FIA Homologation Papers & HTPs

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by morninggents

Agree that the first step is to get the papers but I doubt you will find a set for the FVC engine.

FVA then........ Sorry, had just been talking about a Chevron fitted with the other

[zefarelly]

I had a customer asking about building/finding a GP5 1300GT last week, screamer!

[Tel 911S]

There are over 20 different sets of Homologation papers for Mk1 & mk 11 Escorts . You also need to know what events you are planning to run in as different sets of period rules [ Appendix J ] can apply and/or FIA Historic K rules might be used which could require a HTP.

So the whole thing is never easy .

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by Tel 911S

So the whole thing is never easy .

Agreed. You have to consider the period too and may be have to chose before 72 or before 74.

[zefarelly]

Pre 66, or at least up to about '64 seems pretty straight forward, obviously, documentary technology didn't keep up with automotive development in the late 60's/early 70's

[Peter Mallett]

Thought I'd post my thanks to Louis and his team, ably assisted by Simon Hadfield for finally getting my Rover HTP. As said above you have to go a bit further to prove what was used in period for the Group 1+ era.

Next year anyone invited to the 76mm will need papers.

Yours sincerely, a very happy bunny. 😁

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Yours sincerely, a very happy bunny. 😁

Very pleased for you Peter! Will you be sleeping with them under the pillow?

We also had good news this week that the red Mog has been granted papers. Nice to be able to thrust them in front of scrutineers- whether they ask for them or not...

[356sc]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

We also had good news this week that the red Mog has been granted papers. Nice to be able to thrust them in front of scrutineers- whether they ask for them or not...

At last!!

I am hearing rumours that there is going to be a clamp down on holes cut in screens, windows, rear screens etc if it cannot demonstrated to be done in period. If this is true, I can understand the intent, but is this going to clobber those cars where holes have been cut to aid in driver ventilation as well?

Has anyone else got wind of this (forgive the pun!!)?

[Gerard C]

Isnt it the kind of detail clearly listed in appendix K? If yes, that's not a rumor but a confirmation. Down here we are not allowed to drive with the driver/passenger window down since the eighties. Exception is made if you use a Nascar type net.
I think they are targeting the cars with Naca ducts in the Perspex windows…

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by 356sc

I am hearing rumours that there is going to be a clamp down on holes cut in screens, windows, rear screens etc if it cannot demonstrated to be done in period. If this is true, I can understand the intent, but is this going to clobber those cars where holes have been cut to aid in driver ventilation as well?

Has anyone else got wind of this (forgive the pun!!)?

When I renewed the papers on my +4 recently I was told that it couldn't be presented for inspection with vent holes in the rear screen. These were on the photo in previous papers, but as that screen was replaced years ago by one without any holes, it was a non-issue! The side screens have 'helicopter' vents, but these weren't commented on..... My take is that it is mainly rear screen vents that are under scrutiny, but who knows- could be wrong!

[Colin McKay]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

When I renewed the papers on my +4 recently I was told that it couldn't be presented for inspection with vent holes in the rear screen. These were on the photo in previous papers, but as that screen was replaced years ago by one without any holes, it was a non-issue! The side screens have 'helicopter' vents, but these weren't commented on..... My take is that it is mainly rear screen vents that are under scrutiny, but who knows- could be wrong!

My E-type application was chucked back for holes in the rear window, (amongst other minor stuff) 2 years ago so nothing new. They were there to help through-ventilation in the car but previous to this scrutineers at Spa weren't happy that the holes were close to the fuel filler, concerned that vapour could find it's way inside. I explained that the holes were there to let the vapour out!

[zefarelly]

If you retain your window mechanisms, as you should, you have the option to open, or close the windows, weather dependant.

nothing beats an opening quarter light and flip out rear side windows

[356sc]

We have both opening windows quarter lights and rear windows on the 356, but found the flow of air onto the driver was minimal. We had therefore resorted to a 3" hole in the Perspex with a bit of "donkey dick" running through it pointed at the driver.We found this to be much better at diverting a stream of air onto the driver!

Although we have been running this for a few years now, my concern is that we will be asked to blank the hole, as not a period modification!

You can see it in this photo....

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by 356sc

Although we have been running this for a few years now, my concern is that we will be asked to blank the hole, as not a period modification!

I would think not- but am not an MSA Inspector!

[Gerard C]

We had the same thing on our CER Corvette C2 (around 70° C inside!). Mostly depends on the scrutineer team. But from the appendix clearly not allowed. In France you will be asked to wind up your window on the pit lane. This comes from crashes where the driver's arm could go outside when the car was accidentally rolled (Christian Maquiné- Commodore Croix en Ternois or Claude Ballot Lena-Alfetta Spa- for instance). But OK bringing fresh air is also a matter of security and comfort as well. To be negotiated!

[zefarelly]

I didn't get hot in Johns 356, all the heats behind you.

Although I did break into a sweat every time I needed to slow down!!!

[356sc]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

Although I did break into a sweat every time I needed to slow down!!!

[delta]

Originally Posted by 356sc

We have both opening windows quarter lights and rear windows on the 356, but found the flow of air onto the driver was minimal. We had therefore resorted to a 3" hole in the Perspex with a bit of "donkey dick" running through it pointed at the driver.We found this to be much better at diverting a stream of air onto the driver!

Although we have been running this for a few years now, my concern is that we will be asked to blank the hole, as not a period modification!

You can see it in this photo....

Hmmmmm also see the lack of front droop.

[Simon Hadfield]

Not necessarily a lack of droop, more likely the relative stiffness of the front anti roll bar......

[356sc]

Or me thumping the curb!!

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

We had the same thing on our CER Corvette C2 (around 70° C inside!). Mostly depends on the scrutineer team. But from the appendix clearly not allowed. In France you will be asked to wind up your window on the pit lane. This comes from crashes where the driver's arm could go outside when the car was accidentally rolled (Christian Maquiné- Commodore Croix en Ternois or Claude Ballot Lena-Alfetta Spa- for instance). But OK bringing fresh air is also a matter of security and comfort as well. To be negotiated!

Amuses me when marshals in the holding area are insisting on saloons winding up the windows (we still have the electric ones in the 75), but open-top cars - TRs, Morgans, etc, have no need of sidescreens at all......

[Gerard C]

Excellent Lancs, really!
I should have realized this before because we were stupid enough to do endurance with a Caterham (1.6 then 1.8), two of us being around 6ft 3.2 (1,91 m). Very hard to keep both arms inside. And the additional straps arms/harnais are not mandatory here (I think this is good).

[Duddha]

Historic Touring Car Challenge Heads to Snetterton - Motor Racing Legends.

Full press release here.

Historic Technical Passports (HTPs)

Good news for Tony Dron Trophy cars! Both the MSA and the FIA have agreed to re-issue (at no cost) any HTPs issued before April 7th 2017 for cars that were meant to be to BTCC regs. The date is when the new class specifically for these cars became part of Appendix K Regulations.

This applies where the HTP has already been approved as a Group 2 car, but where the car is actually to be to the BTCC regulations (effectively Group 1½). Cars must be technically correct to the BTCC regulations, be a correct period specification and complying with Appendix K.

The car will be issued with a revised HTP with the new class and will need to have a new FIA sticker which will be put on the car by an MSA Registrar. The date of expiry would remain the same. The car may need some new photos and revisions to the text. The Registrar will do this.

Normally the same Registrar that carried out the initial inspection would be involved and a fee (to be negotiated with the Registrar) would be payable for his time and effort. However John Hopwood has generously agreed to take the photos and revise text for cars entered in the Tony Dron Trophy at no cost providing the car is at a meeting where he is officiating. Please contact John directly to arrange. Email: jchmotorsport@btinternet.com

We look forward to seeing all the Touring Cars out at Snetterton next month.

Best regards

Duncan Wiltshire
Motor Racing Legends

[PeterMorley]

I'm currently looking at the process for applying for an HTP through the MSA and their initial HTP Application Form already has me confused...

It asks for Make represented and Manufacturer represented.
Is there a difference between the two?

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by PeterMorley

I'm currently looking at the process for applying for an HTP through the MSA and their initial HTP Application Form already has me confused...

It asks for Make represented and Manufacturer represented.
Is there a difference between the two?

I think the answer is- there could be a difference! Not so much a problem with a Ford, BMW or something equally mainstream, but with rarer specialist built racers.

The easiest thing is to fill that in while the car’s being inspected.....