GT4?

[duke_toaster]

If we are having a problem with classes, a new system might need to be phased in. For example

GTA : Supercars with minimum 100 (50 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 750 horsepower. Only modifications allowed being fitment of a rear wing, better brakes, new exhaust, safety stuff and that's it. Price cap of a $750,000. For example : Saleen S7.
GTB : Sub-supercars with minimum 200 (100 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 600 horsepower. Same modifications allowed, price cap of $250,000.
GTC : Road cars with minimum 1000 examples and air restricted to 400 horsepower. Same modifications, price cap of $80,000.

But I hope we get an FIA GT-LMES merger. On the ACO's terms.

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

If we are having a problem with classes, a new system might need to be phased in. For example

GTA : Supercars with minimum 100 (50 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 750 horsepower. Only modifications allowed being fitment of a rear wing, better brakes, new exhaust, safety stuff and that's it. Price cap of a $750,000. For example : Saleen S7.
GTB : Sub-supercars with minimum 200 (100 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 600 horsepower. Same modifications allowed, price cap of $250,000.

You are going to do all that to the A cars, not allow the full roll cage, and then limit horsepower but put wings on for higher cornering speed, which is where accident usually happen, .
Also billion dollar companies only have to build 100 but companies that survive on a shoe string and a prayer, must build fifty. VERRRRY INTERESSSSSTING.

I think I actually understand the ghist of what you are trying to say, but what is with the controlling HP, while adding wings. It is like cutting off your nose, to spiite your face.

If one is going to have a B class, do as they once did, for smaller displacement cars, where class confusion will not happen, and size of engine performs a natural limiting factor.

GTC : Road cars with minimum 1000 examples and air restricted to 400 horsepower. Same modifications, price cap of $80,000.

Is the C in GTC an accident or is the fact that there are GARRA GTCup cars, which fit this format; i.e. the horsepower is so limited the they run at a lower level than the street cars they represent.
That is NOT a good idea.

All this symbolism over substance, i.e. supercars, not so supercars; sports cars, kinda sporty cars; touring cars, grand touring cars, not so grand touring cars, almost grand touring cars etc., etc., etc.
In the original GT series, if it was homologated in A, B, or C production; A, B, or C sedan it ran, and no one had a sissy fit about it.
I do not care what it is called if it goes like stink, that is all that should matter.
Bob

[davemk7]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

If we are having a problem with classes, a new system might need to be phased in. For example

GTA : Supercars with minimum 100 (50 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 750 horsepower. Only modifications allowed being fitment of a rear wing, better brakes, new exhaust, safety stuff and that's it. Price cap of a $750,000. For example : Saleen S7.
GTB : Sub-supercars with minimum 200 (100 for smaller makes) examples made, air restricted to 600 horsepower. Same modifications allowed, price cap of $250,000.
GTC : Road cars with minimum 1000 examples and air restricted to 400 horsepower. Same modifications, price cap of $80,000.

But I hope we get an FIA GT-LMES merger. On the ACO's terms.

i like the basis of what your getting at. however i think your megring with the wrong series. The FIA GT championship should merge with the international gt open (not that a merger is a good thing, but if it were to happen that would be the better way to do it, imo.)

[dj choc ice]

i think the GTA, GTB, GTC thing is a kinda good idea but i wouldnt think it would completely sever the connection with the ACO and lemans 24 hours and it would kinda be like a grandAM but in europe and it would become almost a pretender GT championship.

its a good idea but i just think the current cars are good but the GT2 cars are rather expensive for how quick they are i mean £300,000 is a lot of money for a bottom class car in the LMES, ALMS and FIA GT at most events.

i think the GTA idea of cars with wings and 750bhp is kinda like a pseudo group C regs thing slow through corners nuts on the straights would be good to watch but the FIA or ACO would never sanction it unfortunately and definetely not as a replacement for the GT1 cars as they would be faster than a LMP1 in a straight line with that amount of power.

i think they should do this with FIA GT

GT1-cars have modified road car engines to 650bhp so some cars would only have to have a straight exhaust pipe and no mods to the engine like the MC12this would mean cars would not need an engine change over the year.

keep the aero package similar to what there is at the moment.

have a control race tyre done by michelin which is given to the teams at a heavily reduced cost say about 50%-75% this would bring costs down a bit atleast

have a set gearbox that lasts for atleast 5 races say a 6 speed paddleshift gearbox that should bring costs down a lot i think

the engines should run on pump fuel that would bring the costs down but still the cars run with straight pipes.

GT2

similar to GT1 a control tyre by michelin everyone has the same tyres which would be given to teams at a heavily reduced cost.

cars have a slightly tuned or stock engine with 500bhp running on pump fuel with straight exhaust pipes.

cars have a similar aero package to current GT2's.

again a set gearbox which would last for the whole season or atleast 5 races.

a programme were a team or driver from a lower national championship will be able to compete for a year in the GT2 championship say whoever wins the porsche carrera cup GB will get a fully paid season in the FIA GT in the GT2 class or the team will get to race in the GT2 class fully paid all they will have to buy is the car everything else will be paid for.

[TheNewBob]

Switching to a control tyre... won't that send up the development costs as people see the need to develop their cars to suit the tyre they're on?

Plus anyone already running, say, Michelins, would already be at an advantage, and we'd probably see complaints from those who were successful with another tyre brand.

I suppose one reason BGT could have gone Avon was because no bugger was running their tyres, so everyone was in the same boat...?

[Truckosaurus]

Originally Posted by TheNewBob

I suppose one reason BGT could have gone Avon was because no bugger was running their tyres, so everyone was in the same boat...?

But, BGT still had turmoil from the two main GT2 title contenders being given wildly different spec tyres that gave, at alternate events, one side a large advantage over the other.

[Graham Goodwin]

Originally Posted by TheNewBob

I suppose one reason BGT could have gone Avon was because no bugger was running their tyres, so everyone was in the same boat...?

British GT went Avon purely as a commercial decision - It was a competitive tender.

[Asa]

Regarding GT4, I am not certain it will work but I am quite keen to see something between FIA GT and WTCC.

Something that runs for 1.25 or 1.5 hours with just one driver, cars powered by 3.5 litre n/a engines or 2.0 litre turbos at about 1.4 bar. Yes this is like the old mid-80s Group A but without the driver change.

I don't like driver changes because it confuses me. I never know who is driving. For me driver changes is just a way to take money from gentleman drivers. OK you are entitled to do business this way but then don't promote the series like it is a pro series. Once you have gentleman drivers it is not a pro series anymore.

[TheNewBob]

Originally Posted by Truckosaurus

But, BGT still had turmoil from the two main GT2 title contenders being given wildly different spec tyres that gave, at alternate events, one side a large advantage over the other.

Originally Posted by Graham Goodwin

British GT went Avon purely as a commercial decision - It was a competitive tender.

I stand corrected, then! I'd wondered if a completely new tyre brand might have been an attempt at levelling off competition. Even if this had been the case, it obviously didn't work that well anyway since Ecosse and LNT went practically unchallenged wherever there was another GT2 car present, although they did have the advantage of newer machinery.

Originally Posted by Asa

I am quite keen to see something between FIA GT and WTCC

Would take someone with supreme negotiating skills to get them two to start talking to each other again!

[archibold]

Originally Posted by Asa

I don't like driver changes because it confuses me. I never know who is driving. For me driver changes is just a way to take money from gentleman drivers. OK you are entitled to do business this way but then don't promote the series like it is a pro series. Once you have gentleman drivers it is not a pro series anymore.

On the plus side it gives you someone to share the bills with which is quite welcome and I suspect helps get a lot more cars of better quality out on the grid. I certainly couldn't afford to run a car at a decent level if I had to find all the dosh.

Archibold

[davemk7]

maybe there is room for gt4? if there totally stock cars with a run of at least 2000??
GT3 looks like it's taking over, the fia gt pages has an adac gt masters stand on it home page. New championship for 2007.

GT1, GT2 for fia gt. GT3 and GT4 for national championships?

it's a though anyway.