[LM24 Race] 2017 Le Mans 24 Hours Race Thread

[Jam3s]

Originally Posted by zizzo

When seen in motion, his move is still a bit awkward and hard to understand...
https://streamable.com/kvdca

It looks like the generic "can I hitch a ride" tyre gesture one makes. In the night with an orange suit making what's a cultural gesture certainly wasn't wise though...

I'm sure he feels like a right idiot today.

[tux]

Regardless though, poor from Toyota that the car failed due to having to pull away outside of pitlane mode.

[Lola]

With the poor reliability of the LMP1 guys, were they all powered by Honda?

[seanyb505]

Yes

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Lola

With the poor reliability of the LMP1 guys, were they all powered by Honda?

That's not even the low hanging fruit of comedy, that's rotten fruit laying on the ground.

[MaskedRacer]

Post race thoughts on LMP1/LMP2 for Le Mans:

1. I think the pre season 24-36 hour tests we read about do nothing for the teams. Because they are done when they are out there by themselves. I think teams need to run mule cars to simulate traffic conditions if they really want to run a proper test. Porsche should have had there LMP1 and GT teams test together, plus have some extra mules out there.

2. Prototype racing should be survival of the fittest. Look up the definition of the word "prototype". Its appropriate to see high attrition because these are cars built out of innovation that are pushed to the extreme. So yeah, it was a very fun race and for me the most fun prototype race to watch at Le Mans since the Audi - Peugeot battle of 2011.

3. I entered this race with ZERO interest in LMP2. That changed once the LMP1 cars had trouble Rebellion should have won this but they blew it. They did win Petit Le Mans 2 times yes, but they have lost a lot of races they should have done well in. I don't think this team is as good as people think they are. The Jota/DC Chan team really had their stuff together. Very impressive to watch them. I am a Porsche fan but a part of me hope the #2 car had ran into trouble so they could win overall. The gap at the end of the race was 1 lap. The #2 Porsche 919 only need a cut tire in the middle of the track somewhere to have gotten passed.

4. I hope Porsche (p1 only) and Toyota leave the series. Prototype racing needs as good shakeup. Would be awesome to see 2018 be a battle between privateer LMP1 cars and I would think the LMP2 winner could have a outside shot still too.

[Akrapovic]

To be fair to Rebellion, one car had gearbox issues (which is a known problem for the Gibson LMP2 gearbox), and the other had a failed starter motor. They still managed 2nd in class against some of the best teams in the world and only lost to Jota. That's pretty good.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

To be fair to Rebellion, one car had gearbox issues (which is a known problem for the Gibson LMP2 gearbox), and the other had a failed starter motor. They still managed 2nd in class against some of the best teams in the world and only lost to Jota. That's pretty good.

And Rebellion showed their experience, when removing the wing and body work became a PITA, out come the saws and tools to cut a custom access hole. Wonder how long until they push for bodywork changes?

Although, making the rear body work that hard to remove seems foolish. Is it just the Mazda or does the Riley have the split rear cover as well? I think that was the chassis in IMSA with the three piece rear.

[MaskedRacer]

Post race thoughts on GTE for Le Mans:

1. Who is not upset over what happed with the Risi team? I am a loss for words. The one silver lining is that their Ferrari 488 they use for IMSA is still in the USA and was not used for this race. Still how much longer can will they be motivated to run. No team ever has endured more bad crashes than they have. Daytona 2014, Sebring 2014, Long Beach 2017, COTA 2017, Le Mans 2017. I'm sure I'm missing more.

2. Jordan Taylor blew it I'm afraid. He has to drive hard yes, but you still have to watch the traffic. Hitting the LMP2 car probably started making the tries get bad and that caused the off at the chicane which caused the complete cut on the final lap. Still it is great that Corvette was in the hunt. I am not convinced that they will be competitive every year.

3. Porsche fades again. They have this history of fading at the end of an endurance race. They have done it a few times at Daytona and Sebring. It happened again this year. No wonder the Porsche GTLM guys have not won very much lately.

4. Aston Martin win was a surprise. I did not expect it. They were non factors at Silverstone and Spa. But they were the fastest over the course of the 24. Not by much of course.

5. Past winners at Le Mans for GTE:
2017: Aston Martin; 2016: Ford; 2015: Chevy; 2014: Ferrari; 2013: Porsche. We are 5 for 5 now. BMW could make it 6 next year.

6. Great race and very close. I hope GTE gets a higher profile from this point on. Especially since this is the beginning of the end of factory LMP1 cars I think. In 2018 GTE might the only true "FIA World Championship" left in the WEC.

7. Can't wait to see GTLM at Watkins Glen now.

8. Aston Martin needs to run a car in the USA now.

[PascaLM]

I always liked watching Astons DBR9 and Vantage at Le Mans, but I'm afraid that this BoP, as it is today in GTE, will discourage manufacturers from innovating for GT races.

[Peter Mallett]

Yes, what is BOP? If it's power equalization then it does seem a bit daft. May as well have silhouettes which kind of defeats the object. Nonetheless the GTE Pro race was epic.

[rdjones]

Originally Posted by MaskedRacer

4. I hope Porsche (p1 only) and Toyota leave the series. Prototype racing needs as good shakeup. Would be awesome to see 2018 be a battle between privateer LMP1 cars and I would think the LMP2 winner could have a outside shot still too.

I don't think Porsche or Toyota are going anywhere soon. However if you listed to Post Race Tech on RLM it sounds like there are good few P1 cars on the next year from Ginetta, SNP/Dallara, Perrinn and from what Sam Collins said Dome.

So I think next year will be very different.

[jimclark]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Yes, what is BOP? If it's power equalization then it does seem a bit daft. May as well have silhouettes which kind of defeats the object. Nonetheless the GTE Pro race was epic.

Originally Posted by PascaLM

I always liked watching Astons DBR9 and Vantage at Le Mans, but I'm afraid that this BoP, as it is today in GTE, will discourage manufacturers from innovating for GT races.

BoP is for the birds. The new generation doesn't have the patience or the desire to see who deserves to win. All they desire is artificial excitement.
'Sign of the times I'm afraid....

[Articus]

Originally Posted by PascaLM

I always liked watching Astons DBR9 and Vantage at Le Mans, but I'm afraid that this BoP, as it is today in GTE, will discourage manufacturers from innovating for GT races.

I don't think lack of innovation is a problem because that's not the purpose of the category.

There are many more subtle ways to stand out in GTE where it counts and not effected by BOP. Ferrari almost got DQd for the failed leader lights (albeit a stupid rule last year). The other cars in GTE have the leader lights and number panel in the door. Quick change of door if they fail.

The Ferrari has its leader lights in the rear quarter panel...a nightmare to change. Which is why Risi didn't bring the car in last year.

Tire changes, serviceability (Ford has a quick change front end - Most of the other cars do not have a quick change front end). The Ford has its rear wing assembly integrated with the tail lights for a quick change if the tail lights fail (which happened) and they made use of it to good effect.

Corvette traditionally have been very strong with the pit repairs. Porsche on the other hand were traditionally a nightmare. How many times with those old school 996, 997s did we see water pouring out of the front end radiators in an accident...

[S griffin]

Let's actually remember that one of the Toyota's retired due to accident damage, so it wasn't all bad reliability

[Victor_RO]

Unconfirmed reports saying the #13 Rebellion Oreca has been DSQed out of 3rd overall, 35 Alpine moves to the overall podium and DC Racing get a 1-3 in class.

[Scorchess]

Very impressed by Laurent!

[Victor_RO]

Confirmed disqualification for 13 Rebellion Oreca. Official reason - drilling a hole in the bodywork to get to the starter motor and hammer it into life...

[kvenom]

I've been severely disappointed by Rebellion this year, the DSQ is the icing on the cake. Years of running against themselves clearly hasn't been beneficial to the team.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by jimclark

BoP is for the birds. The new generation doesn't have the patience or the desire to see who deserves to win. All they desire is artificial excitement.
'Sign of the times I'm afraid....

I don't think that BoP is primarily for the fans. It's for the manufacturers so that they know they will be competitive and enter. That's why we have Aston in there, at least.

The closeness for the fans is secondary.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Confirmed disqualification for 13 Rebellion Oreca. Official reason - drilling a hole in the bodywork to get to the starter motor and hammer it into life...

Oh no. I thought that was a great solution. had real endurance feel to it.

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Confirmed disqualification for 13 Rebellion Oreca. Official reason - drilling a hole in the bodywork to get to the starter motor and hammer it into life...

Whoa, and whoa. I understand rules, I really do, but how bound up is this race with endless rules?

If the hole had been there already, a pre-planned port, would that have been ok?

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Oh no. I thought that was a great solution. had real endurance feel to it.

EXACTLY!

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by skycafe

Whoa, and whoa. I understand rules, I really do, but how bound up is this race with endless rules?

If the hole had been there already, a pre-planned port, would that have been ok?

As far as I understand it, if the bodywork was homologated with a legal hole somewhere and that hole would have been passed as legal at homologation time, and they could hammer the starter through that hole, then yes.

[seanyb505]

A hole like that wouldn't have been legal I think. Something about body work must cover mechanical components when viewed from above.