Sato: Engine-wrecker?

[NiceGuyEddie]

F1racing.net reports that BAR is mystified over the number of enginefailures Sato is enduring this season. Dave Richards seem to start thinking that there´s more than just plain bad luck to this, and perhaps he has a point. There certainly seems to be a patern at hand here. There is something structurally wrong with the engines in Satos´car. Well, the only real difference between Sato´s car and Buttons car is...the driver. So, Sato is a suspect. Could it be that Sato is wrecking the Honda? Could it be that his agressive style is just too hard on the engine?

If that is the case, why didn´t they discover this last year, when Sato laid done many, many testmiles? In 2002 Sato didn´t seem to harm more engines than whoever else. In Indy, Sato drove especially agressive, even for his doing, but the engine held through (and funnily enough, Button´s gearbox broke). In France the engine was done (again just after a pitstop) in about 15 or so laps, yet Magny Cours doesn´t seem to stretch the engines as much as Indy does (longer straight, more topspeed).

Fact is that nor the team, nor Honda seems to have an idea as to what is causing these failures, yet Honda will have done extensive research on the failed engine (as one must assume).

Is it time to poke an accusing finger at Sato yet?

[darcym]

engine wrecker, car wrecker, race wrecker, people defend him a lot but he appears to have a lot of "tags" he's unable to shake.....there must be SOME element to his way of racing that contributes to these tags.

[Jordi]

The only difference between Jacques and Jenson last year was the car only, as well, and Jacques did have more failures (though they were a variety a problems, not just engine).

I think it's more down to Honda's incapability to make an engine strong enough. Drivers should be able to push their machines to the absolute limit and beyond.

[Kirk]

JV, also an aggressive driver, experienced similar problems last year; as improved as BAR is this year, this particular gremlin persists.

Some have speculated that Sato's excessive use of the traction control could be a factor. I'm not sure of the relevance though, but perhaps some engineer types may enlighten me.

[Kicking-back]

It's possible the mechanics who work on Sato's car do something minutely different in the installation.

[darcym]

eg: not put oil in ?

[f1manoz]

It's certainly starting to become a theme of Sato's year... Obviously it has to come down to driving style or something, because Button isn't suffering as much as Sato.

[Aysedasi]

Originally posted by Kicking-back
It's possible the mechanics who work on Sato's car do something minutely different in the installation.

On the other hand, it could be something (minute or otherwise) that Sato does when he's driving it......

[NiceGuyEddie]

Originally posted by f1manoz
It's certainly starting to become a theme of Sato's year... Obviously it has to come down to driving style or something, because Button isn't suffering as much as Sato.

That would be interesting, because I believe it was Patrick Head who stated that modernday F1-engines are fitted with limiters and stuff that make it impossible for a driver to wreck it. It was said in answer to Ralf who stated that JPM lost the German GP of 2001 at his own doing. JPM's engine let go, just after his pitstop.

I find it also remarkable that Honda apperantly hasn't succeeded in pinning down the problem. Something in the engine broke during the race, no matter if it happened for a strictly mechanical reason or because of Sato's drivingstyle. Surely they should be able to reveal the cause of the failure eachtime it has happened. If the cause was the same every single time, than it is obvious what needs to be done about. Even if it would point to Sato's drivingstyle, the team would be in the position to talk to Sato about adapting a certain drivingstyle (whether it be the way he uses TC, or the way he changes gear or whatnot).

The fact that till this day they don't know what causes these failures, makes it likely that the factual problem lies somewhere else every time. But if that is the case, than there is no genuine argument that Sato is at fault.

Besides, if Sato was at fault, how come the engine didn't burst 10 out of 10 starts? At the beforementioned Indy race, the engine obviously had no problem with Sato's drivingstyle whatsoever. Sato wasn't particularly cautious and was driving very agressively, yet the engine delivered and Sato got the podium.

So if that engine can cope with Sato's drivingstyle and the Imola-, Bahrain-, Nurburgring-, Magny Cours-engine are not, than those engines are apperantly inferior to the Indy-engine. So then it cannot be Sato who is at fault.

[darcym]

the point about Montoya in 2001 is valid, but also not really the same any more. The gears used to autoshift up and down, the teams could control the engine config from the pits, the gears used to pre-select before shifting there was a lot more gizmos o the car, there is now more room for a driver to effect the engine with TC, early/late shifting, missing the oil pump button at the right moment etc etc so Sato could certainly effect it.

I know BAR developed a new startup routine for the engines (both of them) this year - maybe that has an effect. Buttons engineers maybe better at using it (takes about 1 hour I believe)

[Adam43]

FYI a recent thread on teh subject: http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...ht=sato+engine

[mp356a]

They should look at the pit-in instead of the pit-out. I think that Sato has a much more aggressive (and time-saving) pit-in strategy than his teammate. He seems to have a lot of these failures shortly after pit stops and I'd not be at all surprised to see that the software (i.e. pit speed limiter) is breaking the car.
Of course I could be wrong.....
Mike

[Tamás]

Our commentators in Hungary are convinced that Sato's car has an other engine. I think it isn't real; Sato is like Massa: he tends to drive aggressiv and rapid, but he does more harm than good.

[Tye]

It is shameful to see Sato have these types of problems with his engine. I hope people open their eyes and get a clue as to what is going on with this team. It is getting downright embarrassing.

I wonder what Sato is thinking at the moment?

I just hope the Button fans don't start running around saying...'Button blew him away.' Sato now knows how Villeneuve feels and there isn't much he can do. It is impossible to draw a truthful and accurate comparison between the two.

Kicking-back:

It's possible the mechanics who work on Sato's car do somethingg minutely different in the installation.

I'm sure the team and mechanics have worked collectively on this problem, if not, then this team clearly isn't working in the best interests of Sato. It really is too bad because Sato has easily been a match for Button.

I'm sure Dave is smiling again.

Tye

[Spudgun]

Well, the drivers this season have to activate the semi-automatic gearbox themselves on the steering paddles. There is rev-limit on the up-shift, but perhaps the damage is being done on down-shift? The rev-limiter is there, but on down-shift you can't defy the law of physics (if he's down-shifting too early). Could this be the problem? Just my speculation of course.

[1200Datto27]

The downshift will not engage a gear if the engine is out of limitis, ie, downshifting at max throttle and revs will not drop a gear, the ECU will reject it. This was left in as a money saving issue.

[65bc]

Originally posted by Spudgun
Well, the drivers this season have to activate the semi-automatic gearbox themselves on the steering paddles. There is rev-limit on the up-shift, but perhaps the damage is being done on down-shift? The rev-limiter is there, but on down-shift you can't defy the law of physics (if he's down-shifting too early). Could this be the problem? Just my speculation of course.

That was the point that the commentators on speed here in north america saw as the only possible explain in their eyes from all the information that bar has given to the public. Sato is probably coming into the braking zone and when he gets on the brakes he flys done through the gears.

[nsxr]

sato is pushing the car and it breaks. jenson can extract the same without hurting the car. with sato blowing up engines the engines will get better. so just relax. sato is fine its not all his fault.