2022-2023 Silly Season Thread

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by Bcarr6

Word is Mclaren paid Riccardo 10Million, but if another team employs him, they pay him that less any wage he gets for the year.

EG- Alpine hire him for 7m, Mclaren only pay 3m.

Only a rumour though so as with all this, no clue if theres really any foundation to it

That sounds like an F1 contract all right!

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Zero chance of that financially. The only way McLaren pay full whack is if DR doesn’t drive.

Given how little is made public about F1 contracts, how could we know?

Hypothetically speaking tho, what happens if DR signs his next f1 contract for $1? Heck he could even choose to pay his next team if he wanted to.

Not so much a question about DR…I just think it’s ridiculous how F1 contracts are lodged and executed. If one can infer anything from the guy who used to run the show, it’s that this whole thing is kind of set up to allow people to hide their money and avoid taxes.

[Mike Harte]

Nothing wrong about avoiding paying 1 penny/cent more than you are legally permitted. Unless all governments in the world agree to equalise taxation (and I am not saying that I advocate such a thing) then individuals whether rich or poor are entitled to use all legal methods to not pay more than you need to.

In the UK, as I am sure applies in the rest of the world, there are hundreds of inequalities in taxation just as there are between self-employed and the employed. And that is something that was highlighted in the UK during the earlier days of Covid when it came to governmental benefits paid.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

Given how little is made public about F1 contracts, how could we know?

Agree

Originally Posted by chillibowl

Hypothetically speaking tho, what happens if DR signs his next f1 contract for $1? Heck he could even choose to pay his next team if he wanted to.

I am not an attorney, but I play one on this forum.

Seriously, I would assume that if I were McLaren, part of releasing Daniel would include conditions. Those would include the clawback of funds if he is employed as a driver for another F1 team. And I would also include some condition in which any compensation should be "reasonable and appropriate". Meaning, he couldn't drive for free or for minimal fee and just pocket the money from McLaren. If I was Daniel, I would negotiate for some level of compensation that regardless of how much he might be paid that they can't claw it ALL back. Now, I can expect that he may land somewhere and still pocket some money from McLaren as wherever he lands is unlikely (IMHO) to pay him the same that McLaren was. I think Daniel is somewhat "damaged goods" at this point (given his prior standings), but still provides value to a midfield team. He just needs to find a car that suits him.

Anyhow, If Daniel might not want to accept the type of conditions I call out above, then McLaren could just effectively keep him employed, pay him his full balance and just park him for a year. However Daniels existing contract might include clauses that ensures he is in the car and racing. To the point above about not knowing the details... its speculation.

I think in the end, whatever the conditions of his release is beneficial to both parties. McLaren gets to pick a new driver for 2023, probably can claw back some funds if/when Daniel is picked up by another team, Daniel has some cash in pocket just in case things don't work out for him in 2023 and he is also a free agent and able to move on for 2023. There might even be some conditions in which both parties don't bad mouth each other for a period of time.

Richard

[Richard C]

We also don't know the payment schedule for him. We assume is a lump sum. It could be structured to be paid out over time to make any clawback easier to implement.

Richard

[Richard C]

Interesting details regarding Alonso's perspective on how things transpired, and who knew what and when regarding his Alpine exit.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/a...nths/10357711/

Key points in his story

1. Discussion with Aston Martin was maybe quick after Vettel announcement (might also be intelligently worded as well... nothing says they were not talking prior to Vettel making his announement)
2. Talks with Alpine were stalled
3. People at Alpine did know he was leaving prior to the Aston Martin announcement regarding Alonso. How much sooner is undefined.

Richard

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

3. People at Alpine did know he was leaving prior to the Aston Martin announcement regarding Alonso. How much sooner is undefined.

from that link:

Alonso admitted that Szafnauer "probably didn't know anything" but said he did tell everyone who had been involved in talks that he was leaving prior to the announcement.

"I informed [Alpine CEO] Laurent Rossi, president Luca de Meo, my mechanics and my engineers before any announcement," Alonso said.


if true, the lack of communication within Alpine and/or communication between Otmar and the rest of Alpine is shockingly bad!

[justracing]

Financial issues aside , I'm none too sure that Danny Ric would be welcomed back at Alpine(Renault).

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

from that link:

Alonso admitted that Szafnauer "probably didn't know anything" but said he did tell everyone who had been involved in talks that he was leaving prior to the announcement.

"I informed [Alpine CEO] Laurent Rossi, president Luca de Meo, my mechanics and my engineers before any announcement," Alonso said.


if true, the lack of communication within Alpine and/or communication between Otmar and the rest of Alpine is shockingly bad!

Question is... when did Alonso give the heads up to Alpine before the announcement was made by Aston Martin? Days, hours, minutes?

Richard

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

Question is... when did Alonso give the heads up to Alpine before the announcement was made by Aston Martin? Days, hours, minutes?

Richard

of course i dont know but you would expect one of the several people mentioned would have sent it either up or down the ladder within minutes of learning that one of the more storied talents their team has ever had is leaving.

i suppose they could have all assumed that Alonso would have sent Otmar a similar message...but even then, none of them wanted to discuss the 'next step' with their team principle?

in todays day and age of mass communicating and group texts...add this to the OP mess and its not a good look imo.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

of course i dont know but you would expect one of the several people mentioned would have sent it either up or down the ladder within minutes of learning that one of the more storied talents their team has ever had is leaving.

i suppose they could have all assumed that Alonso would have sent Otmar a similar message...but even then, none of them wanted to discuss the 'next step' with their team principle?

Hard to say. I can imagine it working like this...

Alonso give a handful of people he works with a heads up. It is effectively something like "I am leaving for Aston Martin. I wanted you guys to hear it from me first. I will let management know after I finish with you."

Alonso then notifies CEO's of Renault and Alpine. Maybe he wanted to notify the top and let them decide how to push the new downward. Maybe he was playing games and wanted to deliver his own message vs. having it filter through Szafnauer. Maybe all of the above. Maybe he didn't give anyone at the executive level enough time to push the news out. Maybe they did and people like Szafnauer found out about it via news reports before he checked his email or messages. Maybe they called Szafnauer and he was on the phone. It can be a thousand things.

In most all of those situations, I expect the most likely one is that Renault/Alpine have very little notice BEFORE the announcement hit from Aston Martin. My speculation is that Alonso signed his contract. Aston Martin then (or later) told Alonso "we are about to send out the press release" and then Alonso told who he told.

Originally Posted by chillibowl

in todays day and age of mass communicating and group texts...add this to the OP mess and its not a good look imo.

Whatever happened it is a mess. And some games were probably being played somewhere.

Richard

[GreenMachine]

Originally Posted by justracing

Financial issues aside , I'm none too sure that Danny Ric would be welcomed back at Alpine(Renault).

Otmar has already said he is open to a DR return.

The CRB result will be a determinant of a DR return, there may be a vacancy, or there may not ...

[GusGasfuss]

I can't believe, that any of the other team members and the Alpine CEO would not act immediately, to have Piastri in for next year. Even if they don't like Szafnauer.
Its their team and their missing driver...

[Alan52]

Originally Posted by GusGasfuss

I can't believe, that any of the other team members and the Alpine CEO would not act immediately, to have Piastri in for next year. Even if they don't like Szafnauer.
Its their team and their missing driver...

By the time Alonso had decided to go it was too late.Their option on Piastri had expired.On that date he was no more “their driver” than Max Verstappen was.
They paid the price for prioritising a 41 year old Alonso over a 21 year old Piastri.

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by Alan52

By the time Alonso had decided to go it was too late.Their option on Piastri had expired.On that date he was no more “their driver” than Max Verstappen was.
They paid the price for prioritising a 41 year old Alonso over a 21 year old Piastri.

Looks like someone forgot to check every detail…..

[peebee2]

Lots of suggestions Ricc has signed to Haas, and Schumi to Alpine.

[peebee2]

Lots rumours here Ricc signed to Haas and Schumi to Alpine.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Lots rumours here Ricc signed to Haas and Schumi to Alpine.

waves of nostalgia thinking about the prospect of young Schumi driving for his dad's old team.

[S griffin]

Alfa Romeo will no longer be partners of Sauber at the end of next year:

https://www.planetf1.com/news/alfa-r...uber-end-2023/

[bathurst77]

Alpine Formula 1 team boss Otmar Szafnauer says he wishes that Oscar Piastri had “a bit more integrity” after the Australian signed a contract with McLaren.

"He's a promising young driver,” he said. “He hasn't driven in F1 yet. And my wish for Oscar was that he had a bit more integrity.

“He signed a piece of paper as well back in November and we've done everything on our end of the bargain to prepare him for F1.

“And his end of the bargain was to either drive for us, or take a seat where we would place him for the next three years. And I just wish Oscar would have remembered what he signed in November and what he signed up to."

Asked if the team was already in discussions with drivers other than Piastri Szafnauer said: “I think the right thing for us to do is to go to the CRB on Monday, see how that pans out, and then start looking at some negotiations in earnest."

Szafnauer did not deny that Ricciardo is a candidate for the job.
"The team speak very highly of Daniel and his time here. We haven't had those strategic discussions yet, but everybody I ask, the engineering team, they really speak highly of his skill as a driver and as a team motivator."

[bathurst77]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Alfa Romeo will no longer be partners of Sauber at the end of next year:

https://www.planetf1.com/news/alfa-r...uber-end-2023/

I guess they tread water for a few years and then become Audi f1
Be sad to lose the name Sauber on the grid after all these years

[bathurst77]

makes me wonder if the CBR rule that Oscar is still bound to Alpine, how welcome would he be there? Seems he has burned some bridges, could he be parked for a year or more, or given to williams? He might find Alpine a lonely place with few friends now

#Snookered

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by bathurst77

makes me wonder if the CBR rule that Oscar is still bound to Alpine, how welcome would he be there? Seems he has burned some bridges, could he be parked for a year or more, or given to williams? He might find Alpine a lonely place with few friends now

#Snookered

He’s working as their Reserve Driver right now, so wouldn’t be an issue at all. Not that it’s likely to happen of course.

[V8 Fireworks]

Originally Posted by peebee2

He’s working as their Reserve Driver right now, so wouldn’t be an issue at all. Not that it’s likely to happen of course.

Is it?

The pro-Alpine faction seem to think they have a strong contract, whereas Alpine themselves have also previously noted it was a non-binding "Heads of Terms" agreement. Very confusing!

I guess the CRB ruling on Monday will be crucial. One assumes Webber, Neal, Piastri and McLaren have dotted their i's and crossed their t's. Yet the pro-Alpine faction assume that Alpine have done that, and it is Piastri who is in the wrong. Terribly confusing!

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks

Is it?

The pro-Alpine faction seem to think they have a strong contract, whereas Alpine themselves have also previously noted it was a non-binding "Heads of Terms" agreement. Very confusing!

I guess the CRB ruling on Monday will be crucial. One assumes Webber, Neal, Piastri and McLaren have dotted their i's and crossed their t's. Yet the pro-Alpine faction assume that Alpine have done that, and it is Piastri who is in the wrong. Terribly confusing!

Yes, I’d say very long odds on him driving the Alpine, but we shall see!