Montoya deserved a 10s Stop-Go - Page 10

Schumacher · 22 Mar 2002, 16:04 (Ref:241694)

Going back to the topic.Do I think Montoya deserved a penalty?Yes I do.Should it have been a 10S Stop-Go?Yes it should.Why was it not?Because the english teams carry a lot of power in the sport and 98% of FIA officials are English.Cold hard truth.The stewards should have handed him a 10s stop go or no penalty at all.The drive through was ridiculous and a weak attempt to show their impartiality.
(which does not exist in the first place)

I also find it laughable that some here are attempting through sheer frustration I would imagine to blame Schumy for the incident in Malaysia.

The thought itself is ridiculous.I may have considered your opinions however had your thoughts been driven by passion for Montoya rather than your obvious hate for Schumy.

In a way I feel sorry for Montoya since the majority of people seem to have jumped on the Montoya bandwagon in a desperate hope he would beat Schumy rather than in admiration of his talent and driving ability.

I am however pleased to note that such bias does not exist in the hearts of the majority of F1 fans who go to race tracks and support Schumy and others for that matter out of respect for their accomplishments and not because they dislike a rival driver.

Those are the real Formula One Fans.And they have my respect.

Thanks to the moderators for allowing this topic to stay open for so long.You may close it at your discretion.

**Adam43** · 22 Mar 2002, 16:33 (Ref:241715)

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher
Thanks to the moderators for allowing this topic to stay open for so long.You may close it at your discretion.

stop the madness

Mr V · 22 Mar 2002, 16:38 (Ref:241717)

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher

In a way I feel sorry for Montoya since the majority of people seem to have jumped on the Montoya bandwagon in a desperate hope he would beat Schumy rather than in admiration of his talent and driving ability.

and you quite obviously haven't jumped on any bandwagons, it's just that your name suggests you have! before tgf entered f1, did you follow his career? (let alone heard of him!) i think it's fair to say, that a hell of alot more people had heard of jpm before 2001 and followed his progress, in f3000 and cart!

i suggest that you support tgf because he is the best in formula 1 (until jpm arrived!) as it was easy to shout for a driver who was winning the majority of the time, as opposed to following him because you like him and admire him as a person. i can only speak for myself, but i was a jpm fan long before formula 1 because i liked his character and gun-ho additude as much as his driving ability!

race aficionado · 22 Mar 2002, 16:51 (Ref:241718)

Quote:

Originally posted by mr v

. . . i was a jpm fan long before formula 1 because i liked his character and gun-ho additude as much as his driving ability!

Likewise.

And I don't desperately hope he beats Schumy,
I rather, in a very exciting way, look forward to being witness of a new champion dethroning the old.

I hope Michael battles gallantly and honorably to defend his title, specially now that JPM is in every one of his nightmares.

Dr. Austin · 22 Mar 2002, 17:01 (Ref:241722)

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by race aficionado

"I hope Michael battles gallantly and honorably to defend his title,"

Oh, no doubt he will try to defend his title, but there is no chance of him doing it in the way you just described. When you go wheel to wheel with the great one, you just close your eyes, wait for the bang and hope you live through it. Deliberate, but instinctual.

Dr. Austin · 22 Mar 2002, 17:06 (Ref:241724)

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by mr v

"and you quite obviously haven't jumped on any bandwagons, it's just that your name suggests you have!"

Certain things are a dead give away.

"before tgf entered f1, did you follow his career? (let alone heard of him!)"

Do you think this guy can tell us what a C-291 is? I'm sure Mr.V knows, but the other guy will probably have to look it up.

" i think it's fair to say, that a hell of alot more people had heard of jpm before 2001 and followed his progress, in f3000 and cart!"

Quoting chip Ganassi; "You have done it, pal. You are the most famous racing driver in the world."

"i suggest that you support tgf because he is the best in formula 1 (until jpm arrived!) as it was easy to shout for a driver who was winning the majority of the time, as opposed to following him because you like him and admire him as a person."

BADDA BING!!!!!!!!!!!!! SOOOOOOOOOO on the money.

"i can only speak for myself, but i was a jpm fan long before formula 1 because i liked his character and gun-ho additude as much as his driving ability! "

With that statement, you speak for me as well.

Sato san · 22 Mar 2002, 17:14 (Ref:241727)

..... although JPM never set the world alight in British F3 , i kind of remember that he still done very well , also , didnt he race in Formula Vauxhall in the uk , and Barber-dodge over there in the states ?

Dr. Austin · 22 Mar 2002, 17:16 (Ref:241728)

He was a monster in the Barber Dodge series. His tutor, vic Elford (no slouch himself) says Montoya is the finest talent he has ever seen. That is coming from a man who won the Daytona 24 hours, the targa florio and the Monte Carlo rally in the same year.

race aficionado · 22 Mar 2002, 17:20 (Ref:241730)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dr. Austin

Quote:

[i]Originally posted by race aficionado

"I hope Michael battles gallantly and honorably to defend his title,"

Oh, no doubt he will try to defend his title, but there is no chance of him doing it in the way you just described. When you go wheel to wheel with the great one, you just close your eyes, wait for the bang and hope you live through it. Deliberate, but instinctual.

I cought my self dreaming there, you know, wishfull thinking.

in terms of Juan closing his eyes, I think that he will keep them WAY open right now.

dman007 · 22 Mar 2002, 17:21 (Ref:241732)

Same old dribble... blah, blah, blah

Mr V · 22 Mar 2002, 17:28 (Ref:241737)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Austin
His tutor, vic Elford (no slouch himself) says Montoya is the finest talent he has ever seen.

bobby rahal has also said....and i quote "i think, he's (montoya) the kind of driver who comes along once every two generations" when asked then, if he thought that montoya was the best driver he'd ever seen? rahal replied "yes, i guess that is what i'm saying. it's struck me that, when he's sitting in the car, helmet on, in the pit lane, you look into his eyes- and you see NOTHING! it's like he's completely unaware of anthing else around him; he's there for just one reason - to win. absolutly nothing seems to faze him, and i think thats going to be one of his strengths in F1. he's the driver everyone's going to want, thats for sure"

very high praise indeed!

Robert · 22 Mar 2002, 17:36 (Ref:241742)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Austin

Manslaughter is second degree murder in the United States.

The case was tried in Italy, which is not in the United States.

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Austin
And it is really going to make a difference to the dead people, isn't it?

It would make a huge difference to the defendants, if they were to be found guilty.
The prosecution in this case would have asked for a one year suspended sentence, they would not have been so lenient in a murder trial.

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Austin
Are you saying if it is only manslaughter, the FIA should alllow it?

The FIA do not prosecute for manslaughter, murder or any other criminal offence, they are only concerned with the rules of racing.

And your rantings are irrelevant since they were all aquitted.

Robert

race aficionado · 22 Mar 2002, 17:40 (Ref:241747)

Quote:

Originally posted by Robert

And your rantings are irrelevant since they were all aqquitted.

Robert

yeah, and OJ Simpson was also aqquitted . . .

Sato san · 22 Mar 2002, 17:44 (Ref:241750)

Montoya is certainly the one driver to emerge in the last 5 years who is the special one. Micheal was this back in 1991 when he stormed into F1 when some massive immpressive results ,in his first race for Benny at Monza he was ahead of his team mate Nelson Piquet . Hakkinen was never this IMO as was Damon Hill , where as J Villeneuve was very fast straight out of the box . but , out of all these , IMO Montoya is the only one who will actually take the crown as the greatest driver in the world !!!

dman007 · 22 Mar 2002, 17:55 (Ref:241761)

Robert,

You can't win in this court of public opinion (maybe you need another venue), or at least in the eyes of some. Some people who frequent this BB will pound away at you until you either concede or go away. Your opinion to some means NOTHING.

Best of luck.

Dr. Austin · 22 Mar 2002, 17:57 (Ref:241763)

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Robert

"The case was tried in Italy, which is not in the United States."

Murder, manslaughter, what's the difference to the dead people? you can play all the word games you want, but if it is your family that is involved, you won't be a happy person either way. And mayber as the world's largest car market, the US isn't good enough for more than one GP, but if the accident happens here, it will be tried under US law in the US courts.

"It would make a huge difference to the defendants, if they were to be found guilty. "

Like I said, the dead people are still dead. How would you like to defend that?

"The FIA do not prosecute for manslaughter, murder or any other criminal offence, they are only concerned with the rules of racing."

And they aren't real conserned with that if they continue to allow the illegally block, chop and swerve to go unpunished. And the FIA is going to end up being the one prosecuted if one of these insane acts kills someone? By not enforcing their own rules, they leave themselves wide open for a criminal negligence suit. Maybe the suspended sentance doesn't consern you, but all the wrongful death suits that could result would destroy the sport.

"And your rantings are irrelevant since they were all aquitted."

And any future rantings you will ever have in the safety debate have just been made irrelevant by your cavilier attitude towards it.

race aficionado · 22 Mar 2002, 18:04 (Ref:241772)

Quote:

Originally posted by dman007
Robert,

You can't win in this court of public opinion. . . .
Your opinion to some means NOTHING.

I may not agree with what your oppinion is but you have the right to think as you wish.

And if I understand this idea of participating in a forum correctly,
I am not trying to WIN anything, just trying to have a hopefully intelligent and engaging conversation and if I don't agree with you, I will say so without resorting to personal attacks.

Mr V · 22 Mar 2002, 18:04 (Ref:241773)

Quote:

Originally posted by dman007
Robert,

You can't win in this court of public opinion (maybe you need another venue), or at least in the eyes of some. Some people who frequent this BB will pound away at you until you either concede or go away. Your opinion to some means NOTHING.

Best of luck.

depends how commited to your own views you are! i post my views because i think they are right, i don't post them for somebody else to change my mind!

whats BB mean anyway?

**Peter Mallett** · 22 Mar 2002, 18:14 (Ref:241780)

I only have two things to say.

1. Motor racing is dangerous. Read the tickets.
2. The art of racing is outbraking, stealing the other guy's line or drafting past on the straight.

Ergo, there should have been no penalty.

Robert · 22 Mar 2002, 18:34 (Ref:241792)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Austin

.......but if the accident happens here, it will be tried under US law in the US courts.

It didn't happen in the US, it happened in Italy, didn't you read my post?????

Robert

Damon · 22 Mar 2002, 18:41 (Ref:241801)

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher
Going back to the topic.Do I think Montoya deserved a penalty?Yes I do.Should it have been a 10S Stop-Go?Yes it should.Why was it not?Because the english teams carry a lot of power in the sport and 98% of FIA officials are English.Cold hard truth.The stewards should have handed him a 10s stop go or no penalty at all.The drive through was ridiculous and a weak attempt to show their impartiality.
(which does not exist in the first place)

Are you, in your right mind, seriously suggesting that there is bias in F1 against Ferrari? The thought is insane, did you not read Suzy's comments several pages ago?

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher I also find it laughable that some here are attempting through sheer frustration I would imagine to blame Schumy for the incident in Malaysia.

Everyone in the world, appart from you it would seem, have agreed that it was a racing incident, no one was to blame. Schumacher understeered into Montoya as one cold tyre came into contact with the kerb. Had Schumacher lifted then no contact would have been made, had Montoya given more room then no contact would have been made. Neither backed of and a the incident insued, its simply what racing is about.

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher
The thought itself is ridiculous.I may have considered your opinions however had your thoughts been driven by passion for Montoya rather than your obvious hate for Schumy.

This is somewhat hypocritical as your discipel like following of Schu is cloudy YOUR judgement. You may notice that even schu fans from this formum agree that the penalty was unjust.

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumacher
In a way I feel sorry for Montoya since the majority of people seem to have jumped on the Montoya bandwagon in a desperate hope he would beat Schumy rather than in admiration of his talent and driving ability.

So far Montoya has shown at least as much speed and talent than Schu displayed in his first 1 and a bit years. If you can't appriciatre that then you obviously don't appreciate true talent when you see it.

I can't see why you are still sticking to your guns when all the evidence points to the fact that Montoya's penalty was unfair. Instead of insulting the rest of us with claims of bias on our part, why not remove your rose tinted glasses and look at what actually happened.

Dr. Austin · 22 Mar 2002, 18:42 (Ref:241802)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Robert
[B]

It didn't happen in the US, it happened in Italy, didn't you read my post?????

Of course it happened in Italy. tell me it can't happen in the US and i will concede your point.

Nicholas · 22 Mar 2002, 18:45 (Ref:241806)

Quote:

Originally posted by mr v

whats BB mean anyway?

I think it's short for Bulletin Board.

Mr V · 22 Mar 2002, 18:47 (Ref:241810)

Quote:

Originally posted by nicholaswhite

I think it's short for Bulletin Board.

cheers nick!

dman007 · 22 Mar 2002, 18:47 (Ref:241811)

Quote:

Originally posted by Robert

It didn't happen in the US, it happened in Italy, didn't you read my post?????

Robert

Robert I am behind you, but you will be "pounded until you concede or go away" as others have.

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