AMA classes...

[sportscarsRULE]

Hello cyclers,

I am mostly a car racing guy, however I have always respected motorcycle road racers. I am starting to get really interested in motorcycle road racing, especially AMA since it is in the states. I think I could enjoy the racing alot more if I had an idea about the differences between the AMA pro classes.
Could anyone here give me a basic description of the superbike, formula x-treme, supersport, and superstock classes? Exactly how stock are superstock bikes? What is the main difference between Formula x-treme and superbike?

And another thing: am I right when I say that Moto GP bikes (all classes) are pure race bikes and have a similar relationship to road bikes that an F1 car has to a road car?

[Hazza]

    *  Superbike: 900cc-1000cc four-stroke, any number of cylinders.
    * Supersport: 600cc four-stroke, twin and four cylinders.
    * Formula Xtreme: 600cc four-stroke, four cylinders; 750cc four-stroke, twin cylinders; 250cc-330cc two-stroke. All highly modified.
    * Superstock: 750cc-1000cc four-stroke, four cylinders; up to 1350cc air-cooled twin cylinders

http://www.mcnews.com.au/motorcycleR...04_Rules_A.htm

Superbikes are race bikes based on production bikes, sorta like super-touring cars. The rules are loosely based around the World Superbike rules but I think they differ in that they have to have production clutches and other things compared to the WSBK. I'm trying to remember what the actuall limit of what you can do is - I'm pretty sure you can change the body work, tune up the engine and change the suspension & breaks.

Supersport is the same, but for the 600cc engine size.

Formula Extreme is silly, imho. But I think the general gist is that its about heavily modified 600-750cc bikes. They also can race 250cc and "Big Bore" 250ccs/350ccs in that class, and I presume get in the way of Miguel Duhamel when he laps you for the 4th time each race on his tricked out factory Honda. Its sort of like a "Hotrod" bike class.

And the AMA Superstock is said to be about the same as the Australian Superbikes, and I think that you have to leave the core of the bike standard. But you maybe able to change the breaks.

And yes, MotoGP for a while has been different but in the 80s you used to be able to buy road versions of the Yamaha TZ500 and the GSV500(Is that what it was called?) and I remember reading the Barry Sheene qualified on pole on a "production based machine" at Silverstone. But at some point they made them have to be prototypes.

[sportscarsRULE]

Thanks Hazza!

Do you have an idea of how many horses these different classes of race bikes deliver? How much more powerful are the Moto GP classes compared to WSBK and AMA classes?

[SALEEN S7R]

Hmm I thought 750cc bikes are eligable for Supersport too, like the Ducati RS 749cc.

[SALEEN S7R]

Originally Posted by sportscarsRULE

Thanks Hazza!

Do you have an idea of how many horses these different classes of race bikes deliver? How much more powerful are the Moto GP classes compared to WSBK and AMA classes?

WSBK bikes at the moment produce around 210bhp for the top bikes. The figure is the same for AMA and BSB too as the 3 series run to a common set of regulations. Moto GP bikes are producing anything up to 250bhp at the moment, the main differnce between a SBK and a Moto GP machine though is the weight, I forget how light exactly Moto GP bikes are but I beleive they are somewhere in the region of 20-25kg lighter than a SBK.

[Hazza]

Oh yeah, sorry, You're right Saleen they can run the 749 or something in the WSB and maybe BSB?, but I think there is a weight penalty(?)

And it's cool, the Superbikes are starting to get to the stage where power delivery is becoming an issue, such that hubbaloo about the R1 "Big Bang" engine

[Alex K]

Hello, it is maybe not AMA classes topic, but I don't want to start new thread.

I think it is question for our Japanese friends. At last Suzuka 8h race I saw Honda factory run bikes with signature of Honda CBR1000RRW. It was ridden by Tohru Ukawa, Chris Vermeulen, Ryuichi Kiyonari and Katsuaki Fujiwara in Seven Stars Honda team. My question is: is that CBR1000RRW Fireblade new, next year version of, CBR Superbike : I wonder, because only #7 & #11 bikes were factory supported, with factory riders (AFAIAssu . Other Honda half-factory, factory and privatere riders, and teams have ridden on CBR1000RR bikes :

If though, it is still Yukio Kagayama with fastest lap on his factory backed Suzuki GSX-R1000, not Honda. I wonder if Suzuki also show a new bike, and other manufacturers as well, if this Honda thing is new bike ofc :

One more question. What is other web-site, other than Motoracing-japan.com (in English) with All-Japan PROTO/SBK/SSP/250cc/125cc Champ's action : Maybe you know sites with pics, maybe you official web-site of All-Japan Road Racing Champ's :

[Hazza]

Wow, Interesting observation.

I don't know for sure, but what I do know is that Honda is very dead set on winning the 8hr, and definatly, the RW is the lastest and greats 8hr desgined superbike with all the latest trick parts.

In the old days it used to go that they'd focus on the 8hr developement program and then they'd either chuck the bikes in the crusher or send the "trick parts" to the WSBK Team (Ala Edwards in 2002?).

So in summary:That bike might end up being next year's racing model or it might just be an Eight-Hour special.

I hope that was of some help.

[Alex K]

Yeah, THX.

[chunder]

Very much so Hazza, Honda are utterly obssessed with the 8H race. As you say when Colin won his last title he only got the bits he had been on about for a year after the 8H race.
Cant really see the mentality in it. Coz there are no factory Honda teams apart from the uk team who are already miles ahead in their championship. Just typical Japanese pride and all that nonsense.
Remember they used to be the same about the TT, sending pukka factory bikes every year until the superbike rules came in and Yamaha and Suzuki beat them senseless.
IS interesting aswell that the AMA team said "eff off" to the no doubt half million renatl fee for the bikes, as did Ten Kate who funnily enough pick and choose the HRC kit parts they use and oftne end up developing their own versions to be better!

[Alex K]

I think in All-Japan Champ's Honda is leading the Championship, in US Jake Zemke, is even weeker than Ben Bostrom last year. And it's strange? Last year he was flying on his semifactory Erion's Honda.

About 8H race at Suzuka circuit, Suzuki also had factory team with Watanabe and Kagayama. I think it is important race for Japanese factories, especially for Honda, which is sponsor (AFAIK) for this race.

[Hazza]

Originally Posted by chunder

Remember they used to be the same about the TT, sending pukka factory bikes every year until the superbike rules came in and Yamaha and Suzuki beat them senseless.

Oh yes, the good old days - like 89? With Hislop/Fogarty, who scored a 1-2 and in 1994 with that Hislop/Dunlop/ and someone else who's name eludes me with a 1-2-3. I'm not sure if thoose bikes where seen again after the Island.

Honda race to win. Yamaha only just got the concept of putting the best rider, best mechanic and the best(ish) bike all together to win the title.

[wreckless]

hay about the cbr100rrw... i think the w just stands for "factory worked".... because i know the 250gp bikes are rs250 for privateers ans rs250w for the worked machines