[Rules] Future Rule Changes

[Paradise City]

Originally Posted by Pingguest

I still hope to see the return of the sixty-minutes qualifying sessions without the post-qualifying parc fermé, but I guess the real qualifying laps will never return.

I would certainly like to see the old hour qualifying and even F1 qualifying on Friday when F1 didn't really care too much about TV audiences in its scheduling.

It's hardly worth hoping it'll come back since pandering to TV audiences is the only thing the sports bosses are interested in. Well after tucking it behind a paywall which excludes large number of TV viewers that is.

[chillibowl]

There is a whole other thread about the pros and cons of a pay wall. No need to rehash the arguments here.

Q2 is exciting with several of the drivers throwing up the fastest times of the weekend on low fuel new option tire runs but q3 is anti climactic to say the least.

For the in person spectators it is hard to follow and for those at home it's a boring session made unbearable with endless talk about tires all to shots of empty track. It needs to be tweaked.

would like to know more about the quali tires idea...if they have to be turned in does that mean all drivers get a free tire choice to start the race?

Also with the new engines which will benefit those with better fuel economy during the race is there a need for full fuel runs in q3? Surely you want the fastest time of the day set in the dying seconds of the final session.

[FxL]

What Lewis and Nico think about the changes ()

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P-9oYUwA_E

[wolfhound]

Why change qualifying when NASCAR are copying F1 system. Imitation is the sinc........

[Mr Pink]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

There is a whole other thread about the pros and cons of a pay wall. No need to rehash the arguments here.

Q2 is exciting with several of the drivers throwing up the fastest times of the weekend on low fuel new option tire runs but q3 is anti climactic to say the least.

For the in person spectators it is hard to follow and for those at home it's a boring session made unbearable with endless talk about tires all to shots of empty track. It needs to be tweaked.

would like to know more about the quali tires idea...if they have to be turned in does that mean all drivers get a free tire choice to start the race?

Also with the new engines which will benefit those with better fuel economy during the race is there a need for full fuel runs in q3? Surely you want the fastest time of the day set in the dying seconds of the final session.

I don't mind the quali system as such but I think they should simply let them use whatever tires and fuel levels they want in Q3 too.

Also I think this is very encouraging http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/112453

[MarkG]

For qualifying, why not have it so the first two rows can choose what tyres they start on, so that Q3 is also more important?

[Adam43]

And rows three to five can't? So that people go for a time?

[MarkG]

Originally Posted by Adam43

And rows three to five can't? So that people go for a time?

Yes. I admit I haven't really thought a lot about it so the idea could be flawed like something that's very flawed, but it might prevent the sometimes boring Q3 session

[Zico]

Originally Posted by MarkG

Yes. I admit I haven't really thought a lot about it so the idea could be flawed like something that's very flawed, but it might prevent the sometimes boring Q3 session

Yes, I totally agree that Q3 should mean much, much more and once again become the hard fought (by everyone) spectacle that it used to be, but I would much prefer to see it done in a non contrived manner. Simply allowing a fresh set of rubber and compound of the drivers choice for the start of the race for all drivers would be the simplest, fairest and obvious way to go though...

.... then we sometimes have the issue of odd grid placed cars starting on the dirty side of the track, an unfortunate natural disadvantage but one which could be dealt with, with some cleaning/artificial rubbering in by a 'rubbering in machine'?

[Tucky]

I agree that having a set of quali tyres would make q3 so much more interesting, but then surely the cars outside the top ten would have an even less chance of scoring points or getting a podium.

[Mr Pink]

Originally Posted by Tucky

I agree that having a set of quali tyres would make q3 so much more interesting, but then surely the cars outside the top ten would have an even less chance of scoring points or getting a podium.

Yeah I hate when the fast drivers don't get penalised for doing a good job..

[wnut]

How about: the top four grid positions are given to the fastest 4 in the first 20 mins, the next four in the following 20 minutes and the rest of the grid in the final 20 minutes of qualifying?

[Tucky]

Originally Posted by Mr Pink

Yeah I hate when the fast drivers don't get penalised for doing a good job..

yeah, I guess it sounds bad when you put it like that. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Originally Posted by wnut

How about: the top four grid positions are given to the fastest 4 in the first 20 mins, the next four in the following 20 minutes and the rest of the grid in the final 20 minutes of qualifying?

If I was in charge of the midfield/slowest teams then I wouldn't bother going out until the last 20 mins, and all the fast teams would be done in the beginning. Sort of anti-climactic

[wnut]

Fair point.

http://www.pitpass.com/50882/Video-A...hose-new-rules

At least Lewis and Nico see the funny side of 2014!

[Pingguest]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

What and have cars sitting in the garages for 45 of the 60 minutes before they all come out and trip over one another, with claim and counter claim of being baulked.

Since the early eighties the FIA effectively reduced the number of laps drivers could do during qualifying. This resulted in drivers saving their laps and hence staying in the pits. Without those restrictions it would have been very different.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Originally Posted by Pingguest

Since the early eighties the FIA effectively reduced the number of laps drivers could do during qualifying. This resulted in drivers saving their laps and hence staying in the pits. Without those restrictions it would have been very different.

Replace lap restrictions with tyres restrictions, and tyres that were falling apart ...sorry can't see 60minutes of action myself.
You only have to look at FP 1 where they do have tyres that have to be handed back and still there is very little action for the first half hour or more.

[Tucky]

Originally Posted by wnut

Fair point.

http://www.pitpass.com/50882/Video-A...hose-new-rules

At least Lewis and Nico see the funny side of 2014!

At least the teams are trying to interact more with the public

[chillibowl]

if its a solid 60 minutes of action then a short race of some sort is the way to go

seriously though i didnt mind the gaps in action during the old 1 hour quali format because there was at least this sense of anticipation that the teams were building towards something.

i dont go back as far as others but i loved Schumi usually vs Mika doing a few reconnaissance laps, set a saftey time, but always waiting for the track to rubber in and then going to battle it out for pole with 3 minutes left. it was do or die type stuff and i loved it and to this day Jerez 97 still stands out as an epic example. that was great TV (or perhaps just is in my memory)

now its all downhill after Q2 so im curious if there is a single Q3 session that stands out in anyones mind?

[Tucky]

none recently that I can think off, but then again there's the assumption now that no matter what, Vettel is going to be on pole.

In terms of tyres, what about instead of en extra quali set, how about completely separate tyres for practice, quali and the race, not just one extra set that's taken away. That way teams can spend as much time on track for practice and quali without it affecting their race tyres.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Tucky

In terms of tyres, what about instead of en extra quali set, how about completely separate tyres for practice, quali and the race, not just one extra set that's taken away. That way teams can spend as much time on track for practice and quali without it affecting their race tyres.

agreed. as it is i think they only need 1 extra set, 2 at the most, of the options and that problem is solved. i suspect the problem is FOM shifting the cost of transport to Pirelli and the teams. at some point FOM has to be made to realize that the teams and suppliers exist to help them make money so make it easier for them to always put their best foot forward.

now that we have solved that how do we get low fuel runs in Q3 and a relaxation of parc ferme rules allowing for some sort of quali trim to be used?

[Pingguest]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

Replace lap restrictions with tyres restrictions, and tyres that were falling apart ...sorry can't see 60minutes of action myself.
You only have to look at FP 1 where they do have tyres that have to be handed back and still there is very little action for the first half hour or more.

Remember that the number of sets of tyres per race weekend is limited as well. In the seventies drivers could any number of laps, as the number of laps, engines and (qualifying) tyres were unlimited. From the early eighties the FIA started to limit the number drivers could do during qualifying, as qualifying tyres were limited to two sets per session - a piece of legislation Gilles Villeneuve heavily criticized because of the very reason that cost him his life. As soon as qualifying tyres were gone, the FIA formally allowed no more than twelve laps per qualifying session.

[S griffin]

Who cares if one or two cars don't go out in Q3. They'd be in that position anyway. The battle for pole is the exciting thing!

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Who cares if one or two cars don't go out in Q3. They'd be in that position anyway. The battle for pole is the exciting thing!

fair point but for me the excitement is lost when the fastest lap of the day (usually of the weekend) doesnt actually give you pole?

[mikuni]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

fair point but for me the excitement is lost when the fastest lap of the day (usually of the weekend) doesnt actually give you pole?

You have made reference several times to Q3 being slow and the cars being full of fuel, but I'm pretty for the last few seasons (since 2010 I believe) this hasn't been the case, as refueling was banned.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by mikuni

You have made reference several times to Q3 being slow and the cars being full of fuel, but I'm pretty for the last few seasons (since 2010 I believe) this hasn't been the case, as refueling was banned.

you may be right. i guess im not watching as closely as i should be but isnt Q2 not the session where the fastest times are usually set?