUOTE]

They kind of do already.
Its called mascar, check it out:
http://www.mascar.co.uk/site/

[tony s]

EURO-RACECAR officially recognized by NASCAR as a NASCAR Touring Series.

http://www.racecarseries.com/

[FIRE]

A shame they race not on a real oval like Venray. Although that has more to do with noise situation at Venray.

[Paradise City]

'Euro-racecar' doesn't seem unprecedented. The only thinks that looks new is the NASCAR 'brand' stamped on the series.

[nickyf1]

NASCAR appears on the trailer for the new series of Top Gear. Looks like Richard went over to Texas to experience the racing and try out a car!

Could this be the BBC perhaps introducing NASCAR to it's viewers? It already shows the Superbowl.

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Originally Posted by nickyf1

NASCAR appears on the trailer for the new series of Top Gear. Looks like Richard went over to Texas to experience the racing and try out a car!

Could this be the BBC perhaps introducing NASCAR to it's viewers? It already shows the Superbowl.

Hopefully not. Not wishing to sound nationalistic, but I'd much rather BBC go back to showing motorsport like WRC or some GT racing, even WEC. BBC used to be great at showing a lot of different forms of racing during the days of Grandstand, hopefully some day we'll get back to that.

[Jacques Rabbit]

I have a sneaking suspicion Top Gear isn't exactly out to portray NASCAR in the most pro-NASCAR fashion. Not that they're going to do a smear job, either, I just mean that they're obviously going to have a lot of light-hearted jabs about it, as they do with anything, and then draw a fair conclusion in the end of course. Point being, I think if you were trying to introduce NASCAR to a prospective audience, I'm not sure you would use a show that will make a satire of it to really do that...

...but then again, maybe NASCAR would sell better to a foreign audience if it isn't taken so seriously, given that it is a bit...different to what many would be used to?

That said, it would be interesting to see how NASCAR would do viewership-wise if some of the bigger races and perhaps the road courses were televised on one of the BBC channels. Does anyone have the figures for NASCAR's viewership at present in the U.K.? I know they're on a bit of an obscure channel. I'd be interested to see the figures for any non-U.S. country, actually, just out of pure curiosity.

[leothedrummer]

Originally Posted by Jacques Rabbit

I'd be interested to see the figures for any non-U.S. country, actually, just out of pure curiosity.

When Marcos Ambrose started racing in the Nationwide series, Channel Ten (a free-to-air channel here in Aus) bought the TV rights and showed all of the races live+delayed highlights. When he moved on the Cup series, they dropped the Nationwide coverage but bought the rights to show delayed highlights of the whole Cup season, as well as rights to the entire live coverage of the night races (a Saturday night NASCAR race usually starts between 9-10:30am on a Sunday morning here, Sunday afternoon races - 2am Monday morning).

Unfortunately, I don't have any figures to give you, but there has definitely been a visible increase in popularity and for a free-to-air network to think it was worth paying for says a lot IMO.

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Originally Posted by Jacques Rabbit

That said, it would be interesting to see how NASCAR would do viewership-wise if some of the bigger races and perhaps the road courses were televised on one of the BBC channels. Does anyone have the figures for NASCAR's viewership at present in the U.K.? I know they're on a bit of an obscure channel. I'd be interested to see the figures for any non-U.S. country, actually, just out of pure curiosity.

I don't know the exact viewing figures, but you're right, it is on a subscription only channel. However, I think last year all the races were shown in their entirety live, which I believe differs from previous years where they were condensed down into a one hour highlights package a week after the race. So if you do find viewing figures, you're more likely to find that in this country at least, last year saw an improvement.

Saying that however, any sporting event that is on subscription only does horribly in ratings. Doesn't matter if it is even a big football match. I recall hearing about a semi-final of some football league (I don't pay attention to football at all as you know so I'm not sure exactly what is was) on Sky only got 2 and a bit million viewers, whereas that week's antiques road show got the same amount, if not a little bit more, on BBC. Then there's the time difference as well, I know that quite a few races NASCAR does finish quite late and on a Sunday evening I doubt many would be stopping up to watch the race live to 2am in the morning.

I don't want to sound like I'm beating up on NASCAR too much, don't get me wrong, I'd love to see it succeed, or indeed any other form of motorsport to succeed and once again be shown on one of the main channels. It'd be nice to see another form of racing get the BTCC sort of treatment, with the 6-7 hours of live coverage on race day and then extended highlights for days after. It is just hard to see from my perspective why BBC would potentially be willing to spend money on getting the rights to show NASCAR when they have no idea really whether it is going to be successful or a complete waste of money. But I guess you have to start somewhere.

[Paradise City]

There's space to broadcast a free-to-air Nationwide ding-dong roadcourse event on BBC3. It would hark back to the era of the old BTCC. It wouldn't intrude on their schedule much as that channel only broadcasts cheap tat anyway.

[nickyf1]

EDIT - The trailer - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=La7VkZCDSUs

We used to get the Daytona 500 tape-delayed on Channel 5. I'm not too sure how well it did back then, but it was something.

NASCAR has ended up on Premier Sports, which seems to have picked up some of the stuff that Setanta was responsible for before ESPN took over (GAA Gaelic Football, Celtic/Rangers TV and what not).

By the looks of the trailer, the Top Gear team seem to be looking at NASCAR in good light, it shows Richard Hammond driving around Texas Motor Speedway in one of their experience stock cars.

With the superbowl on BBC and the NFL becoming quite successful over here (several of my friends follow the NFL religiously alongside regular Footy), I guess american sports have become more marketable than ever with the UK audience. Perhaps people over here just like the idea of ''Superbowl Sunday'' as an excuse to have a party (Our only equivalent is the World or European Cup final), and like the whole idea of being ''american'' for a night.

And if terrestrial TV (is it still called that?) was going to show any other kind of motorsport, they would rather show something that already had a large following and packed stands than trying to build something up from low-hype and low-fan count (GT1, WTCC... I'm looking at you).

I mean, look at the recent hype around Aussie V8's on US TV!

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Originally Posted by nickyf1

And if terrestrial TV (is it still called that?) was going to show any other kind of motorsport, they would rather show something that already had a large following and packed stands than trying to build something up from low-hype and low-fan count (GT1, WTCC... I'm looking at you).

I'd agree to disagree on that. Sure, NASCAR is clearly popular in America, but I'm not sure it's "already" popular in the UK.

I generally believe if something like the WTCC returned on free to view channels in the UK, it'd do a hell of a lot better, because let's face it, some BTCC guys have ended up there, and there's a lot of familiar names to BTCC fans too. WRC suffers from the same problem. I remember for a while it was shown on Dave, and whilst that's not great, it's better than not having it on free to view at all. The British round of the WRC is always highly attended.

Heck, if a broadcaster wanted to go completely left field, get live coverage for an event like the Silverstone Classic or Goodwood Revival.

[Jacques Rabbit]

Actually, nickyf1 has a very good point.

No, NASCAR isn't popular in the U.K., but it has more potential to be than some of the other series (i.e. WTCC) for two big reasons:

1) It's something no one's ever really seen before, so you could reach a fanbase that may not be watching any kind of racing at all right now, rather than just recycling the same viewers. And that's typically the goal: unique viewership (whether that be more people who are paying for the TV license on free-to-air, or more people subscribing, or more people buying the products advertised during the breaks).

2) Because it is popular in America. No, I am not implying that everything big in America goes big in Britain, but there is value in it's popularity here for one massive reason: it creates an atmosphere of something huge. NASCAR has a "big event" feel. Yeah, the grandstands are packed with Americans, but they're still packed. Never underestimate the mentality of "holy **** there are a lot of people enjoying this, I guess I should, too" because it is so prevalent in the typical television viewer/casual fan. Every NASCAR race is the Grand Prix of Monaco or Indianapolis 500 (while still having a grassroots, down-home feel). You feel like every event matters, like every event is absolutely massive, and that there are millions of people who are REALLY passionate about this stuff.

It's a similar principle to being attracted to a "less pretty" girl with self-confidence over a tremendously beautiful girl who refuses to believe anyone could ever love her. NASCAR, being surrounded by such a passionate culture and a large fanbase in the U.S. translates to the British viewer who does not follow motorsports too closely as a healthier, bigger, more important series than one that doesn't have the image NASCAR has (i.e. having small, quiet crowds; not having big sponsors; not having drivers who are promoted as absolute stars; having less cars in the field, etc).

Perception is reality. NASCAR carries itself in a way that if viewed with an open-mind, people will perceive it as something huge, and more people will be attracted to that than anything else.

[Paradise City]

Three hour oval races filled with Americans commented on by Americans [only Americans can do NASCAR justice] wouldn't be popular with a mainstream British audience. A station would be nuts to broadcast that on a primetime slot with a major channel. That kind of TV might have a place on one of the niche channels or as highlights on the main channels at witching hour.

I think NASCAR events at Road America, Montreal and Watkins Glen would be popular. It would tap the same racing funny bone as the BTCC has tapped. But of course NASCAR events on roadcourses are far too few and far between to justify that.

[nickyf1]

It's not about whether or not it's on an oval or a road course. People here don't care about that, they don't watch anything but F1.

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Originally Posted by nickyf1

It's not about whether or not it's on an oval or a road course. People here don't care about that, they don't watch anything but F1.

Again, I'd politely disagree.

I hate to keep making the same points over and over - but Silverstone Classic drew 80,000 people last year. Goodwood Revival and Classic always draws good numbers, BTCC's been on an upwards surge for a while in terms of TV viewers and track side attendence, and events like the British round of the MotoGP and WRC always get good numbers of people as well.

Britain likes motor racing. But for whatever reason, even F1 fails to get the same sort of press coverage as things like footbore, rugby, and whatever other boring nonsense is claimed as a sport.

I do find it quite amusing that as soon as an F1 season is over, you hear very little about it in the winter. It must be to some casual fans like everyone involved in F1 takes an extended winter holiday, when in reality, there's loads going on behind the scenes with driver signings, car releases, testing, etc, etc. Sky hasn't devoted any time to F1 at all before know, refusing to acknowlege its existence, and the only time any other motorsport gets a mention is when there's been a bad crash or the time when Nicholas Hamilton made his racing debut in the Clios.

I think the attitude of the BBC recently has been that in terms of motorsport, they've only had eyes for F1 because it has the tagline of being the "pinnacle of motorsport".

What I'm trying to say in a rather long winded way is that I have no doubt that there IS potential interest in the UK for NASCAR or any other form of racing that'd be new to the UK audience, but as ever, the main issue is the publicity. It seems as if many broadcasters only really care about promoting sports like football, cricket, rugby etc over motorsport. Why, I don't know. Maybe it's something to do with it being a dangerous sport. Maybe it is something to do with the environmental issue. Basically, if F1 at times can't even compete to make the news, and a home grown series like the BTCC can't either, then I really can't see how NASCAR would.

[ptclaus98]

If NASCAR were to do this, and it took a foothold, I fear for motorsport in Britain, and in Europe as a whole.Of course, the FIA and Bernie would kill it before it got too big, I think.


Be careful what you wish for.