Shall we give out the 2001 trophies to MS and Ferrari NOW

[Super Tourer]

I know we have a long way to go BUT we might as well give out the 2001 championship trophies to MS and Ferrari NOW

Even DC admits that Ferrari are in a different class and as for Mika - did he take part in the race at all.....

Love them or loathe them the whole Ferrari team are in a different class. Pit stops, strategy and overall performance.

I bet Ron Dennis 'loved' seeing MS drive around the OUTSIDE of both of his cars. When both the Ferrari's went off McLaren looked to have it in the bag, yet once again they stole defeat from the jaws of victory.

I'm not particularly a big Ferrari fan, but I do like to see a job well done. To me the whole set up looks unbeatable particularly in a changeable race situation, where Ross Brawn has proved time and time again to be the master.

Even if McLaren and Jordan or Williams suddenly improved their cars to be on par with Ferrari, I doubt they currently have the all round ability to beat them in the races.

Very impressive, you cant deny it.

[Liz]

Aw, you read ahead! Bernie has decreed that TGF will equal Fangio's record for championships (even though he's driving alone in a weak field) before he retires. Naturally anyone who ever saw Fangio drive will not believe that numbers on a piece of paper means TGF is the better pilot, but to a whole generation who thinks this is racing, that will not matter.

[Bononi]

Sad truth.
The world of information that we live counts on statistics and not with the magic and skill of a racing driver.

[Liz]

To the credit of TGF, he has the grace to be embarrassed when anyone tries to mention the records he is "breaking".

I hope when he is 50 years old he will write his memoirs and tell us all the truth about what was going on at Ferrari.

Not before then, because he will need to be aaway from it to become objective.

But even Senna eventually admitted he nerfed Prost off the track deliberately. And if Senna could admit he had lied, well anything is possible.

[Run Free]

Originally posted by Super Tourer
Love them or loathe them the whole Ferrari team are in a different class. Pit stops, strategy and overall performance.[..]
Very impressive, you cant deny it.

Yes, the 1'30" pitstop was really impressive....;-)Also the double spin was...
BTW, I'll wait and see if ferrari will be ahead of the rest of the field like they are now, when TC will be allowed. If they will not (I think so) it should turn in a very interesting championship, at least if it will not be a german championship like is now :-)
Regarding record books and drivers' skills, this time I totally agree with Liz...(incredible). It's a shame that maybe young people think that racing is that of modern f1...:-(

[downforce]

er no racing is when Fangio could finish a race in another drivers car and that was allowed....yeah!

Anti-Schumachers mus be goin crazy every time he says he doesnt care for records!!

SuperTourer, tho Michael's walked the first 2 rounds, i wont write Hakkinen off till it really is over. And Michael seems to have that incredible nack of keeping the media running with Leg-breaking shunts and controversial accidents. Remember last season it was similar.

[EERO]

Ferrari are clearly so far ahead of everyone else that is a little disturbing-take them out tof the mix and that would have been a real motor race. It will be a shame when "TC" is legalized-I really enjoyed those lurid slides.

Run free, I have this nagging suspicion that you might be right about the decline of Ferrari's dominance starting in Spain.

To Schumacher's defense. Je made his mark pretty quickly back at Benetton and seemed to be the only driver capable of running with Prost and Senna. His first seasons at Ferrari were not auspicious-he struggled to bring the team's performance forward and only since last season has the performance of the car allowed him to dominate.

Liz, I find that your conspiracy theory has its appeal, but I am not convinced that the drivers in F1 today are second-rate compared to those of years past.

[SL]

This seems to happen almost every year now. One teams storms to the front at the start of the season only to fall off mid way though. This leads to a climax in the last couple of events.

My guess is that TGF will have a lot of DNF mid season and MH or DC win a few to keep it alive. One driver will have the 'amazing win' or 'outstanding race' probably at Monaco.

Simon

[Bononi]

So it isn't scheduled ?
Doesn't seem to be entertaiment ?
A Show ? That you can master depending the rates of attendance ?
No, I don't think it is a conspiracy.
It's show bizz. And it must have his main star, a vilain, supporters and so on...
It can't be perfect... it must have some chaos or disorder to thrill the spectators.
But it can't run off the trails, there are a lot of money to let it happen.
It is not a conspiracy.
It is a Company. And it has his owners and investors.
F1 Inc.

[Run Free]

Originally posted by Bononi
It is not a conspiracy.
It is a Company. And it has his owners and investors.
F1 Inc.

I shouldn't have said this better. Totally agree with you, Bononi. Sadly.

[neutral]

Eero, are the only sane person left in this forum?

[neutral]

Eero, we need more sane people like you on this forum.

[Orange]

OK, maybe I'm a starry-eyed idealist, but considering the amount of money invested into the non front-runner teams, I can't imagine that they would allow F1 to be scripted like Professional Wrestling. It just doesn't seem logical. I can see Bernie & Co. making rules that indirectly benefit certain teams, but would Honda (for example) really make the push that they have, when they knew that they could maybe, at best get 3rd in the WCC??? I don't think so. As far as TGFs ability, I think Liz (and others) don't give him enough credit. I think that its very easy to compare him unfavorabely to past legends, only because there is no real comparison. The guy is obviously one of the best we've seen in a long time.

[Neil C]

Don't drop the curtain on this little drama just yet. To borrow a theme from another thread, "It's not over until the fat lady sings", and Bernie is not Goethe.

If F1 is scripted for the purpose of selling entertainment, they would do a lot better with victory margins of tenths of seconds instead of tens of seconds.

No, it is not scripted. Ferrari just has the best car and the best driver right now...and enough influence to swing important decisions in their favor...such as when to call in the safety car.

(EERO? Sane? )

[Airhead]

I don't think it's scripted, but the sucessful and wealthy teams can to a large extent make their own luck. So you have the right people in the team, the right backing to keep them there, the right engine deal and the right drivers. When all these things coincide you have a combination that is demonstrably better than your competitors.

Unfortunately, for the likes of me at the moment it is Ferrari. But it has taken them six years to get that combination together and firing. Measured against this perhaps Jaguar should not be so readily criticised or dismissed.

Now the EEROS for President Movement, brilliant stuff. You know in the land of the blind a one eyed man is king.

[Wrex]

Originally posted by Super Tourer
I know we have a long way to go BUT we might as well give out the 2001 championship trophies to MS and Ferrari

Yes, Ferrari will blitze this year - 12 Wins

Originally posted by Super Tourer
Love them or loathe them the whole Ferrari team are in a different class. Pit stops, strategy and overall performance.

They are, but the 1:12 min pitstops really need some work

Originally posted by Super Tourer
I'm not particularly a big Ferrari fan, but I do like to see a job well done. To me the whole set up looks unbeatable particularly in a changeable race situation, where Ross Brawn has proved time and time again to be the master........

......Very impressive, you cant deny it.

I agree completely, but no doubt there will be other's on the forum who will slaughter you for it

It does'nt matter if you like it or you don't, Ferrari will win back to back drivers & contructors championships this year.

[Neil C]

Originally posted by AMoffat
Unfortunately, for the likes of me at the moment it is Ferrari. But it has taken them six years to get that combination together and firing. Measured against this perhaps Jaguar should not be so readily criticised or dismissed.

I couldnt agree more. I've been telling this to people that either think Ferrari has always been on top, or those that think Jaguar should be winning races right out of the box.

Now the EEROS for President Movement, brilliant stuff. You know in the land of the blind a one eyed man is king.

Mo'fat...If I'm going to have a one eyed king, it's going to be this guy: (No offense, EERO, Mr. Moderator, sir.)

[EERO]

I'm just stunned that anyone thinks I'm sane.

Ohh, its neutral, now I get it...


By the way, if nominated I will not run, If elected, I will serve only if there are concubines included.

[Liz]

If no other pilot has won a race except TGF by Monaco, sales and interest will begin to drop off. And of course Honda will not stand for being shut off the podium, so I have a standing bet at 5:1 odds that a Honda-powered car will be on the podium within the next 2 races...just as a proof of "Good Will" by You Know Who.... and if it is decided that someone be allowed to win although Ferrari are on the track, then it will be a Jordan, probably Frenzy although maybe Trulli to keep Flav and Renault inside the tent.

They should put ME in charge. I could write this script so it'd keep people watching and still come out with Ferrari the top 2 finishers at the end!

[Raoul Duke]

I would have to say yes, give TGF the trophies right away. Nobody else stands a chance. He's won the WC allready, he won it before the season even started and there is no point in prolonging this further.