Courage Question's ?

The Badger · 27 Jun 2005, 17:57 (Ref:1341270)

I was talking to a couple of journalists up at Le Mans and they informed me that the C60 "is" the same chassis as the C65 ?

Another thought that springs to mind is ..... did the Pescarolo ever complete a crash test ? I cant seem to remember that one !!! If not , then the Pescarolo is still efectivily a Courage C60 . How differant does a chassis have to be to call it something differant from the original car ?

Dani Filth · 27 Jun 2005, 18:24 (Ref:1341294)

the C65 is a LMP2 chassis .

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/couragec65.html
http://www.mulsannescorner.com/couragec60-03.html

Fosca · 27 Jun 2005, 18:55 (Ref:1341307)

It depends:

Here the details of the first 8 C60/65 LMP900/1/675/2 chassis:

No 1 = 2000 and 2001 C60 Judd SMG
then Team Saturn
2005 for sale

No 2 = 2002 C60 Judd Courage Compétition
2004 C65 Jpx Epsilon
2005 C60 lmp1 hybrid

No 3 = 2001 C60 Peugeot
2002 and 2003: C60 Peugeot with Aero by de Cortanze
2004 Pescarolo C60
2005 Pescarolo C60 hybrid

No 4 = same as No 3

No 5 = 2002 and 2003 C60 Judd Courage Compétition
2005 Courage C60 lmp1 hybrid

No 6 = 2003 C65 jpx Courage Compétiton
2004 C65 AER PBR
2005 C65 AER PBR

No 7 = 2004 C65 jpx Courage Compétiton
2005 C65 AER PBR

No 8 = 2004 C65 jpx Epsilon Sport
2005 C65 Mécachrome del Bello

No 9 = 2004 C65 jpx Courage Compétition
2005 C65 AER Miracle Motorsports

etc.

All taken from LeMans Racing

Just funny how the Chassis No 2 has been transformed in both ways...

The Badger · 27 Jun 2005, 18:58 (Ref:1341312)

Did Pescarolo ever crash test his "Pescarolo" chassis ? If he didnt it must still be a Courage C60 chassis then !!!

Fosca · 27 Jun 2005, 19:00 (Ref:1341314)

they are courage chassis (no 3 and 4)

MulsanneMike · 28 Jun 2005, 00:46 (Ref:1341600)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

Did Pescarolo ever crash test his "Pescarolo" chassis ? If he didnt it must still be a Courage C60 chassis then !!!

The Pescarolo badged cars are in fact Courage C60s. But bascially Henri developed them enough on his own to infact rebadge them as his own (beleive last year was the first year for the "Pescarolo C60s"). How that works from a homologation stand point I don't know.

Fosca · 28 Jun 2005, 06:48 (Ref:1341696)

I assume that if you only do changes to the bodywork, you don't need any new crashtest, since the chassis and crashbox are supposed to be identical to the tested version...

Javi · 28 Jun 2005, 07:35 (Ref:1341735)

I am not that sure, but i guess Porsche´s first 911 GT1 was also not crash tested because it shared front structure with the already tested 911 GT2. It did not matter at the time that from the seats rearwards, everything was different !!
Of course that "sharing" came vary handy when one of them crashed at le mans (1996) and broke the chassis. a new structure was taken from the factory line and shipped to le mans for re-assembly

ss_collins · 30 Jun 2005, 17:31 (Ref:1344010)

The Pescarolo badged cars are in fact Courage C60s. But bascially Henri developed them enough on his own to infact rebadge them as his own

in fact not true mike - if you go by the rules the car is still a courage, but Pesca asked for the name to be changed - the ACO agreed. As you will read in the Le Mans report in the mag

The Badger · 30 Jun 2005, 17:38 (Ref:1344014)

My point is this ..... if the cars were not crash tested ..... then they are effectivily still Courage C60 ! If Henri changed the chassis then he would have had to crash test it . Correct ?
Remember what Robinson Racing did to their R&S MK3C ..... that car never did run again cuz it was "too" modified .

MulsanneMike · 1 Jul 2005, 02:23 (Ref:1344385)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

My point is this ..... if the cars were not crash tested ..... then they are effectivily still Courage C60 ! If Henri changed the chassis then he would have had to crash test it . Correct ?
Remember what Robinson Racing did to their R&S MK3C ..... that car never did run again cuz it was "too" modified .

Pescarolo's modifications have strictly been to bodywork and mechanical, structurally they have not been touched (and therefore no need for new crash testing).

Robinson altered the MkIIIC's crash structure and if he wanted to run the car in the ALMS, he would have needed to resertify the car's crash integrity.

MulsanneMike · 1 Jul 2005, 02:26 (Ref:1344389)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ss_collins

The Pescarolo badged cars are in fact Courage C60s. But bascially Henri developed them enough on his own to infact rebadge them as his own

in fact not true mike - if you go by the rules the car is still a courage, but Pesca asked for the name to be changed - the ACO agreed. As you will read in the Le Mans report in the mag

Procedurally, yes, what I said was incorrect. You can't just decide you want a name change, the ACO is intrinsically involved.

ss_collins · 1 Jul 2005, 13:01 (Ref:1344697)

perhaps this is something for the site mike? what exactly have pesca done?

The Badger · 2 Jul 2005, 00:38 (Ref:1345091)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

Pescarolo's modifications have strictly been to bodywork and mechanical, structurally they have not been touched (and therefore no need for new crash testing).

Robinson altered the MkIIIC's crash structure and if he wanted to run the car in the ALMS, he would have needed to resertify the car's crash integrity.

Thanks Mike .... thats all i wanted to know

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