[Rules] The FIA - what's occurring there?

[Gerard C]

May be they're thinking about to establish a counter-power. Or just pretend. Political maneuver?

[mattcanary]

Originally Posted by Richard C

The question is how to measure. For many it can be a subjective thing. There are groups who try to make objective measurements. Below is data from https://freedomhouse.org/countries/freedom-world/scores (which is a "freedom" score and not directly about "human right abuses") for countries that are hosting 2023 F1 races. I assume a 100 is a perfect score. List is sorted by total score.


Make your own conclusions as to where you see a precipitous drop in score.

Richard

PS: Top three are Finland, Norway, and Sweden at "100" and bottom three are South Sudan, Syria, and Tibet at "1"

I ould sugggest many of those countries committed man abuses against their people's freedoms abisess throughout Covid. Australiaa and Canadaa being two prime examples.

So how did they arrive at such high scores?

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by mattcanary

I ould sugggest many of those countries committed man abuses against their people's freedoms abisess throughout Covid. Australiaa and Canadaa being two prime examples.

So how did they arrive at such high scores?

I suspect they provide more information at their website on how they come to their rating... https://freedomhouse.org/ No real reason to rehash the Covid topic. I suspect your mind is made up. I haven't read it, but they seem to have some content that speaks to the impacts of the Pandemic... https://freedomhouse.org/issues/demo...uring-pandemic

My personal opinion is that pandemic related restrictions that we in first world society dealt with pale in comparison to the worst of the global examples of assaults against personal freedom and democracy. I tend to think most of us live very sheltered lives and don't really understand much of what is real pain and sacrifice in day to day life for many.

As to assaults... You look to have launched quite the assault on the English language in your post!

Richard

[Mike Harte]

I think that Covid should be left out of this discussion mainly because most governments around the world went about it like headless chickens; almost understandable as they hadn't experienced anything like it in recent history. One country did, and that was Taiwan who had experience with a similar outbreak some years ago, so the locked down their borders immediately, and history tells us that they actually had one of the "best", if one can say that, coronavirus.

However, they still had to curtail certain liberties, but it was for the good of the population as a whole.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

That is completely insane. They are completely off their heads....

Unsurprisingly - the master of sensible comment has given his two-cents worth.

Helmut Marko: - "If there are new facts, the matter can be reopened, and then the chances for Massa are not so bad. [...] It was terrible to see Massa celebrating winning the title in Brazil for 20 seconds, and then suddenly it was all gone. I would like him to win the title – and Mr. Hamilton – for whom records are not so important – would then have one less…"

[dsg]

Just give them both the title. Everyone is happy.

[Richard C]

Apparently FIA/FOM actually is responding to Massa. They have asked for an were given an extension to the deadline that Massa put in place.

https://us.motorsport.com/f1/news/ma...enge/10532389/

I am guessing it will be polite, but a firm "no".

Richard

[Mike Harte]

Richard, it's the 2nd or 3rd extension that has been granted by Massa's legal team.

They are also desperately trying to twist Ferrari's arm to support their action after Ferrari emphatically told them that they wouldn't. Massa's team have basically said that Mercedes supported Hamilton when he was "denied" his WDC a couple of years ago, so Ferrari should do the same for Massa.

[Mike Harte]

Further to the above, what is there to investigate and how will they conduct the investigation. I very much doubt that there will be any documents covering this so called conspiracy to rob Massa of a WDC, because I don't think that anyone who was supposedly involved would not have ben stupid enough to leave anything in writing.

So, what are the FIA and FOM supposed to do? Employ a medium to interview Mosley, who don't forget was a lawyer by trade, and Whiting who who now reside with their maker? Mr Ecclestone will say anything that suits him, already denying or unable to remember anything!

They are just kicking the can down the road and then into the long grass.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

They are just kicking the can down the road and then into the long grass.

May be. I think they need a first judgment directly from the FIA. They'll then try and a find a civil court accepting the case. Even if it works the way they wish, it will take ages and huge amounts of money before they find a way out.

As to find period witnesses, as you suggest Mike, better take a hike.

[TrapezeArtist]

As always, the only real winners will be the lawyers. "FIA have asked for another extension so we've sent them a letter. That will be another 10,000 dollars please Mr Massa."

And Massa will be the real loser, both in his bank balance and his public image.

[Greem]

Sigh

https://racer.com/2023/10/25/massa-o...-is-revolting/

Felipe is determined to not go quietly into the night...

[Aysedasi]

He is doing himself so much damage....

[Sodemo]

Oh Felipe...

On the one hand I can see his point of view, on the other, surely he is a multi-millionaire and doesnt need this?

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

Oh Felipe...

On the one hand I can see his point of view, on the other, surely he is a multi-millionaire and doesnt need this?

And will be Black balled from F1 for ever....

[Tourer]

No stopping in the Fast Lane allowed any more during Qualifying and the Shootout.

Maybe the means that teams will need to judge their runs a bit better and not all bomb out at the same time? There's a radical thought!!

[Tourer]

FIA Appoints an F1 Commissioner who reports directly to MBS - interesting that a journalist was chosen for the role, but maybe Mr Rencken has other talents that could be helpful.

Maybe job one is to have a "no bullsh" chat to Felipe Massa?

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by Tourer

FIA Appoints an F1 Commissioner who reports directly to MBS - interesting that a journalist was chosen for the role, but maybe Mr Rencken has other talents that could be helpful.

Maybe job one is to have a "no bullsh" chat to Felipe Massa?

He always seemed to know the ins and outs in the paddock. I remember his articles in Autosport, I think his columns were the Daily Grapevine. So he should know how to communicate with those above

And yes, someone needs to have a word with Mr Massa, it’s tainting his legacy all this legal stuff

[Adam43]

Dieter Rencken. Amazing.

[Tourer]

FIA Compliance Department launches investigation into the Wolffs. Can see this turning into a PR battle - multiple handbags being thrown in multiple directions!

Starting already it seems - Mercedes says Toto is a saint - to be fair to the FIA, not sure why the team would expect to be notified if the FIA investigation is into the alleged behaviour of the TP, not the team itself?

F1 also denying any knowledge and supporting its staff.

Mrs Wolff insulted and blames investigation on misogyny - with story including comments attributed to the FIA President.

Could all get quite messy!

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by Tourer

Could all get quite messy!

I think while uncomfortable for those involved (assuming they are actually innocent! ) an investigation may not be inappropriate. But boy, Susie is keeping it classy by going straight into a "misogyny" defense. No doubt she has experienced it, but IMHO the optics of that stance will not help her. It may come across a bit of "The lady doth protest too much, methinks."

Best bet was to grit teeth and say they have all acted professionally, will cooperate and welcome the outcome of the investigation which will show the allegations as unfounded. Does that sound scripted? Yes, but that is what they should have done. I mean coming out swinging is one strategy!

Another perspective, is the smoke exists due to a fire. If any of it is true, it will likely end both of their careers in F1?

Richard

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Richard C

I think while uncomfortable for those involved (assuming they are actually innocent! ) an investigation may not be inappropriate. But boy, Susie is keeping it classy by going straight into a "misogyny" defense. No doubt she has experienced it, but IMHO the optics of that stance will not help her. It may come across a bit of "The lady doth protest too much, methinks."

Best bet was to grit teeth and say they have all acted professionally, will cooperate and welcome the outcome of the investigation which will show the allegations as unfounded. Does that sound scripted? Yes, but that is what they should have done. I mean coming out swinging is one strategy!

Another perspective, is the smoke exists due to a fire. If any of it is true, it will likely end both of their careers in F1?

Richard

Agree re Susie's response - guess it's easy to play the victim but could have FAR more dignified and professional in what was posted.

If true I don't know that it'll end careers but might end up limiting influence. Of course, there were accusations a year or so ago that Toto had some kind of inside knowledge with a former employee working at the FIA - maybe people just keep seeing smoke or maybe there really is a fire at the the bottom of that smoke.

[chillibowl]

Perhaps cynical on my part, but even prior to seeing SW’s statement I assumed misogyny was a motivating factor. for me, the optics of much of what the FIA does always seems rooted in maintaining and/or exploiting inequalities. In this case it just happens to be misogyny.

Like the thread title suggests, my default position about the FIA rarely assumes they are acting genuinely or with integrity.

[veeten]

Okay everyone, sing along...

". Who's afraid of the big bad Wolffs... big bad Wolffs... big bad Wolffs. Who's afraid of the big bad Wolffs, lalalalala..."

[veeten]

But in all seriousness, if things start coming out that could put the finger on F1's "power couple", then the next step will be a very American move: Lawyering up.