[WEC] Ferrari Hypercar Discussion

[Mike E]

Originally Posted by kartman24

Does anyone know if the car going to need a new monocoque?

'Ferrari deconstructed its No. 51 car after the crash, which initially fed speculation that the AF Corse team might have been preparing to replace the chassis. However, Ferrari’s testing manager for GT and sports racing cars Gianluca Salvi confirmed the chassis is not being changed. “The front right corner was smashed, and that’s all,” he told Sportscar365. “Internally, the electrical parts were safe.”'

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...ay-notebook-2/

[kvenom]

Originally Posted by Mike E

'Ferrari deconstructed its No. 51 car after the crash, which initially fed speculation that the AF Corse team might have been preparing to replace the chassis. However, Ferrari’s testing manager for GT and sports racing cars Gianluca Salvi confirmed the chassis is not being changed. “The front right corner was smashed, and that’s all,” he told Sportscar365. “Internally, the electrical parts were safe.”'

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...ay-notebook-2/

They've changed their minds:

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...-accident.html

[joeb]

Originally Posted by kvenom

They've changed their minds:

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...-accident.html

Better safe than sorry I guess.

[S griffin]

Yes, especially with it being so close to the start of the season. Then they can have a proper examination of the original chassis for damage

[veeten]

Understandable and smart to swap out the chassis before the start of this week. That one will probably be returned to Italy so that they can take a better look at it. And seeing that Dallara is building for three manufacturers (Ferrari, BMW, Cadillac), this can also give them more information as to the possible problem areas that could crop up. Even with specific designs for each company.

[broadrun96]

BMW and Caddy should be very very similar other than bodywork based on rules.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

BMW and Caddy should be very very similar other than bodywork based on rules.

Does it make you wonder if the Ferrari is the same tub as well? DSC (that i can't find now) had an article on what the lmdh lmh cars look like without front bodywork, seems to be differences between the bmw and caddy. So lots of freedom i guess is my point, even if you start with the same tub.

[skycafe]

Here is the DSC Gallery of the chassis fronts

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...uncovered.html

[FIRE]

Is this not a unique design? Makes more sense for a LMH car.

[skycafe]

"Since it's an LMH type, Ferrari was able to develop its own chassis for the 499P, as opposed to the LMDh types in the same class whose chassis must come from either Dallara, Multimatic, Ligier, or Oreca."

From:
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a4...-car-revealed/

[DistortedSmile]

Originally Posted by veeten

And seeing that Dallara is building for three manufacturers (Ferrari, BMW, Cadillac)

I've no idea where you got that Dallara built the Ferrari, the most I can find is that they collaborated on the carbon frame.

Originally Posted by FIRE

Is this not a unique design? Makes more sense for a LMH car.

It is, Ferrari themselves said the whole reason they went the LMH route is because they wanted the car to be 'a true Ferrari'.

According to Antonello Colleta: “We chose LMH because, for Ferrari, it’s important to make all the car,” “Ferrari is a manufacturer and for us, it’s not our philosophy to buy part of the car.”

https://www.autosport.com/wec/news/h...ophy/10394029/

[kvenom]

Ferrari probably designed it and outsourced part of the build to Dallara or something like that.

[deggis]

DSC says "Dallara-built chassis" like in this link below. Building vs. designing.

Originally Posted by kvenom

They've changed their minds:

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...-accident.html

[CTD]

So the same as Audi did for many years

[PhilipR]

Quite happy with pace of Ferrari considering first race and on a difficult track. With more racing and development they should compete at the top with toyota quite soon

[joeb]

Ferrari is focused on the WEC this year but still want to be in IMSA at some point. No plans on how that would work logistically, but haven't completely ruled it out.

https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/f...r-gtp-program/

[CTD]

Originally Posted by joeb

Ferrari is focused on the WEC this year but still want to be in IMSA at some point. No plans on how that would work logistically, but haven't completely ruled it out.

https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/f...r-gtp-program/

Would require rule changes at IMSA as well.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by CTD

Would require rule changes at IMSA as well.

How so? I thought Hypercars were allowed in IMSA just as LMDh are allowed in WEC.

[Adam43]

You have to produce over 2,500 cars a year. Bad for Glick, but Ferrari sold 2,948 units in the US last year. (Actually I guess it is worldwide not US and also produce not sell?)

Is there anything else? I lose track.

The Glick take on this:
https://www.thedrive.com/news/glicke...ar-from-racing
https://us.motorsport.com/imsa/news/...imsa/10433480/

[deggis]

Originally Posted by Adam43

You have to produce over 2,500 cars a year. Bad for Glick, but Ferrari sold 2,948 units in the US last year. (Actually I guess it is worldwide not US and also produce not sell?)

The written rule itself does not say US/NA. Might be ambiguous on purpose, or just goes to show how haphazardly they added this rule after Glickhaus began complaining about it (prior to 2022 it was not part of the public rulebook, was slightly reworded for 2023). Either way, Ferrari is not going to have a problem here.

1.32. Manufacturer means an officially recognized IMSA Official Automotive Partner pursuant to a separate agreement with IMSA, with annual production of 2,500 or more vehicles for public consumption and public road use.

It is not a LMH/GTP rule, it is in the sporting regs and affects GTD too. Michelin Pilot Challenge has it too in its sportings. Also not to be confused with the very similarly worded rule in the common LMDh technical regs.

[broadrun96]

The same rule would have kept Panoz out of GT4, they went SRO and brought the car to the corner of the HSR and IMSA paddock in the fall.

[Adam43]

Every manufacturer becomes boring once they produce more than 2,500 cars a year

[joeb]

Originally Posted by deggis

The written rule itself does not say US/NA. Might be ambiguous on purpose, or just goes to show how haphazardly they added this rule after Glickhaus began complaining about it (prior to 2022 it was not part of the public rulebook, was slightly reworded for 2023). Either way, Ferrari is not going to have a problem here.

1.32. Manufacturer means an officially recognized IMSA Official Automotive Partner pursuant to a separate agreement with IMSA, with annual production of 2,500 or more vehicles for public consumption and public road use.

It is not a LMH/GTP rule, it is in the sporting regs and affects GTD too. Michelin Pilot Challenge has it too in its sportings. Also not to be confused with the very similarly worded rule in the common LMDh technical regs.

And Ferrari is already an officially recognized IMSA entrant as they pay the fee for GT. That would not be the hurdle for them to join IMSA like some other companies have complained about in the past.

[broadrun96]

Yup, just like Toyota if they wanted both the Lexus and Supra programs. And it's been hinted Pug would be covered by Stellantis and Alfa. Although that's one that's been odd cause Alfa doesn't sell the TCR car in the US so.......

[veeten]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Yup, just like Toyota if they wanted both the Lexus and Supra programs. And it's been hinted Pug would be covered by Stellantis and Alfa. Although that's one that's been odd cause Alfa doesn't sell the TCR car in the US so.......

But they do sell the Guilia and Stelvio, as well as their performance-derived Quadrifoglio models, as well as the new for '23 Tonale. Remember, it's about overall production, not specific models or trim groups.