[BTCC] BTCC 2023 season discussion, News and Rumours!

[touring fan01]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

IIRC, the regulations consider any form of testing or competing, in any form of car, as being a breach if the series is still to visit the circuit later in the year. I'm assuming that Hill applied for (and received) dispensation to compete on the GP circuit? Or has he opened himself up to a complaint from other teams later in the season?

theres a big difference

hill would be allowed to do the GP circuit in an old super touring car as its not relevent to the current cars but sutton would obviously not be allowed to do the GP circuit in a current car

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by touring fan01

theres a big difference

hill would be allowed to do the GP circuit in an old super touring car as its not relevent to the current cars but sutton would obviously not be allowed to do the GP circuit in a current car

6.11.1.a
"For the avoidance of doubt any testing or competing by any registered Driver, team or Entrant of any kind whatsoever and regardless of the type of vehicle cannot be undertaken at a venue uding a circuit configuration which largely consists of that which is used at a Meeting of the 2023
Championship until after that Meeting, unless with the specific written authorisation of the Administrator or if the test is an Official organised test day open to all Entrants."

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

6.11.1.a
"For the avoidance of doubt any testing or competing by any registered Driver, team or Entrant of any kind whatsoever and regardless of the type of vehicle cannot be undertaken at a venue uding a circuit configuration which largely consists of that which is used at a Meeting of the 2023
Championship until after that Meeting, unless with the specific written authorisation of the Administrator or if the test is an Official organised test day open to all Entrants."

I think I remember someone getting in trouble for this a few years ago. Might have been a different series though!

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I'm assuming that Hill applied for (and received) dispensation to compete on the GP circuit?

I would assume so. That sort of dispensation is normally allowed if the car being used is sufficiently different, and I doubt there's much cross-over between a FWD Super Tourer and RWD NGTC.

[SSmith]

Perhaps that regulation explains why Jake Hill's planned British GT appearance on the Donington GP course in May got scratched without much explanation. High level series, in a RWD BMW, and on the Donington GP circuit.

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by SSmith

Perhaps that regulation explains why Jake Hill's planned British GT appearance on the Donington GP course in May got scratched without much explanation. High level series, in a RWD BMW, and on the Donington GP circuit.

The problem there was that the team were renting an extra car for the weekend and at the last minute that wasn't available.

[SSmith]

Originally Posted by redshoes

The problem there was that the team were renting an extra car for the weekend and at the last minute that wasn't available.

Oh right, hopefully those issues are resolved for their next scheduled appearance in October.

[Petoli]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

6.11.1.a
"For the avoidance of doubt any testing or competing by any registered Driver, team or Entrant of any kind whatsoever and regardless of the type of vehicle cannot be undertaken at a venue uding a circuit configuration which largely consists of that which is used at a Meeting of the 2023
Championship until after that Meeting, unless with the specific written authorisation of the Administrator or if the test is an Official organised test day open to all Entrants."

What about when it come to substitute drivers?

im guessing there would be a exemption for that cos they may have already competed at the track in another series before

For example

Lets just say before the Knockhill round a driver is ruled for whatever reason and replaced by another driver
They driver they want to replace him with races in TCR UK who have already held around at Knockhill. The concept behind TCR and NGTC are very similar. FWD drive touring car similar power etc. Both specs have competed together in Britcar and TCT over the years

The driver would need dispensation to compete in the BTCC round?

What happens if it is a replacement for the rest of the season?

Would the driver not be allowed to compete the rest of the BTCC season alongside the rest of the TCR UK season
cos the Silverstone TCR national round happens after the Knockhill BTCC round but before the Silverstone BTCC round

[redshoes]

Don't try to 'what if' the BTCC regs too much, you shouldn't always take them too literally. The key phase here is "unless with the specific written authorisation of the Administrator".

To take you example of a TCR driver coming in at Knockhill, if Gow says it's OK then it's OK, regardless of what the rest of the paragraph says.

[S griffin]

The regs are mostly fine atm. We've got a good field and we haven't had too much bad driving of late. Could do with a few more teams and there's no reason for them not to come in

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Petoli

Lets just say before the Knockhill round a driver is ruled for whatever reason and replaced by another driver
They driver they want to replace him with races in TCR UK who have already held around at Knockhill. The concept behind TCR and NGTC are very similar. FWD drive touring car similar power etc. Both specs have competed together in Britcar and TCT over the years

The driver would need dispensation to compete in the BTCC round?

Yes. The driver would need to gain the specific written authorisation of the Administrator before being able to compete.

In practice, this is never usually an issue for the majority of teams, because the driver being replaced is (probably) not in contention for any titles.

For example - if Power Maxed needed a driver to fill in at Knockhill, there would probably be no objections to Jac Constable taking the seat.

However, if it was Nick Halstead having to miss the round then NAPA might object to a driver from TCR UK filling the seat.

[coffinpilot]

Originally Posted by Evantra

I think I remember someone getting in trouble for this a few years ago. Might have been a different series though!

Rob Smith in 2019 raced a 750 Club Enduro race in a Seat Supercopa (IIRC the type of car that is the 'Grandfather' of TCR?) at Croft without permission before the BTCC round and had to sit out FP1. I do remember his 750 race wasn't too good as the back end of the car caught fire early in the race.

[coffinpilot]

The other thing is, I've seen BTCC drivers lapping circuits as instructors before/between BTCC events during the season - do they have to declare that? You do see them head out on their own to sort the car, it's not always as or with a passenger.

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

Rob Smith in 2019 raced a 750 Club Enduro race in a Seat Supercopa (IIRC the type of car that is the 'Grandfather' of TCR?) at Croft without permission before the BTCC round and had to sit out FP1. I do remember his 750 race wasn't too good as the back end of the car caught fire early in the race.

Ahh that must’ve been it! Thank you.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

The other thing is, I've seen BTCC drivers lapping circuits as instructors before/between BTCC events during the season - do they have to declare that? You do see them head out on their own to sort the car, it's not always as or with a passenger.

Do you have any instances of this happening on a layout used by the BTCC before the series visits that venue?
Not saying it hasn't happened - but I recall an interview with Shedden once where it was suggested he would have an advantage at Knockhill knowing the circuit so well. He responded that he hardly ever gets the chance to drive there, because once the weather gets good he is restricted from using the circuit due to BTCC regulations.

[Mike Harte]

What is the situation with Butcher with Knockhill?

[Pickles]

I've heard we're going to have at least one driver change for the remainder of the season.

[Millvi]

Originally Posted by Pickles

I've heard we're going to have at least one driver change for the remainder of the season.

Team Hard? Or elsewhere? Creesy perhaps?

[kipper]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

What is the situation with Butcher with Knockhill?

Although Butcher does a fair amount of instructing, I think his career takes him all over the place and only does a limited amount at Knockhill. Therefore, subject to timing, he doesn't breach any regulations.

[S griffin]

Didn't realise the drivers had to let TOCA know about their other activities on circuit, but it makes sense. To be fair it doesn't keep them from racing in other series if they had the opportunity which is good.

[coffinpilot]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Do you have any instances of this happening on a layout used by the BTCC before the series visits that venue?
Not saying it hasn't happened - but I recall an interview with Shedden once where it was suggested he would have an advantage at Knockhill knowing the circuit so well. He responded that he hardly ever gets the chance to drive there, because once the weather gets good he is restricted from using the circuit due to BTCC regulations.

Over the last 2-3 years at Croft in-season, before the BTCC meeting, I've seen Butcher, Cook, Thompson, Gornall (2020 - he was running some GKR sponsored C1s in-season at a point where he was racing in BTCC, he did drop out just before the Croft round though) and a couple of others. Often with juniors too doing driver coaching.

[coffinpilot]

Originally Posted by Pickles

I've heard we're going to have at least one driver change for the remainder of the season.

If true it must be Hard (Edwards/Butel/Thompson) or One (Powell?) going by who was testing.

Can't see Cook/Moffat struggling for budget, can't really see Butel being short, Thompson would be a shocker considering his performance, and why would others budget a test then drop out?

Purely on conjecture and gossip you'd think it was Edwards/Powell.

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

If true it must be Hard (Edwards/Butel/Thompson) or One (Powell?) going by who was testing.

Can't see Cook/Moffat struggling for budget, can't really see Butel being short, Thompson would be a shocker considering his performance, and why would others budget a test then drop out?

Purely on conjecture and gossip you'd think it was Edwards/Powell.

Toyota advertising for a new engineer… wonder if Gamble might have had enough and taken his with him?

Thompson has posted BTCC stuff the last couple of days (I think Butel too), and Powell is integral to the team (well, not as a driver, but it’s not like he’s about to be booted for poor results!) so shouldn’t think it be either of those two.

Nobody mentioned Pearson was absent from the test too, but again he’s since posted BTCC things on social media.

[Pdh]

Originally Posted by Evantra

Toyota advertising for a new engineer… wonder if Gamble might have had enough and taken his with him?

Thompson has posted BTCC stuff the last couple of days (I think Butel too), and Powell is integral to the team (well, not as a driver, but it’s not like he’s about to be booted for poor results!) so shouldn’t think it be either of those two.

Nobody mentioned Pearson was absent from the test too, but again he’s since posted BTCC things on social media.

No Toyota are advertising for a data engineer that’s a lot different to a race engineer

[touringlegend]

Pertinent to the conversation of drivers competing on tracks before the BTCC round, the Scottish Legends had at the weekend Dexter Patterson as a guest driver. Clockwise on Saturday. Anti clockwise Sunday.