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Old 24 Oct 2007, 02:55 (Ref:2049831)   #1
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Court Decisions; Who Needs Them? Ferrari WINS WCC
http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headline...22194119.shtml
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 12:33 (Ref:2050157)   #2
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Eh??? Run that one by me again. Ferrari won the constructors title on point and nothing to do with dubious decisions.

What was Hungary then? A figment of everyone's imagination. Haven't seen propoganda like this in about 60 years I reckon.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 12:37 (Ref:2050164)   #3
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Remind me what happened in Hungary - I must've forgotten...
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 12:40 (Ref:2050167)   #4
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Remind me what happened in Hungary - I must've forgotten...
Wouldn't a mod suggest we use the search tool at a time like this
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 14:41 (Ref:2050250)   #5
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If he could be bothered...
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 17:21 (Ref:2050403)   #6
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Certainly true that Hungary was the unhelpful factor in the overall points. FWIW I think an appeal for that would have been successful without the "espionage" rubbish, because the punishment was so without basis it was untrue.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 17:53 (Ref:2050434)   #7
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Court Decisions; Who Needs Them? Ferrari WINS WCC
But they wouldn't have if they were docked points for their flagrantly illegal movable floors that they used in Australia.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 17:58 (Ref:2050437)   #8
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The WCC is completely null and void this season as far as I'm concerned, there have just been too many controversies and black clouds hanging over it.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 20:15 (Ref:2050573)   #9
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duke_toaster should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridduke_toaster should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Also, if the actions of a particular driver which Ferrari International Assistance docked the TEAM points for are not counted, it would be MCL on 18 and FIAT on 204.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 20:27 (Ref:2050589)   #10
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The WCC is completely null and void this season as far as I'm concerned, there have just been too many controversies and black clouds hanging over it.
What about the WDC at present?

How about the WDC if Lewis kept his cool at the last two races and won the WDC as expected. Would there be a cloud hanging over that as well?

While not wanting to argue the merits, precedence and fairness of the various penalties handed out this season; as things stand at present, what if senarios excluded; Ferrari has won the WCC ON TRACK whether Ron & Company like it or not. He probably should reintroduce the Hungary appeal as well; "just to clarify things".
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 20:48 (Ref:2050609)   #11
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But they wouldn't have if they were docked points for their flagrantly illegal movable floors that they used in Australia.
The floors were not declared to be in breach of the regulations until after the race, so until then there was nothing illegal about them.
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What about the WDC at present?

How about the WDC if Lewis kept his cool at the last two races and won the WDC as expected. Would there be a cloud hanging over that as well?

While not wanting to argue the merits, precedence and fairness of the various penalties handed out this season; as things stand at present, what if senarios excluded; Ferrari has won the WCC ON TRACK whether Ron & Company like it or not. He probably should reintroduce the Hungary appeal as well; "just to clarify things".
Out of time for that, I'm afraid.
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 21:09 (Ref:2050626)   #12
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The WCC is completely null and void this season as far as I'm concerned, there have just been too many controversies and black clouds hanging over it.
I agree. There may as well not have been a constructors' championship from the moment 'spygate' came to light - McLaren were obviously going to be punished and with nobody else in the running, they may as well not have bothered having the championship. I look forward to next season when they can start again with a clean slate (unless the FIA decides that the 08 McLaren is "20% Ferrari" ).

(Although FWIW, I agree with Knowlesy that without spygate, McLaren's Hungarian penalty would have been overturned, making them WCC)
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Old 24 Oct 2007, 23:09 (Ref:2050733)   #13
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Certainly true that Hungary was the unhelpful factor in the overall points. FWIW I think an appeal for that would have been successful without the "espionage" rubbish, because the punishment was so without basis it was untrue.
The points penalty in Hungary was ludicrous with or without the espionage case. Theres nothing to say the penalty wouldn't have happened without it.

I'm glad Ferrari won it fair and square, it means it really does count as a Ferrari win, not some perceived hollow victory as it might have been.
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 00:01 (Ref:2050753)   #14
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I look forward to next season when they can start again with a clean slate (unless the FIA decides that the 08 McLaren is "20% Ferrari" )
Apparently Max is worried about this too. He feels there is a good chance some of the Ferrari info will find it's way into the 2008 Mac and plans a "fine toothed comb" examination of next year's car.

An interesting read here.
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 14:29 (Ref:2051143)   #15
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Ferrari won it fair&sqare on track???

Very interesting math we have here:

109 + 109 < 110 + 94

?????????????
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 18:03 (Ref:2051336)   #16
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109+109 is Mclaren's total drivers points.

It should be the team's constructors points too, but Mclaren's points in Hungary were taken off.
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 18:38 (Ref:2051379)   #17
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does that mean we agree or you too think ferrari won it on track?
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 18:46 (Ref:2051390)   #18
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Was that a serious question?
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Old 25 Oct 2007, 19:05 (Ref:2051411)   #19
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you got me!
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Old 26 Oct 2007, 08:07 (Ref:2051748)   #20
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Does this mean that Ron needs to give the constructors' championship trophy back?

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I really feel sorry for this guy - he experienced a lot this year
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Old 26 Oct 2007, 08:20 (Ref:2051754)   #21
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Quote:"does that mean we agree or you too think ferrari won it on track?"

Figure it out as you wish but last time i check, Ferrari didn't make Mclaren lose those points in Hungary.

Considering that Mclaren lost the WCC in the pitlane, and lost the WDC in the kitty litter.. then perhaps its fair to say Ferrari win because at least they manage to stay on the track
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Old 26 Oct 2007, 08:23 (Ref:2051757)   #22
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And yeah.. i like the Mclaren idea. There's nothing better than giving yourself an award I heard Toyota and Honda is seriously considering to use this idea from 2008 onwards
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