F1: 22 equal cars, no sponsors perks, who should drive

[Mr Pink]

Originally Posted by darcym

possibly because one of the best Argentinian racers doesn't stack up well against the best racers in the world ?

I honestly think you're wrong, I think Pechito would have done good in Formula 1 if his career wouldn't have taken an other turn.

Of the recent F1 drivers who have lost their spot, Kobayashi is the one who least deserved it in my mind. And the Kubica case is of course sad, he's a top tier race car driver.

[Beryl]

I'll have a go, picking mostly single seater drivers because most others are unproven. Drivers picked for a series starting in 2014.

1. Sebastian Vettel (F1)
2. Fernando Alonso (F1)
3. Lewis Hamilton (F1)
4. Nico Rosberg (F1)
5. Kimi Raikkonen (F1)
6. Jenson Button (F1)
7. Nico Hulkenburg (F1)
8. Pastor Maldonado (F1)
9. Sergio Perez (F1)
10. Valteri Bottas (F1)
11. Mark Webber (F1)
12. Romain Grosjean (F1)
13. Daniel Ricciardo (F1)
14. Jean-Eric Vergne (F1)
15. Felipe Massa (F1)
16. Jules Bianchi (F1)
17. Charles Pic (F1)
18. Felipe Nasr (GP2)
19. Kevin Magnussen (WSR)
20. Stoffel Vandoorne (WSR)
21. Scott Dixon (Indycar, under advice)
22. Andre Lotterer (Super Formula)

Reserves: Sebastien Ogier (WRC), Paul Di Resta (F1), Jamie Alguersuari (None), Robin Frijns (GP2/F1 TD)

I've left off Nascar drivers because though they have the skill, not the experience or preparation for high level single seaters. Ogier is only on the reserves for the same reason.

I've left off Rubens and Michael, though they may yet both be still fast enough to compete. Last we saw of them both, Michael was as quick as Nico and Rubens was spanking the Hulk and Pastor.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by Mr Pink

I honestly think you're wrong, I think Pechito would have done good in Formula 1 if his career wouldn't have taken an other turn.

Of the recent F1 drivers who have lost their spot, Kobayashi is the one who least deserved it in my mind. And the Kubica case is of course sad, he's a top tier race car driver.

Kind of hard to see what you're saying here, but if you're saying he didn't deserve his seat I'd have to disagree, strongly.

[Mr Pink]

Originally Posted by ptclaus98

Kind of hard to see what you're saying here, but if you're saying he didn't deserve his seat I'd have to disagree, strongly.

Sorry, I meant he was the least deserving of losing his seat.

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by ptclaus98

I picked JJ because he seems to be a very intelligent driver on track and off it and could probably pick it up quickly, but I think both Busch brothers could cut it in F1, too. Kurt because he's had experience in open wheelers and did well in them, as well as driving for Penske. Kyle because he has the mentality for it. I couldn't see any other NASCAR drivers being a good fit.

Montoya.

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

I think that any stock car driver will need a lot of test time in an F1 car, and *of course* a thorough read of the driving standard rules...

[darcym]

Montoya is an interesting thought I'd half forgotten about.

He could really drive an F1 car when it worked and was happy, so in the equal machine theory, he'd probably be a good bet.

[chunterer]

Montoya can drive the wheels off anything (literally sometimes! ) and remains one of the best drivers in the world.

He would be a cert for the 22!!

You'd probably have to include TGF as well.

[steve nielsen]

equal cars??

we already have Indycar, Renault World Series and AutoGP for that

F1=F1

[chunterer]

That's not the point of the thread though is it Steve?

It's about the best drivers in the world facing off in equal equipment, F1 or not.

[ace007]

1. Vettel
2. Raikkonen
3. Alonso
4. Hulkenberg
5. Hamilton
6. Rosberg
7. Grosjean
8. Kubica
9. Perez
10. Di Resta
11. Bird
12. Sutil
13. Bianchi
14. Massa
15. Bottas
16. Maldonado
17. Vergne
18. Davidson
19. Valsecchi
20. Kovaleinen
21. Glock
22. Duval

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

Originally Posted by ace007

1. Vettel
2. Raikkonen
3. Alonso
4. Hulkenberg
5. Hamilton
6. Rosberg
7. Grosjean
8. Kubica
9. Perez
10. Di Resta
11. Bird
12. Sutil
13. Bianchi
14. Massa
15. Bottas
16. Maldonado
17. Vergne
18. Davidson
19. Valsecchi
20. Kovaleinen
21. Glock
22. Duval

Grosjean at no.7, Kubica being no.8 in his current state, Bird being 11th (with no other GP2/FR3.5 drivers what a joke), Maldonado actually being there, and from 18-22 make that list a bit of a joke to be honest. Where's Parente? Kristensen? And if Bird's 11th, where's Nasr? Calado? Magnussen and Vandoorne then. And Scott Dixon? Where's Ricciardo anyway? Oops.

[JamesH]

If you want the 22 best drivers in the world, you probably wouldn't have any of the top 22 drivers currently racing.

I imagine most of the best 22 drivers in the world have never even driven a race car, perhaps never even driven a car.

There are 7,176,301 people on the planet. There are 600M vehicles. That means the vast majority of prospective top drivers have never even stepped in a car.

[werner]

"I imagine most of the best 22 drivers in the world have never even driven a race car, perhaps never even driven a car."

I think the men you write about lack a quite important aspect of being a good raceingdriver; experience.

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

He means natural talent. And he has a strong point, but I reckon we'll have 4 or 5 racing drivers there...

[JamesH]

Originally Posted by Biscuits In A Red Bull

He means natural talent. And he has a strong point, but I reckon we'll have 4 or 5 racing drivers there...

You are right - I should have been more specific. As with anything, natural talent and experience beats experience alone. And the number of people who get experience greatly outweigh those with natural talent, because you need money to drive a racing car. A lot of it. So what are the chances that the set of people with enough money matches in any way the set of people with natural talent....

Unless, of course, the act of driving a motorcar very fast (around corners...) is actually a lot easier than might be expected, and the set of people with natural talent is quite large, which I doubt.

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

Originally Posted by JamesH

You are right - I should have been more specific. As with anything, natural talent and experience beats experience alone. And the number of people who get experience greatly outweigh those with natural talent, because you need money to drive a racing car. A lot of it. So what are the chances that the set of people with enough money matches in any way the set of people with natural talent....

Unless, of course, the act of driving a motorcar very fast (around corners...) is actually a lot easier than might be expected, and the set of people with natural talent is quite large, which I doubt.

Hang on, in an indoor karting event, I spun from pole at turn 1 (doh!) and ended up at the back of the field, before charging back through, setting the fastest time of the day and eventually won, WITH CLEAN OVERTAKES. PUT ME ON THE LIST

[JamesH]

Originally Posted by Biscuits In A Red Bull

Hang on, in an indoor karting event, I spun from pole at turn 1 (doh!) and ended up at the back of the field, before charging back through, setting the fastest time of the day and eventually won, WITH CLEAN OVERTAKES. PUT ME ON THE LIST

Why not? Until you get in a proper racing car and really find out how good you are, it's quite possible you are as naturally talented as Vettel!

And that's the point. There are a lot of people in the world. Are they ALL worse drivers that the 22 F1 drivers?

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

Originally Posted by JamesH

And that's the point. There are a lot of people in the world. Are they ALL worse drivers that the 22 F1 drivers?

Well, some racing drivers (Tom Kristensen) are better than the 22 F1 drivers. And some (Steve Soper) never raced a single seater, so we can't really compare. That's before we get to the guys who never escaped karting (Terry Fullerton), or only did for a select few car races before their budgets ran out (Jonathan Thonon) despite showing loads of promise. And then there's those who never raced.

But surely we'll have 5 or so racing drivers...

[Adam43]

And then there is the entire species that never was because evolution took a different path
I suspect the opening poster would just like a suggested list of drivers!

Gauging those on set-up is hard. I don't know any driver who is particularly renowned for this today. Not in the Prost league anyway.
?

[321Go]

Originally Posted by ace007

1. Vettel
2. Raikkonen
3. Alonso
4. Hulkenberg
5. Hamilton
6. Rosberg
7. Grosjean
8. Kubica
9. Perez
10. Di Resta
11. Bird
12. Sutil
13. Bianchi
14. Massa
15. Bottas
16. Maldonado
17. Vergne
18. Davidson
19. Valsecchi
20. Kovaleinen
21. Glock
22. Duval

I disagree with that list. Sam Bird should be higher.. right up there in the top 5 or 6.

[LC2guy]

Originally Posted by ace007

1. Vettel
2. Raikkonen
3. Alonso
4. Hulkenberg
5. Hamilton
6. Rosberg
7. Grosjean
8. Kubica
9. Perez
10. Di Resta
11. Bird
12. Sutil
13. Bianchi
14. Massa
15. Bottas
16. Maldonado
17. Vergne
18. Davidson
19. Valsecchi
20. Kovaleinen
21. Glock
22. Duval

Maldonado on the list, but not Button .....

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by LC2guy

Maldonado on the list, but not Button .....

Michael Schumacher and JPM would easily displace half of that lot in terms of talent and would most definitely be on this list.

[321Go]

Originally Posted by chunterer

Michael Schumacher and JPM would easily displace half of that lot in terms of talent and would most definitely be on this list.

Ahead of Sam Bird??
Surely not!

[Biscuits In A Red Bull]

Originally Posted by 321Go

Ahead of Sam Bird??
Surely not!

Nah, mate. Sam Bird has to be number 1. There's nobody else near him in ability.

The fact that NONE of his rivals are even there makes the list a slight joke.

Button's low grip skills are enough for me. Maldo probably gets a place.