The never ending Toyota return to Le Mans (LMP1) Saga

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by TF110

Wonder how they'll spin their PR if they win Brazil... first Toyota Hybrid to win a world recognized endurance race? First supercapacitor Toyota to win? First capacitor powered hybrid to win? haha, it's all in the wording isn't it!

Yet another milestone in the development of hybrid powertrains

[TF110]

Maybe they feel the need to boast about it since Audi used a system not developed by them? Of course the capacitor is not be a 'Toyota original' either. I just hope for a good race, and a Toyota win. I think it shows that other makers can compete against Audi so they should get in! Nissan, Honda?

[gwyllion]

A short interview with Lapierre: http://www.dailysportscar.com/viewAr...52CC6534CA69F9

”It is still very early in the programme but Silverstone was a big boost for everyone, we are working to close the gap and I think at Bahrain we have a chance to try for the win, it is a circuit that suits our car, big braking zones and good acceleration areas – Really exactly what is required to play to our strengths.”

Toyota have a new spare tub here at Interlagos, an important step forward for this programme as the car damaged at Le Mans in the Davidson/ Perrazzini clash.

[TF110]

If you recall, Bahrain was Toyota's first F1 pole back in 2009. A botched tire strategy took them out of contention for the win though (my honest opinion). I think those twisting high speed corners to slow turns leading to long straights will play to their hands also. Turns 1 and 11 come to mind. They'll definitely be good for Toyota as they're slow turns but followed with a good length straight.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by TF110

I think it shows that other makers can compete against Audi so they should get in! Nissan, Honda?

This is my absolute hope too. I honestly thought that once one Japanese manufacturer came back we'd see a few of them but I'm not feeling anywhere near as confident now.

A fourth manufacturer for '14 would be the holy grail as far as I'm concerned.

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by Simmi

A fourth manufacturer for '14 would be the holy grail as far as I'm concerned.

Peugeot

Right now, neither Nissan or Honda have a reason to enter factory-prepared P1 cars. Nissan is dominating P2 and have a great engine while Honda is providing fast cars for privateers who want to race in P1. Right now, Honda doesn't have the funds and Nissan doesn't need to be in the spotlight.

[TF110]

This isn't F1, they don't have to spend 100million to make an LMP. Honda have money, they just don't want to spend.

[Tim the Grey]

And there's the first win...

[Acid09]

Fantastic effort, especially considering they're on a limited budget and have been thrown into the deep end this year.

Amazing...

[gwyllion]

I just read the interview that John Dagys did Nico Lapierre before the race.

We saw at Le Mans that there was a small difference, 10 percent [more consumption than Audi]. But at Silverstone, it was more like 20 percent. Here, we expect it to be the same. It's quite difficult.

We are improving this, but the gap is so big that it will take time to recover. I'm not sure if we can recover it all because the diesel engine uses less fuel. This is completely impossible to match them.

Toyota did a good job hiding their true fuel consumption Everybody expected their stints to be much shorter...

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

Toyota did a good job hiding their true fuel consumption

Yes, they are very clearly master tacticians and masters of disguise. I am hugely impressed by their achievements so far.

[chernaudi]

Based on fast laps, it was almost like a reversal of Silverstone--Audi were actually faster based on fastest lap, but to go that fast, they had to use up their tires. At Silverstone, Toyota were fast, but in their case, they had to burn up fuel. I think that Toyota knew that Audi would have a hard time keeping up once the good got off their tires, so they knew that they had to run to a pace and they'd be fine.

Again, Audi did that at Silverstone to exploit Toyota's fuel mileage disadvantage. You don't have to be the fastest, just fast enough to win. It's not often that the fastest car wins, but it helps to be one of the fastest, and not making mistakes. Toyota hit it right with the tire situation, while Audi has work to do to catch up there.

[Scooter185]

Originally Posted by Simmi

This is my absolute hope too. I honestly thought that once one Japanese manufacturer came back we'd see a few of them but I'm not feeling anywhere near as confident now.

A fourth manufacturer for '14 would be the holy grail as far as I'm concerned.

Awesome to see Toyota take the win today. I didn't get to see Silverstone, but i did watch Le Mans and they looked really strong even then, Talk about progressing by leaps and bounds! Prototypes are my favorite type of race car, so the more factories that get involved the better, and hopefully we'll see more soon.

Even as a VMM fan in F1, I would like to see Red Bull build an LMP1; Newey pretty much designed one with his x2010/2011 in GT5, and since they could use the same engine as their F1 program in '14 what's stopping them? They have enough $$$ and it cannot possibly be any worse than their NASCAR excursion.

[TF110]

Red Bull don't have an engine. So they'll have to do some serious R&D if they're to run their own. I'd like to see how good Toyota is at Bahrain if they feel that track suits their car! So if that's the case, what was Brazil?! They did 33lap stints on fuel pretty easily. Quite a bit more than the 26 or whatever we thought it was in practice. In total they made 7 pit stops. If it would have went green the whole way it still wouldn't have turned out differently I don't think. They made a huge gap with help from the split safety car, but there was no denying they were faster and better on tires, and were really a lot closer on fuel. Bring on Bahrain!

[NelisB]

Originally Posted by TF110

Red Bull don't have an engine. So they'll have to do some serious R&D if they're to run their own. I'd like to see how good Toyota is at Bahrain if they feel that track suits their car! So if that's the case, what was Brazil?! They did 33lap stints on fuel pretty easily. Quite a bit more than the 26 or whatever we thought it was in practice. In total they made 7 pit stops. If it would have went green the whole way it still wouldn't have turned out differently I don't think. They made a huge gap with help from the split safety car, but there was no denying they were faster and better on tires, and were really a lot closer on fuel. Bring on Bahrain!

I don't think the gap made with the safety car was that much bigger as before. They did gain a advantage but not the 30 seconds or more some make it. I think it went from 30 sec gap to a 43 second gap or something. They gained a extra 13 seconds or there abouts with the safety cars.
Even without them the ball was clearly in their court. They were the team to beat yesterday.

All I can say is: Bravo Toyota!

[gwyllion]

Murata has finally revealed the power output of the hybrid system:

Today the system performed flawlessly and it was very clear how the 300hp of boost made a real difference to our lap times. The hydraulic braking and energy recovery worked in perfect harmony so I am very proud of what we have achieved.

source: http://www.toyotahybridracing.com/qu...ter-first-win/

That is quite a bit more than the 200 hp (150 kW) of Audi's e-tron quattro solution.

[Adam43]

300hp? Nice.

[GTfour]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

Murata has finally revealed the power output of the hybrid system:
source: http://www.toyotahybridracing.com/qu...ter-first-win/

That is quite a bit more than the 200 hp (150 kW) of Audi's e-tron quattro solution.

That is also quite a bit more kilojoules then they were allowed at Le Mans.
300 HP is far more then the allowed 500 kilojoules, If I'm correct.
Are there less stringent rules during the series then?

[arakis]

Originally Posted by GTfour

That is also quite a bit more kilojoules then they were allowed at Le Mans.
300 HP is far more then the allowed 500 kilojoules, If I'm correct.
Are there less stringent rules during the series then?

it's actually 228 KW which means it's functional only for ~2.2 seconds... this is whithin regulations, Kilojules is the measure maximum enetgy stored, think of kilowats as the energy consumption per second... so if they have 500kj max, they can use 228Kw(300hp) for 2.2s...

[gwyllion]

The big advantage is the fact that Toyota can recover more energy than Audi during short braking periods. They need a bit more than 2 seconds of braking to fully charge the hybrid system, while Audi needs more than 3 seconds.

[chernaudi]

This is probably the impetus behind the rumors of Audi teaming with ITK and KTM to make a revised hybrid system for 2013...

[TF110]

I wouldn't think Toyota uses 300hp for 2-3 seconds, but do they? Murata San did say 300hp, maybe that's why Toyota is so good out those slow corners. They're putting over 800hp down, that's some good power, too bad it doesn't last longer- something Toyota was asking for (1MJ). Audi would really be lost then.

[Mal]

Originally Posted by TF110

I wouldn't think Toyota uses 300hp for 2-3 seconds, but do they? Murata San did say 300hp, maybe that's why Toyota is so good out those slow corners. They're putting over 800hp down, that's some good power, too bad it doesn't last longer- something Toyota was asking for (1MJ). Audi would really be lost then.

At the pit visit Toyota, if I recall correctly, said their system is capable of recovering 8MJ - they felt it is streets ahead of the Audi system

[gustavobamba]

Originally Posted by Mal

At the pit visit Toyota, if I recall correctly, said their system is capable of recovering 8MJ - they felt it is streets ahead of the Audi system

For those who can calculate this kinda of energy release, the 8MJ will produce the 300 bhp for ao long???? 30 seconds???

that would bring the times at le mans to 3.18/3.19 or even lower!!!

I know they will have lower weight and less drag (reduce of dimensions) but they will also0have fuel restrictions, so the Toyota system will have even more advantage.

Is that true that they are studying hydrogen for motorsport???


By the way very nice victory for Toyota

[arakis]

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

For those who can calculate this kinda of energy release, the 8MJ will produce the 300 bhp for ao long???? 30 seconds???

that would bring the times at le mans to 3.18/3.19 or even lower!!!

I know they will have lower weight and less drag (reduce of dimensions) but they will also0have fuel restrictions, so the Toyota system will have even more advantage.

Is that true that they are studying hydrogen for motorsport???


By the way very nice victory for Toyota

not exactly, cause you'd need 30s of breaking to charge it up as well...