Renault returning to Le Mans?

[lms]

here is the story on autosport.com:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105905

im hoping this effort is similar to the lotus lmp2 programme: rebadging in the 1st year, and then a caterham designed chassis next year

[KA]

Originally Posted by Simmi

It's another brand involved which is true enough. But I think this clearly all about marketing vs performance. Nice for the French. Not really something anyone will notice unless they slap a livery on it.

Doesn't become exciting unless there's some real intent behind it in the future. No difference between this and the Lotus/Judd rebadging or the Morgan/OAK switch.

Autosport think it'll be Alpine blue, so at least it should look nice.
A rebadged Oreca-Nissan isn't the most exciting announcement ever, but it has the potential to be the start of something bigger...

[GT6]

Well a little more interest in the LMP2 class but lets wait and see how much involvement from Renault there is in this rebranding or if it will just be another also ran in the junior class

[deggis]

Said Carlos Tavares, Chief Operating Officer, Renault: “Alpine’s return to the legendary Le Mans 24 Hours in 2013 marks the beginning of a new adventure which is set to last. The passion that drives us is matched only by the humility and careful attention paid to costs that epitomise this comeback which itself has been made possible thanks to the involvement of our partners and supporters who I would like to thank formally here. Together, step by step, we will do our very best to write another exciting page in the history of Alpine, a truly outstanding name in the world of French sports cars.”

lol. The press release is so "blah blah blah blah blah".

[ger80]

Originally Posted by deggis

lol. The press release is so "blah blah blah blah blah".

Is Rubens Barrichello driving?

[isynge]

One person's "blah blah" is another's measured and realistic statement.

I think we all allowed ourselves to think that this was going to be a declaration of a pair of first rank Alpine Renault LMP1s for 2014, and perhaps unsurprisingly it's not - it's a toe in the water, and it's not a lot more than a bit of paintwork at the moment.

But let's take a deep breath. It's another major car manufacturer with its brand on the grid, this manufacturer is clearly investing in its Alpine brand, and looking at Le Mans, there's evidence that programmes take a bit of time to build (look at Toyota, look at Nissan). This first step is small, like all of them, but it's incredibly important and I worry that if we collectively greet how Renault have chosen to approach this with a collective "Meh" and asking why they hadn't the foresight to have clones of Pironi and Jassaud to drive it we're cutting our noses off to spite our faces.

At risk of mixing sporting metaphors, little acorns produce great oaks - look at where Nicolet's involvement started, and where it's ended up.

I'll give them a cheer at Silverstone next month, and at Le Mans in June. I know I'll be disappointed that it won't look anything like an A442, but if the choice is between this and nothing, or even this and the pre-existing Signatech entry, I know which I'll choose.

[Simmi]

Well said that man.

[Adam43]

I shouldn't speak on behalf of someone else, but I think the incredulity comes from the real alternative being that they might not have bothered at all. One day we don't have an entry and then as soon as one comes along we don't think it is good enough. Beggers/choosers.

Strange classes, toes in water, spending their money making their own choices, it has always been thus.

Listening to people's opinions on how to go racing is interetsting. There is nothing wrong, especially on a discussion forum, in expressing an opinion that the approach should be different. Perhaps sometimes we just come across as whinging that we didn't quite get what we wanted for Christmas?

Sorry that is all a bit too deep. What about motor racing?

[Simmi]

I think a lot of the complaints have come from people setting their expectations too high and being suckered in by the hype (me included).

If you just look at it in terms of net gain - a major manufacturer in G56 and a potential P1 programme/a famous make returning to Le Mans and the associated PR boost - there's not really a lot you can complain about.

[Adam43]

apart from the colour

[isynge]

I'm scratching my head about a lot of this, as I hope I came across in my previous post.

There's no bad news in what either Renault or Nissan have done over the last few days, all of it contributes to the flavour of racing we love, and with Nissan in particular, resonates with my identification of Le Mans as a race which embraces the new and where needed creates a regulatory environment which fosters this.

Think about it - it's the exceptions that stand out - and not in a good way; to take two, the exclusion of the Mirage in 1982 (and surely there's more of a subtext beyond that in Horsman's book to be told about this) and the rigid prescription of the 3.5 litre are recalled as bad things - why then are we resenting something innovative?

Put another way - does anyone seriously have a substantive objection to a Signatech entered Alpine-Nissan in 2013?

[deggis]

Originally Posted by isynge

Put another way - does anyone seriously have a substantive objection to a Signatech entered Alpine-Nissan in 2013?

Definitely no, but do I still have to like sticker engineering? This good news but I don't see it as a manufacturer involvement, I see it as a sponsorship deal, because that's what it is really.

[Mal]

Perhaps the plan ultimately is to have both manufacturers running, sharing a P1 chassis but using different engines - Alpine using the F1 unit and Nissan the new electric or whatever it is.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Mal

Perhaps the plan ultimately is to have both manufacturers running, sharing a P1 chassis but using different engines - Alpine using the F1 unit and Nissan the new electric or whatever it is.

Seems like a huge investment to come from a relative "small" manufacture (compared to the VAG group). Also both cars, the Nissan and the Alpine would be compromises of the other, and therefor less likely to be equivalent to the focused efforts of Toyota, Audi and Porsche.

[The Badger]

It should not be allowed to rebadge a chassis . If its homologated as an Oreca , it an Oreca ..... end of .

Pretty sad effort from Signatech so far anyway .....

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by CTD

Seems like a huge investment to come from a relative "small" manufacture (compared to the VAG group). Also both cars, the Nissan and the Alpine would be compromises of the other, and therefor less likely to be equivalent to the focused efforts of Toyota, Audi and Porsche.

I might be wrong but the whole Alpine piece seems completely separate from Renault itself. That's what is now making me think the RCE article was more wishful thinking.

[jc_nl]

Why sad from Signatech?

They were looking for a sponsor for their program and found one, that doesn't seem sad to me.

The way Alpine/Renault are activating it might be questionable to us diehard fans. But we are only a very small percentage of their target audience, the majority probably will think it's a cool link.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by jc_nl

But we are only a very small percentage of their target audience, the majority probably will think it's a cool link.

That doesn't make it any better really, because that is the whole point. Marketing is often based on lies and rebranding is essentially that: making less informed people to believe the car is something it isn't. They are sort of going to get away with it and masses will believe it is really Alpine.

[jc_nl]

True, but you should not blame that on Signatech, that was the point I was trying to make. Al they did was find cash to run their team.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by deggis

That doesn't make it any better really, because that is the whole point. Marketing is often based on lies and rebranding is essentially that: making less informed people to believe the car is something it isn't. They are sort of going to get away with it and masses will believe it is really Alpine.

A good question to ask in this debate is:
What is the difference between ordering a chassis to be constructed from a manufacture (like Oreca), or "buying" an existing chassis to mark as your own.

The end result is the same, a car running with a name other than the company which build it. The masses will never know the difference, but the die-hard-fans will know anyway.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by jc_nl

True, but you should not blame that on Signatech, that was the point I was trying to make. Al they did was find cash to run their team.

I'm not, I'm blaming the manufacturer.

Originally Posted by CTD

A good question to ask in this debate is:
What is the difference between ordering a chassis to be constructed from a manufacture (like Oreca), or "buying" an existing chassis to mark as your own.

The end result is the same, a car running with a name other than the company which build it. The masses will never know the difference, but the die-hard-fans will know anyway.

The difference is that in the other case the chassis has not existed with another name previously. Also there will not be two identical chassis with different name. In principle big difference.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by jc_nl

Why sad from Signatech?

They were looking for a sponsor for their program and found one, that doesn't seem sad to me

I mean in general , as the official preferred Nissan team , not very good results , imo . Other Oreca/Nissan teams have a much better record .

[Acid09]

Signatech won the ILMC LMP2 class in 2011, they had a much stronger driver lineup then.

I think not every GT Academy winner will turn out to be as strong as Lucas Ordonez, Jordan Tresson didn't exactly light the world on fire.

[gwyllion]

The Signatech Alpine livery:


source: http://endurance-info.com/version2/a...nce-16841.html

[Simmi]

Decent livery. Quite funny that they have a sponsor 'Identicar' for a re-badged effort.