Tech Issue 2011 Pirelli tyres - Page 17

Pingguest · 24 Mar 2011, 11:23 (Ref:2852402)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

I understand that track temperatures were very, very cool at Imola, and therefore the medium compound Pirelli's didn't really get up to proper operating temperatures.

Lower temperatures usually cause reduced wear, but racing off the racing line was very difficult.

Wims · 24 Mar 2011, 12:09 (Ref:2852424)

Having the tyre working outside of the temperature window will cause increased wear, no matter if its colder or hotter.

Marbot · 24 Mar 2011, 20:03 (Ref:2852673)

Indeed. Button wearing out his tyres in Korea, for example, was caused by his driving style not generating sufficient heat into the tyre to make it work correctly.

Some say that he hadn't looked after his tyres very well, which I suppose is true if it is up to the driver to get heat into them. If you don't get heat into them, then they just grain up and slide around a lot. Getting heat into the Pirelli's is no longer an issue for any F1 driver as long as the track temps are reasonable.

wnut · 24 Mar 2011, 23:06 (Ref:2852787)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Indeed. Button wearing out his tyres in Korea, for example, was caused by his driving style not generating sufficient heat into the tyre to make it work correctly.

Some say that he hadn't looked after his tyres very well, which I suppose is true if it is up to the driver to get heat into them. If you don't get heat into them, then they just grain up and slide around a lot. Getting heat into the Pirelli's is no longer an issue for any F1 driver as long as the track temps are reasonable.

Ideally in the premier formula this should enable Button to run a softer tyre than the rest of them and make him quicker as a result, but sadly the use of the tyres is too restrictive to allow this.

Grandpa_Rob · 25 Mar 2011, 14:17 (Ref:2853064)

I heard that some teams were seeing tyre debris inside the car such as the radiator pods and other places never been seen before, is that the nature of the tyre or is that also because of the low temperatures ?

ASCII Man · 25 Mar 2011, 16:16 (Ref:2853118)

You dont get graining from too low temperatures, low temperatures mainly has the tarmac tear up the tyre surface into tiny bits and pieces, which is probably why they're finding tyre debris inside the sidepods.

While graining comes from overheating the tyre, which causes the rubber to melt and form little grain sized blobs on the surface of the tyre (hence the term 'graining'), causing it to slide around more.

At least that's what my limited understanding of low/high temperature effects on tyres tells me, anyway.

Marbot · 25 Mar 2011, 16:37 (Ref:2853124)

I don't think that the Pirelli's have a problem with graining. They do shed a few marbles though! But not as much as was first feared. Generally speaking, all the drivers were happy with the tyres in todays free practice.

Interestingly, Jenson Button did 29 laps on one set of tyres!

cmotd · 25 Mar 2011, 23:34 (Ref:2853297)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Interestingly, Jenson Button did 29 laps on one set of tyres!

the unusually cold weather would have helped with that, if it's a warmer day on sunday I don't think any drivers would take the risk of going that far on their tyres. last time i went to the gp here it was 40 degrees, lol. this time i was rugged up and drinking hot tea from a thermos

**bjohnsonsmith** · 26 Mar 2011, 04:05 (Ref:2853337)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmotd

the unusually cold weather would have helped with that, if it's a warmer day on sunday I don't think any drivers would take the risk of going that far on their tyres. last time i went to the gp here it was 40 degrees, lol. this time i was rugged up and drinking hot tea from a thermos

A wise precaution. You don't get too cold and fall ill, or you might miss the race.

Marbot · 26 Mar 2011, 19:18 (Ref:2853681)

Fastest pole lap at Melbourne in the 15 years that the race has taken place there......

phoenix · 31 Mar 2011, 18:11 (Ref:2856462)

So, in Melboune the choice was two, three or four sets of tyres.

Looking at fastest laps for the top ten finishers, they were all set an average 10.4 laps after changing onto their final set of tyres.

For the softer option tyre, the average was 9 laps after having them fitted and for the harder prime tyre, 10.75 laps after having them fitted.

The average last tyre change was at the end of lap 37, whilst the average best lap time was set on lap 48.

So it would appear that the lower weight of the car due to fuel consumption had more effect on lap time than the state of the tyres.......

Marbot · 31 Mar 2011, 19:57 (Ref:2856510)

In depth analysis:

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2...sis-melbourne/

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/0...-in-melbourne/

wnut · 1 Apr 2011, 00:41 (Ref:2856616)

Thanks for the analysis reference Marbot.
The Pirelli tyres fortunately seem to have performed remarkably better than predicted which is great.
Perez's efforts proved that strategy will be interesting and it is better to start the race on the hards with full fuel tanks and switch to the softs later, however the front of the grid will be stuck with the soft qualifiers necessary to post top 10 times. All good.

Webber it would seem may be overdriving the car as evidenced by ragged tyres?!
The team's technical analysis of any perceived fault should be interesting.

**bjohnsonsmith** · 1 Apr 2011, 00:57 (Ref:2856617)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wnut

Perez's efforts proved that strategy will be interesting and it is better to start the race on the hards with full fuel tanks and switch to the softs later, however the front of the grid will be stuck with the soft qualifiers necessary to post top 10 times. All good.

When compound options first became available to FI back in the mid to late '70s, teams and drivers would switch to softer compounds as the fuel load lightened.

wnut · 2 Apr 2011, 03:20 (Ref:2857167)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

When compound options first became available to FI back in the mid to late '70s, teams and drivers would switch to softer compounds as the fuel load lightened.

Yes but back then you were not forced to start on your qualifying tyres or indeed with your qualifying settings.

**bjohnsonsmith** · 2 Apr 2011, 03:45 (Ref:2857169)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wnut

Yes but back then you were not forced to start on your qualifying tyres or indeed with your qualifying settings.

True and I feel it made for better racing.

Marbot · 2 Apr 2011, 09:11 (Ref:2857237)

It used to be that some teams would turn up with qualifying cars and race cars.

Not everyone could afford to do that.

TBH, I'd hate to think how much further ahead the Red Bull car of Vettel's (and maybe even Webber's) would have finished if he'd been allowed to start on fresh tyres with a race optimized set up. Adrian Newey lives for that kind of thing!

**bjohnsonsmith** · 2 Apr 2011, 13:55 (Ref:2857350)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

It used to be that some teams would turn up with qualifying cars and race cars.

Not everyone could afford to do that.

TBH, I'd hate to think how much further ahead the Red Bull car of Vettel's (and maybe even Webber's) would have finished if he'd been allowed to start on fresh tyres with a race optimized set up. Adrian Newey lives for that kind of thing!

And qualifying engines, if memory serves me right.

Marbot · 2 Apr 2011, 14:17 (Ref:2857360)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

And qualifying engines, if memory serves me right.

Oh yes!

Marbot · 3 Apr 2011, 08:11 (Ref:2857653)

It's not just F1 that can have the occasional tyre problem.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/90415

Pingguest · 3 Apr 2011, 15:00 (Ref:2858011)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

It used to be that some teams would turn up with qualifying cars and race cars.

Not everyone could afford to do that.

TBH, I'd hate to think how much further ahead the Red Bull car of Vettel's (and maybe even Webber's) would have finished if he'd been allowed to start on fresh tyres with a race optimized set up. Adrian Newey lives for that kind of thing!

Actually, without the post-qualifying parc fermé races used to be less predictable. And having a car specifically set-up for qualifying was no guarantee for race victories. Niki Lauda and Alain Prost could tell you everything about it.

Marbot · 3 Apr 2011, 15:13 (Ref:2858026)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pingguest

Actually, without the post-qualifying parc fermé races used to be less predictable. And having a car specifically set-up for qualifying was no guarantee for race victories. Niki Lauda and Alain Prost could tell you everything about it.

That was a long time ago. Things are different now.

stripedcat · 3 Apr 2011, 20:48 (Ref:2858204)

I was just thinking about the number of tyres used in a race weekend, what with F1 trying to be 'green' nowadays with KERS and so on. Seems not very green, using about three or four sets of tyres during a race!

**Adam43** · 3 Apr 2011, 22:16 (Ref:2858251)

Although there is an advantage in building a car, or driving in a way, that is easy on its tyres. Perhaps it is promoting environmental driving?

Mr V · 3 Apr 2011, 22:44 (Ref:2858270)

Quote:

Originally Posted by stripedcat

I was just thinking about the number of tyres used in a race weekend, what with F1 trying to be 'green' nowadays with KERS and so on. Seems not very green, using about three or four sets of tyres during a race!

Sod the environment - give me 3 pit stops and an unhealthy planet over 1 stop Bridgestones and a healthy planet any day.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
[Tech Issue] Pirelli to go "aggressive" with tyres.	Marbot	Formula One	11	1 Jul 2010 04:01
The Pirelli Story	Dutton	Motorsport History	1	13 Aug 2009 16:06
Pirelli	luke	Formula One	22	28 May 2006 00:19
Pirelli control tyres?	Marbot	Formula One	4	17 Mar 2006 13:25