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8 Apr 2019, 11:43 (Ref:3896212) | #251 | ||
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After the penalty was awarded, Tim said that he had noticed it but didn't want to say anything.
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Likewise, any driving standards type penalties will be based on reviewing all available evidence (video or otherwise), not based solely on what the bloke on the telly says. He needs to stop sitting on the fence. The point of the second (expert/ex-driver) commentator is to offer an opinion. |
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8 Apr 2019, 11:44 (Ref:3896213) | #252 | |||
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Although, I think what he may have meant was that whilst he may be employed to commentate, he does not want to be seen as interfering with the judicial procedures in place. I can't recall him stating that a driver should be penalised (or even pass comment on a possible transgression) until after the officials are already aware of or acting upon an incident. |
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8 Apr 2019, 11:49 (Ref:3896214) | #253 | ||
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If Tim Harvey had drawn the viewers' attention to JP's out-of-box position - can we really be certain that posters would not claim that he is interfering?
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8 Apr 2019, 11:57 (Ref:3896216) | #254 | |
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8 Apr 2019, 11:58 (Ref:3896217) | #255 | ||
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It's a commentators job to draw the viewers attention to significant events. Tim is far too diplomatic at the best of times, and now he's just not bothering. |
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8 Apr 2019, 12:08 (Ref:3896218) | #256 | |||
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Better off to leave the officiating of the event to the officials, and than pass his comment on matters once they are in the hands of the officials. As implied by the title 'commentator', he should be passing comment not passing judgement. |
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8 Apr 2019, 12:10 (Ref:3896219) | #257 | ||
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8 Apr 2019, 12:10 (Ref:3896220) | #258 | |
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He said something like "I thought I saw him over his grid spot but I didn't want to say anything in case..." when the penalty was announced. (just in case you needed to read it a 4th time, my I'm slow at typing)
Great days racing by the way, great to have cars with different strengths and weaknesses, makes for great racing. I would like to see less of the "BMW and Subaru are too quick" when they do well and no one complains when a Honda wins with double/triple the gap. I also hope they don't keep up with the frequent cutting to Blundell running around in no mans land, rather than the actual action. I guess it isn't is bad as when they overdid showing the driver's family before the overtake had even finished. Surprised Chilton is the only penalty, surely Hamilton should have gotten something for nearly wiping out the leader. |
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8 Apr 2019, 12:21 (Ref:3896222) | #259 | ||
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He doesn't need to pass judgement. He could just say "Jason is quite far forward in his slot", or "Sutton accidentally loved tapped the back of the Audi there". That gives the benefit of the doubt. Completely ignoring it (in JPs case) and changing the details or what happened (in the Audi/Subaru case) is poor. |
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8 Apr 2019, 13:28 (Ref:3896232) | #260 | ||
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8 Apr 2019, 14:13 (Ref:3896242) | #261 | ||
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They even cut off Steve/Tim/Paul mid-sentence just as they were discussing something relevant about Turkington to show Lewis talking to Nic in the car. Wonder if they'll cut to shots of James Martin next time he's in Plato's pit?! |
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8 Apr 2019, 14:47 (Ref:3896247) | #262 | |
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Join Date: Jan 2019
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They wanted to point out that the drive was all about Nic and his own sponsors etc. Of course his name gives him an advantage in some respects, but he's done well on his own merit without any major involvement from anyone else.
But..... They're not really going to completely ignore the fact that a multiple time F1 World Champion is there in the pit lane are they?! |
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8 Apr 2019, 15:12 (Ref:3896252) | #263 | |
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I think I’m just annoyed because I’m not a Lewis fan, so him getting TV coverage just irritates me
Anyway... I was impressed by Nic this weekend, the car obviously works for him. Bobby Thompson also impressed me, shame he made the wrong call after race one on tyres though, he could have had a mega weekend, him and Goff are clearly getting the best out of the CCs. Same with Jelley, didn’t think much of him last year but he had a great weekend. |
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8 Apr 2019, 15:17 (Ref:3896253) | #264 | |||
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And I am sure that Monster sponsoring Nic is no way connected to the fact that they just so happen to also personally sponsor F1's Hamilton. I would like to say that Nic has really come on as a driver and appears to improved significantly. I am sure that nearly tripping up the leader will have been a lesson learnt. |
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8 Apr 2019, 15:26 (Ref:3896255) | #265 | ||
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So Nic Hamilton has a brother would appears to be a tattoo artist's bill board and who drives a car in a race series that is about as noncompetitive as it could possibly be. Nic races in a series that had something like 17 different winners last year and is about the most competitive race series. Now who is the racing driver?
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8 Apr 2019, 15:55 (Ref:3896264) | #266 | |
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Both of them? I think, whilst getting fairly widespread coverage (including on BBC website, despite no other BTCC articles), it would be nice to hear Nic occasionally say “obviously the surname helps”. But that’s how motorsport works, if you can generate the cash then you do it. Like Blundell, I’d be surprised if he expects to be competitive but it’s probably easier for him to get sponsors to raise the budget for a BTCC season than doing some single make championship. |
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8 Apr 2019, 15:57 (Ref:3896266) | #267 | |||
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I think I will start referring to Lewis as Nic Hamiltons brother on the F1 forum. |
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8 Apr 2019, 17:30 (Ref:3896284) | #268 | ||
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Unless someone is blatantly to blame for an incident, no punishments should be handed out in my opinion. You win some, you lose some. If you are making a genuine attempt to get past someone fairly, then you shouldn;t be penalised if contact results. |
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8 Apr 2019, 17:39 (Ref:3896286) | #269 | ||
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8 Apr 2019, 17:41 (Ref:3896287) | #270 | |||
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Regardless of whether your attempt to get past is fair, if you are at least partially to blame, then you have to accept that you can not have an advantage from the contact. All Chilton had to do (as Jelley did) is concede the place back and try again. The official BTCC website wording(s): 'Chilton […] was adjudged to have gained an advantage during contact […] Chilton failed to give the position back during the race itself and was therefore penalised' 'As part of the Driving Standards Guidelines issued to all drivers, ‘A driver who gains an unfair advantage through contact caused by them will be penalised, unless they surrender that advantage before a further lap is completed’, and this is something that Chilton failed to do during the incident. […] Jelley made similar contact with Neal during the race in a separate incident but relinquished his position as the guidelines dictate.' It's clear to the drivers and the officials. So as much as it might be disagreed with here, that's how it is. |
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9 Apr 2019, 08:25 (Ref:3896379) | #271 | |
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I suppose one thing it does show is how inappropriate Platos punishment was. Start a couple of inches out of position in race 1 and you lose the whole day. Punt someone out of the way and you get five seconds. Not just a BTCC problem. A similar thing happened to Crutchlow in MotoGP.
Always going to be tricky to know where to draw the line between a real advantage and a mistake though. |
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9 Apr 2019, 09:16 (Ref:3896387) | #272 | ||
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And then we have Jelly who just punted into the side of Neal, eventually about ending his race. |
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9 Apr 2019, 09:45 (Ref:3896391) | #273 | ||
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I just wish that they would just enforce the no-contact rule, which saloon car racing is supposed to have. That would mean a complete ban on 'door handle bashing', 'paint swapping' and 'love taps' and so on. They all invariably upset the composure of the car that's been hit, meaning that the transgressor will have potentially gained an advantage.
With all the technology available in the CoC's control centre, it should be easy to police, and the transgressor should be black flagged immediately. I would hazard a guess that the drivers would stop doing this immediately after the first culprit was punished in this way. I appreciate that my view may be considered old fashioned, but having competed for 5 years against the likes of Gerry Marshall and other such great drivers, we never needed to use our racers as bumper cars. And most of the saloon car racing back then was just as exciting as today's BTCC; it just didn't cost us a fortune to have to replace car body parts after each race. |
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9 Apr 2019, 10:43 (Ref:3896397) | #274 | ||
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so if for example a car in front misses a gear which caused the car to momentarily hesitate and the car right behind tapping him through no fault of his own...your system would black flag that innocent driver immediately! no thanks |
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9 Apr 2019, 10:53 (Ref:3896398) | #275 | |||
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So, in your example, the car in front misses a gear, causing the car behind to tap him wide, gaining a place, how will race control/Alan Gow/second car's team know this is what happened, so he doesn't have to give the place back to prevent being awarded a penalty? (Also, with the modern sequential gearboxes fitted to BTCC cars, missing a gear doesn't really happen). |
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