[Team] Alpine: The cars are Racing Points

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Be interesting to see who wants to do a deal with him….

I suggest they re-count their fingers after any hand-shaking...

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Sandgroper

call me ignorant but what does a 75 year old offer a modern day formula one team?Strategy, knowledge, experience, finance or contacts?

Im curious, im not saying he isnt worthy but what does he offer?

Previously, Mr Briatore’s entourage was infamously spectacular

Renault managed to gift their team to Genii and friends previously.. maybe this time they think is more difficult… yet there is a player with the money to pay an anti-dilution fee that might just kick a few hundred more million dollars/pounds/euros to take on a working boat.

[v8supes]

See, i dont agree with bringing Briatore back because of what happened with crashgate but i am in no doubts that the young fans that Liberty are chasing will not care one iota. So long as the social media content keeps getting created and the DTS episodes are filmed then Liberty and these young kids are going to be fine with it.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by chunterer

I suspect he is going to be really acting as an agent to find the highest bidder as possible for the outfit....

I suspect that you're right. Briatore, despite his time away offiicially, has far more runs on the board when it comes to doing sale, partial sale or big sponsorship / commercial deals than either De Meo or Famin.

He could also sound out potential buyers & give De Meo some plausible deniability right up until a deal is agreed. Wonder if Flav has any plans to jump on a flight to Nazareth, or Indy?

[Teretonga]

I'm interested in all of this discussion.

Flav turns up after a sale is denied.
But Flav is the master of sales and business transfer as Tourer noted.
He's also the master of allowing things to sneak by the technical departments.

If the really want to sell it then who better to sell Enstone than Flavio?
He's been there before.....
Either way, sale or no sale, 2026 engine or no engine, this is going to be an interesting ride.

Funny how both cars got into Q3 at Barcelona on the back of a 9-10 finish in Canada when previously they were woefully backward with an engine that wasn't up to snuff in the power department.
If this form isn't the result of some significant upgrades, then where did it come from?

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I'm interested in all of this discussion.

Flav turns up after a sale is denied.
But Flav is the master of sales and business transfer as Tourer noted.
He's also the master of allowing things to sneak by the technical departments.

If the really want to sell it then who better to sell Enstone than Flavio?
He's been there before.....
Either way, sale or no sale, 2026 engine or no engine, this is going to be an interesting ride.

Funny how both cars got into Q3 at Barcelona on the back of a 9-10 finish in Canada when previously they were woefully backward with an engine that wasn't up to snuff in the power department.
If this form isn't the result of some significant upgrades, then where did it come from?

Both Gasly and Ocon qualified on the 4th row, so it will be interesting to see where they finish in tomorrow's race, that's if they don't take each other out at the start.

[Teretonga]

Another double points finish for Alpine.....
So are they now the fifth fastest car ahead of Aston Martin...
And they are making a play for Sainz...
Fancy that....

[chillibowl]

related not related, but Flav's return makes me wonder whats going on with Massa's lawsuit?

surely the return of Flav brings up all the past troubles again and while the broadcast/SKY/FOM all seem inclined to not bring it up at all, one would have thought in this day and age of mass communication, this would be the perfect time for Massa to be bringing it up via his social medias no?

[GTRMagic]

Alpine Mercedes from 2025?



You might of thought it costly for Mercedes to supply these additional engines into the pool… and supplied transmissions and suspensions too…

Alpine’s return to the garagiste..

[Alan52]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Alpine Mercedes from 2025?



You might of thought it costly for Mercedes to supply these additional engines into the pool… and supplied transmissions and suspensions too…

Alpine’s return to the garagiste..

And there goes Jack Doohan’s chance of ever getting a F1 drive.The Mercedes deal will be enough to get Sainz to sign with the team to replace Ocon.

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Alan52

And there goes Jack Doohan’s chance of ever getting a F1 drive.The Mercedes deal will be enough to get Sainz to sign with the team to replace Ocon.

Mr Doohan’s dad is an AMG ambassador if that counts for anything.

[Skam85]

Alpine: the cars are.... Deadpool

[Alan52]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Mr Doohan’s dad is an AMG ambassador if that counts for anything.

No.It doesn’t count for anything.
No F1 principal would choose Doohan over Sainz.

[Tourer]

New Team Principal for Alpine seems to be on the cards. Have to say that Flav is going hard on changes - first (if reports are accurate) engine and now team boss and Flav has only been on board for less than a month.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Tourer

New Team Principal for Alpine seems to be on the cards. Have to say that Flav is going hard on changes - first (if reports are accurate) engine and now team boss and Flav has only been on board for less than a month.

So he's been brought in to lift the team performance (and probably reduce costs as they affect the whole Renault group) so getting them out of the engine group and then the masterminds on the board can reallocate the resources at Viry and point them all in a different direction.

And sell the team? Or change it back to Renault?
And a new team principal will be (possibly) Oliver Oakes of Hitech fame who was one of the bidders for a place on the F1 grid in the FIA tender process.....

Or is there a hope that Oakes may be the next Horner....
And employing him may be a stroke of brilliance....

And the rumor mill is talking of a Renault group alliance with GM to jointly produce an engine (Renault-Cadillac?) for 2028.....

I'll believe that when its confirmed.....

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Alan52

No.It doesn’t count for anything.
No F1 principal would choose Doohan over Sainz.

And all things beimg equal i'd choose Martins' over Doohan anyway despite his F2 season trials and tribulations. Unfortunately Victor's face doesn't seem to fit!

[S griffin]

Martins still needs to prove himself. Doohan will probably never get a chance now

[GTRMagic]

Renault F1 Engine Program Unclear

How’s about… Alpine sell the chassis and team running business to Andretti AND the design and IP for the ‘26 F1 engine to Cadillac….

[P38 in workshop]

That might be a likely outcome and if they get a move on,next year's engine could have Cadillac cam covers in the manner of a Supertec or Megatron deal.Flav would have earned his commission in a very short time.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Renault F1 Engine Program Unclear

How’s about… Alpine sell the chassis and team running business to Andretti AND the design and IP for the ‘26 F1 engine to Cadillac….

It would be interesting to see how transfer of ownership of an existing 2026 PU would work within the PU financial regulations. There is a small section outlining entry for a new supplier, but not transferred ownership and implications of moving operations (new staff, cap ex, etc.) I can imagine the other PU suppliers would be watching closely.

Richard

[Richard C]

I am curious if the Ryan Reynolds group $200M/24% ownership purchase awhile back is going to have them looking like heroes or zeros given the turmoil within the team? If the team is looking to switch from supplier to just F1 team, how does that impact the value? And for teams who do build their own engines, how does that factor into the team value as I assume the team is a separate legal entity from the power unit portion?

I guess it depends upon what the final price will be if/when a controlling interest in the team changes hands.

Richard

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Martins still needs to prove himself. Doohan will probably never get a chance now

He already has. Last to 12th in just 6 laps in that joke of a red flagged race last night is another example of what he can do.

It's ART that have held him back this year.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Richard C

I am curious if the Ryan Reynolds group $200M/24% ownership purchase awhile back is going to have them looking like heroes or zeros given the turmoil within the team? If the team is looking to switch from supplier to just F1 team, how does that impact the value? And for teams who do build their own engines, how does that factor into the team value as I assume the team is a separate legal entity from the power unit portion?

I guess it depends upon what the final price will be if/when a controlling interest in the team changes hands.

Richard

I heard or saw a comment over the weekend that the investment group are all a bit long faced over the current conundrum....

[peebee2]

To be fair, the team isn’t an engine supplier. They are a customer of Renault.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by peebee2

To be fair, the team isn’t an engine supplier. They are a customer of Renault.

Isn't that a bit of a distinction without a difference? Everyone is a power unit customer. Ferrari is a customer of Ferrari, Mercedes is a customer of Mercedes. Note, all teams including Ferrari, Mercedes, Alpine and Red Bull must account for "Power unit costs" and ALL teams pay the same amount for their power units in their team operating budgets per the regulations. For some suppliers the arms length structure is more clear such as "Red Bull Powertrains" or "Mercedes AMG HPP". Of course they may have some level of shared ownership (i.e. Mercedes owns part of both Mercedes F1 and Mercedes AMG HPP). Plus it is highly likely that F1 team exist as separate legal entities from their parent. Same applies for 2026 power unit manufactures. If anything to make it easier to manage cost cap (which apply to both F1 team operation and F1 power unit supply) requirements.

So to the Alpine example. It goes to my earlier question. Ryan Reynolds and associates would have bought into the "Renault/Alpine/Enstone" F1 team, but likely not any ownership share for the power unit side. BUT when they bought in, that team was enjoying direct benefit of being the primary team for an F1 PU supplier. Clearly Renault PU was focusing on the Renault owned F1 team!

If reports are correct, then the Renault/Alpine/Enstone team is transitioning from "full manufacture team" to that of a customer team. They would be getting power units and other components from others and would NOT be getting the same level of design service they have in the past, or other teams like Mercedes, Red Bull (with Honda and in the future with RBPT) and Ferrari. So for those who bought into Renault/Alpine/Enstone, I think they are seeing the team go backwards. However at the end of the day, they still may make money given team value may still be above one billion US. Lastly, if Renault has sold the RR group a 24% share, I assume (not sure how remaining 76% ownership is distributed) that someone just needs to buy a controlling interest. So in some ways might a purchase of the F1 team be cheaper now that Renault has offloaded 24% already? Or... could the RR group increase their ownership share to control the team? Does Renault want to continue with any ownership share in any potential sale?

Speaking of Ferrari, while "Scuderia Ferrari" is called out, I can imagine if there is any team in F1 that is deeply integrated with their owner, it would be Ferrari. So for example if Ferrari was to "sell" their F1 team, how would that work? I expect it would be nearly impossible due to them likely being deeply embedded in other parts of Ferrari.

Richard