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30 Dec 2018, 14:27 (Ref:3873161) | #2526 | |
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30 Dec 2018, 14:33 (Ref:3873162) | #2527 | |
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I don't mind them on the grid if they had a proper car, not this boxer monster
they are either too slow or too fast , ther eis no middle ground with them and supposedly rules have been tweeked that nobody else can build such cars |
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30 Dec 2018, 14:42 (Ref:3873163) | #2528 | |
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Well the car is within the rules, just like the Alfa 155 Silverstone or the Audi Quattro 4wd, so that’s that then
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30 Dec 2018, 17:24 (Ref:3873183) | #2529 | ||
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They'll be on the grid, but I see a repeat of the last two seasons: the car will go well at some tracks and be abysmal during the first half of the season. If Scott had his priorities right two years ago then that car would have been better developed - instead he choose to run too many vehicles and spread resources too thinly and finances then prevented expenditure on development. Mind you if JP hadn't been so damn cocky about the advantages the car had then TOCA might not have been so effective in mitigating those advantages. It is what it is. Ash will get the best out of the car, his teammate will not.
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30 Dec 2018, 19:26 (Ref:3873191) | #2530 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 78
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Well at least hopefully JP will be in a FWD that actually gets developed
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30 Dec 2018, 21:52 (Ref:3873206) | #2531 | ||
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31 Dec 2018, 00:34 (Ref:3873218) | #2532 | ||
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,601
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Quote:
If you were a certain specialist insurance company, would you stick with BMR, and the driver with the most race wins last season, or would you follow a driver who only finished in the top 15 four times out of thirty? |
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31 Dec 2018, 03:08 (Ref:3873230) | #2533 | |||
Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2018
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Quote:
Who has the greatest number of wins on course to break a ton, |
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31 Dec 2018, 06:44 (Ref:3873236) | #2534 | |
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Posts: 18,819
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Depends. If Plato really can rediscover some of that magic with FWD, he's worth taking. Otherwise, it might be the end of the road for him, just because he's no longer fashionable
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
31 Dec 2018, 07:23 (Ref:3873238) | #2535 | ||
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Quote:
If the Subaru change to a FWD layout, with a transaxle style having differential in front of the transmssion (like the FWD version of the Audi A4 super tourer, or like the old Alfasud motor car), would that satisfy you? In that case the fore-aft weight distribution should be quite similar to the other FWD cars, and the lower COG of the boxer can always be corrected with ballast placed up high. |
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31 Dec 2018, 07:30 (Ref:3873239) | #2536 | ||
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Quote:
This picture with the engine uninstalled gives no clues, unfortunately. If the engine is placed all the way towards the front of the car, at it's standard location, I don't see how having a two-cylinder long engine gives them any great advantage. Notably the Subaru BRZ (even though it's RWD) does not have the engine all the way back against the firewall, as there is no room to fit the steering column in-between the flat engine and the chassis rails. So instead (unlike a BMW), it steers the front wheels from behind (instead of in front of) the front axle, and the engine sits in front of the steering rack. Obviously Subaru do not have an inline four engine (unlike the Audi or BMW), so it seems crazy to be against them just for using a layout that is also common to Porsche and many others! |
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31 Dec 2018, 07:48 (Ref:3873241) | #2537 | ||
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Posts: 12,583
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Quote:
Basically, he said the engine is almost under his seat, and when the engine bay is open, people have thought it is missing! The regulations stipulate a minimum propshaft and bellhousing dimension, referenced to the rear axle. When these are applied to the Levorg, the rear half of the engine is further rearward than the pedal box. |
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31 Dec 2018, 10:13 (Ref:3873260) | #2538 | |
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Join Date: Jan 2012
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That picture is especially unhelpful as it’s a rear subframe in shot.
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31 Dec 2018, 12:28 (Ref:3873271) | #2539 | ||
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In simple terms the engine was mounted as low down and far back into the car as physically possible - all done within the rules. When you open the hood of a 911 there is a small suitcase sized stowage area - not dissimilar when you open the hood of the BTCC groveL.
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31 Dec 2018, 13:41 (Ref:3873284) | #2540 | |
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31 Dec 2018, 14:23 (Ref:3873297) | #2541 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
I would have thought that would be easily addressed with a clarification to the rules? Quote:
Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 31 Dec 2018 at 14:37. |
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31 Dec 2018, 15:14 (Ref:3873302) | #2542 | |||
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Posts: 12,583
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Quote:
If specifying a longer prop or bell housing, then the other RWD cars would be impacted too. |
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31 Dec 2018, 16:05 (Ref:3873310) | #2543 | ||
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31 Dec 2018, 16:45 (Ref:3873318) | #2544 | |
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31 Dec 2018, 19:32 (Ref:3873349) | #2545 | ||
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Quote:
The wheelbase on the Levorg is 2650mm The wheelbase on the 1 series is *drumroll*... 2690mm The reason the Levorg was built was because the regulations meant there was a loophole which favoured it and only it. Any other car with a longitudinal engine on the market was a straight 4, meaning more weight further forward. If you put the boxer in the BMW, it’d have an advantage over the 4 cylinder. Plato saying the engine was under his seat is just him selling the sizzle again, it’s nowhere near that far back in reality, it’s just that because it’s (just over) half the length of a straight 4, almost all of the engine is behind the front axle, which is not the case on the BMW. |
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31 Dec 2018, 19:47 (Ref:3873350) | #2546 | ||
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1 Jan 2019, 05:53 (Ref:3873384) | #2547 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
In that case, I don't see any problem whatsoever. What a lot of fuss about nothing! It's the same reason the Alfa Romeo Giulia uses a V6 twin turbo instead of BMW M3's straight six twin turbo, the same reason Nissan's GTR changed from a straight six to a V6. The Lancia coupes with V4 engines were legendary. It's just common sense to use the packaging advantages of a two-bank engine (to offset the penalties of extra cost and weight), and it seems absurd the others would be upset about that!? Quote:
Heck BMW even use an inline six cylinder engine despite the packaging advantages of the V6 engines used by their rivals (Jaguar, Alfa, Lexus, Infiniti, Genesis etc)! So it would be absurd if the BMW entry suddenly had a flat-four or V4. I take it, if WSR wanted to they could commission an independent British engine builder (Judd, AER, MCT, Gibson, Cosworth etc) to build them a custom V4 engine to use in their BMWs? [I presume TOCA requires the engines to be production based, which would scupper this, however? I guess they are worried everyone will soon turn up with a lightweight gear-driven cam racing engine in their "touring" car.] Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 1 Jan 2019 at 06:00. |
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1 Jan 2019, 11:00 (Ref:3873417) | #2548 | ||
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Quote:
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1 Jan 2019, 11:21 (Ref:3873419) | #2549 | |
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1 Jan 2019, 11:28 (Ref:3873420) | #2550 | |
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They’ve actually boosted the series by giving us a champion in Ash Sutton
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