[LM24] La Sarthe/Arnage Track and Other Changes

[valedave]

It is confirmed (see link above).

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by valedave

It is confirmed (see link above).

To be honest I don't actually know what that's confirming. Whether it's the entire grass verge or just part of it. The amount spent on it makes me think it's a large amount.

Also I don't think you can necessarily pin it on the FIA. If you look at the punctuation, they've clearly requested the Tertre Rouge changes. Not sure about the grass removal? But surely the ACO must realise the impact that would have on their circuit?

Hoping it's not as bad as it sounds. But I do genuinely shudder when you consider when the track might look like in 10 years.

[valedave]

Weird that it's in the same sentence. I have a feeling the ACO might be trying to "bury" that news in amongst the Tertre Rouge changes.

Good point though, it may not be all of the grass verge from Mulsanne back through Indy to Porsche Curves.

[Deleted]

The implementation of a gravel trap at the "Virage Corvette", requested by the FIA, is estimated to cost 620,000 € and the reinforcement of the RD 140 and 139 asphalt shoulders between Mulsanne, Arnage and the "Virage Porsche" 450,000 €.

In 10-15 years time everything next to the Circuit de la Sarthe racing line will be asphalt too, every single bit of it. By the way FIA is handling things around the world in their lust-for-all-things-"safety" I honestly cannot see it other way. It will all be ruined and sterilized. Already the steps made in the last 10 years have been so drastic that there is enough prove of that.

Then you happen to see places like Road Atlanta or Laguna Seca by chance and be mystified how pure they look and feel. We have invented a time machine!

[Gingers4Justice]

Eurgh. This is going to look vile.

[Mike E]

I hope we have got the wrong end of the stick here. That view back from Porsche Curves to Arnage is one of my favourite bits of race track anywhere. It would look awful covered in tarmac.

[Deleted]

Having tarmac next to racing line on straights has always annoyed me (even more than having it on corners which is stupid too). What exactly is being achieved here?



This is not really pointed at Sarthe but in general -> You know sometimes I just watch at regular roads + obstacles you might encounter on them and laugh at the current nanny state of FIA mandated super safe circuits. It just all seems just silly when you think how normal people with whatever licenses and vehichles drive through these, and then you look back at the asphaltdrome racing circuits we have today






'





Thank god we still have Nordschleife.

[Simmi]

Might be one for our resident forum locals to investigate.

Strikes me that if they were going to tarmac all those stretches they would need to be under way with it by now?

[Deleted]

Well it says "From May 12th to 14th, the Colas company will proceed with pavement enlargements. From May 19th to 20th, the tar will be poured and traffic closures and detours will be put in place." But is that bit about the extension in question...

There's also line "we took care of other projects like safety at the chicanes". I doubt it means Mulsanne chicanes since they've already paved those surroundings all the way through... unless walls are put further back

Anyway all of this continuing work has every sign of attempting to transform Sarthe into Grade 1 track without actually any intention of doing so...

[Mal]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Well it says "From May 12th to 14th, the Colas company will proceed with pavement enlargements. From May 19th to 20th, the tar will be poured and traffic closures and detours will be put in place." But is that bit about the extension in question...

There's also line "we took care of other projects like safety at the chicanes". I doubt it means Mulsanne chicanes since they've already paved those surroundings all the way through... unless walls are put further back

Anyway all of this continuing work has every sign of attempting to transform Sarthe into Grade 1 track without actually any intention of doing so...

I cant see them tarmac-ing the extent of area being discussed within that time frame?

Maybe it is tarmacing the existing gravel traps between those corners mentioned?

[Deleted]

IF they replaced Indianapolis gravel trap with tarmac it would be one of the most ridiculous things ever. How would that even help in sloving down in such high speed corner... usually cars end up there sideways anyway. And barrier is so close.

With Arnage, I don't think they would bother seeing as they decided to use mostly gravel for last year's new widening extension

[batmobile]

Today I made a lap on the public part of the track. No works preparing elsewhere than at the Tertre Rouge Curve. Lot of tires to protect the crashes at the Porsche Curve :
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6...ge+Porsche+-+1
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-f...ge+Porsche+-+2

[CTD]

Originally Posted by batmobile

Today I made a lap on the public part of the track. No works preparing elsewhere than at the Tertre Rouge Curve. Lot of tires to protect the crashes at the Porsche Curve :
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6...ge+Porsche+-+1
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-f...ge+Porsche+-+2

Thank you Eric!
Good to see that there hasn't been made any of the massive, feared, changes to the entry of Porsche Curves.

[Deleted]

Well not... yet. Could some of these annoying asphalt extensions be made later in the year post-LM? That press release didn't really give that much details of the timeframes, apart from those quoted lines.

Oh and as ever thank ya for the updates.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Well not... yet. Could some of these annoying asphalt extensions be made later in the year post-LM? That press release didn't really give that much details of the timeframes, apart from those quoted lines.

Oh and as ever thank ya for the updates.

The extended run-off areas was presented to be part of this years Le Mans, together with the work at Tertre Rouge.
Of course, it is possible that it has been put off to the future, but the more years without, the better!

[Deleted]

Well the bit where it mentions "reinforcement of the RD 140 and 139 asphalt shoulders between Mulsanne, Arnage and the "Virage Porsche" 450,000 €" doesn't make a mention of when the work is expected to be completed. As they talk of 2014 Syndicat Mixte investments I'm sure the tarmac-addons will be -unfortunately- carried out this year, but maybe it's for later in the year.

IMO if I had the choice, I'd rather see these changes right now than delay the inevitable for next year and be frustrated by it then. Better to get it out of the way than look at the unspoiled grass/gravel this year and know it'll be ruined in 12 months time.

Going back to the chicanes - I re-read the article and the to-be-modified-for-safety chicanes in question actually really are the Mulsanne chicanes. In a way I'm pleased by that as they're already filled with unneccessary amount of tarmac runoff -> it cannot really be ruined any further. My guess would be moving back the walls of the first chicane to prevent the likes of Audi 2012 collisions...

[batmobile]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Well the bit where it mentions "reinforcement of the RD 140 and 139 asphalt shoulders between Mulsanne, Arnage and the "Virage Porsche" 450,000 €" doesn't make a mention of when the work is expected to be completed. As they talk of 2014 Syndicat Mixte investments I'm sure the tarmac-addons will be -unfortunately- carried out this year, but maybe it's for later in the year.

IMO if I had the choice, I'd rather see these changes right now than delay the inevitable for next year and be frustrated by it then. Better to get it out of the way than look at the unspoiled grass/gravel this year and know it'll be ruined in 12 months time.

Going back to the chicanes - I re-read the article and the to-be-modified-for-safety chicanes in question actually really are the Mulsanne chicanes. In a way I'm pleased by that as they're already filled with unneccessary amount of tarmac runoff -> it cannot really be ruined any further. My guess would be moving back the walls of the first chicane to prevent the likes of Audi 2012 collisions...

I'll try to get some informations about these works but even if I live here, if you don't know the anyone working at the ACO or around, it's difficult to get them. To be continued.

[CTD]

Thank you for your efforts Eric, even if they don't bear fruits.

[Simmi]

I think the plan was to add some more tyres at the chicanes but I can't remember exactly. I think they wanted to add a pile along the barriers on entry/exit to cover off a lot of these 'snap' accidents we see under braking/acceleration.

That's my preference to making big changes but I just hope we don't keep finding tyres in the middle of the track during race week.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Simmi

I just hope we don't keep finding tyres in the middle of the track during race week.

Not a fan of the Slovakiaring style?

[GT6]

Eric, thanks for all your info, it is always handly to have a man on the ground to see what is actually happening, See you in 3 weeks

[wewantourdarbyback]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Not a fan of the Slovakiaring style?

Or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyXEp2M8exQ


Could perhaps the tarmac just involve putting down asphalt at the points where it turns, where the curbs are, which is where Rocky went off and lost it on the grass in 11.

[Deleted]

Nothing really new but nevertheless:

http://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=30697

Further plans now include the replacement of the grass between track and armco between Mulsanne Corner and the Porsche curves – That in itself will lead to a major visual change for the circuit! It’s not currently clear when that further change will be introduced.

Waybe it's just wording (or their view of the ACO press release) but that makes it sound as if ALL of the grass is to go up there..

This is more depressing than the two BoP-GT categories carrying on, because it's permanent.

[deggis]

How few metres of tarmac in that area is supposed to make any difference for a car that is already out of control? And then they keep the 1970s armocs, ironic. I'd much rather keep the grass and build more modern, higher barries/armcos, with actual fences. It's kind of incredible that especially in that part of the track there are still those low armcos, imagine slighty airborne car - hello trees.

Maybe in the kind of case where car goes off and spins because of the grass it might help keep the car under control instead, but that doesn't seem to happen often anyway... especially not on a straight.

[Deleted]

Spot on... and I can't believe I have to agree with Eurosport's Marc Cole too, but last year he kept mentioning the outdated barriers and how replacing them shold be the number one priority of the ACO in the wake of the accident(s).

Not messing around with couple of meters of grass next to the racing line!!! It makes no sense. Destroys everything visually and nothing is gained. The only thing that does change is cars shortcutting the track to gain better lap time, which is what always happens with tarmac runoffs (or "extension")

I wish Graham or somebody could interview the ACO for reasonings behinds these specific changes...