Don't believe everything you read: Hamilton admits driver error to blame - Page 2

TFHarv · 23 Oct 2007, 16:40 (Ref:2049347)

My god Ferrari had it planned all along, they planted the info on gear box technology software for Mclaren to pick up and use in their own design, it had a virus in the code that allowed Ferrari to remotely activate a select neutral loop and it took Mclarens antivirus program 30 seconds to quarantine it.

Well if we can believe that catching a button on a steering wheel would cause a gear selection fault then why not ?

And Big Ron says it wasn't Lewis...... It's true i tell ya

Kebab · 23 Oct 2007, 17:00 (Ref:2049367)

McLaren have gone out of their way to protect their latest 'product' (Hamilton) from any bad PR. No he didn't swear over the radio, it was the team's fault he went off in China ... he didn't cock up the gear changes in Brazil after throwing it off the track.

Hopefully people will wake up to the fact that Hamilton is talented, yes ... but also the product of years and years of grooming and investment by McLaren. Anyone that believes that he wasn't supported more than Alonso is ignoring the fact that McLaren are a shareholder in Hamilton. Just look at the way they protect him from everything and do nothing for Alonso.

Personally, I prefer to root for an underdog. I believe there are many young drivers who could have done equally well given the same car, support & training.

Yoong Montoya · 23 Oct 2007, 17:06 (Ref:2049371)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kebab

The kid is only human - 2 errors in the last two grand prix's with massive pressure on him. Very few drivers have experience of that kind of expectation/stress and could handle it.

Still though - 17 points ahead of Kimi with 2 races left and still manages to lose to him. It's the championship equivalent of Fisichella's Suzuka 2005 race.

**Born Racer** · 23 Oct 2007, 17:06 (Ref:2049372)

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63613

Here's Autosport's article.

Perhaps the thread title should be changed.

**John Turner** · 23 Oct 2007, 18:14 (Ref:2049439)

So much of this is really off topic, but I feel the urge to respond! In for a penny, in for a pound.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

alonso and hamilton were treated the same throughout the season just like the ferrari drivers.

I think there is little doubt that they have had equal equipment this year. However, equal treatment is another issue. It may have only have been a perception by Alonso that he wasn’t being treated equally but perception is enough to affect the issue. It is well known that some drivers need a ‘comfort’ zone, and whilst this maybe only there in psychological terms, to them, such a zone is important. Is it really beyond then realms of possibility that there was a greater warmth towards the man who had been under the Mclaren wing for 10 years, and a Brit to boot? It should be no surprise that Alonso thought so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

alonso moaned and moaned and moaned about not having #1 status, simply because hes not good enough to beat hamilton, a driver in his rookie season.

True. he moaned, but most of this was directed at Ron Dennis and the team rather than at Hamilton, but it seems that in recent weeks the latter has complained far more directly about his team mate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

ive said time and time again at the end of last season, that alonso is another schumacher,
talented but flawed, no one listened.

Well I’m still not listening, because it is simply not true. You rarely, if ever, heard Schumacher complaining. On the other hand Alonso to date, has rarely, if ever, displayed the lack of ethical on track behaviour of Schumacher, so in two key elements, they are quite different. What they do seem to share is an intelligent, analytical and work ethic approach to their motor racing, apparently not emulated by some of their fellow drivers, but that is a positive point for both. Since top drivers are simply human beings with special talents, it is inevitable, that these two are flawed, just like every other top driver.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

maybe mclaren should have given lewis #1 status, then he would have won the championship.

I assume that this is a ‘tongue in cheek’ comment. I certainly couldn’t take it seriously, and anyway how would the existing double World Champion have responded. Pretty much as we have seen, and with the same outcome, I suggest. It is not unthinkable that a double World Champion (unseating Schumacher, lest we forget), and the first to be confirmed as their driver for 2007, could expect Mclaren, even with their history of equal treatment might have afforded the rookie, Hamilton, an apprentice season to learn from Alonso’s experience. It mattered not that Hamilton was sometimes quicker than Alonso, because there is more to winning than just pace, and he has learnt that the hard way at the end of the season. If that scenario had played out, quite possibly Alonso would have had the championship sewn up before the end of the season, Hamilton would have had wins (in his first year remember) and experience gained from working alongside the best in the business (now that Schumacher has retired). Mclaren would have gone into next season with the Nos 1 & 2 on their cars, with the best pairing on the grid, with Hamilton able to mount a challenge to a great 3 time WDC. As it is we have had a disaffected and complaining (now ex) World Champion, so rattled that he has behaved in a way that has done him no credit, who thinks that everyone in Britain (particularly the media) is/was against him, acrimony between the two drivers engendered as much as anything by the recent comments of Hamilton, neither have won the WDC, and a messy ending to the season. In all probability this great pairing will not be together for next season. It was all very unedifying, and clearly Mclaren has not benefited from any of this (particularly since they were adversely affected by Stepneygate, anyway), and nor have those members of the spectating public who are more interested in the racing than all the peripheral stuff that has had the media in such a froth for much of the season.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

however this season we saw a great fight between 4 drivers, kimi came out on top, however lucky or unlucky he was this season, but either way both kimi and lewis deserved this title.

True, but so much of it has been overshadowed by off track events that, for many, it has been spoilt. However, since Kimi had 6 wins and Lewis 4, there was only one who deserved the championship and it would be a total travesty if this was taken away from him through yet more off track decisions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

whos to blame is the fact both drivers were allowed equal treatment throughout the season,which is how it should be.

I don’t understand this comment. However, there is little doubt that Hamilton is a great talent who could eventually join that very special list of greatest drivers which we regularly discuss with much enthusiasm. He has a little way to go yet to make him the complete driver as we have seen. Whether the electronics error was, or as now seems likely, was not his fault, if he retains a certain humility and integrity that allows him to continue to admit to his mistakes, this potential for greatness behind the wheel will only be enhanced.

Marbot · 23 Oct 2007, 18:17 (Ref:2049441)

Quote:

Originally Posted by garcon

I was thinking the same Mike, that button must have some kind of failsafe, but nothing surprises me at McLaren any more.

Maybe they haven't got to grips with the new Ferrari system yet.

Knowlesy · 23 Oct 2007, 18:25 (Ref:2049448)

Excellent post John.

This story seems pretty rubbish to be honest.

**Adam43** · 23 Oct 2007, 18:28 (Ref:2049452)

The source was a little tenuous in the first place. I'd have believed it more if paulc had posted it! http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=97500

strider · 23 Oct 2007, 19:19 (Ref:2049512)

I totally agree with all of the JT's post above and thank you for expressing it so eloquently.

As for the Autosport report, I honestly don't know whether to believe it fully or not. Everything seems subject to spin these days. It sounds plausible, but I should know for sure before too long.

strider · 23 Oct 2007, 20:10 (Ref:2049583)

As a footnote, pitpass is sticking to its story (see last paragraph) - http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpa...s_art_id=33296

I wonder who the source's informant was?

Knowlesy · 23 Oct 2007, 20:11 (Ref:2049585)

Knowing pitpass, probably the Daily Star.

Mr V · 23 Oct 2007, 20:17 (Ref:2049590)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kieran20

maybe mclaren should have given lewis #1 status, then he would have won the championship.

Had they given Fernando #1 ststus then we would have won the Championship.

Fact is, both were given an equal oppertunity, both lost the title. Ferrari gave their drivers an equal oppertunity too (nice to see

), but once Felipe was out of the running, Kimi got the help, hence won the title.

**Adam43** · 23 Oct 2007, 20:23 (Ref:2049597)

A well-placed source talking to pitpass. I know who I believe; they now suffer for years of useless reporting. A bit like the cry wolf soty, except with a complete lack of wolf.

strider · 23 Oct 2007, 21:09 (Ref:2049656)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Knowing pitpass, probably the Daily Star.

I thought somebody might suggest Alonso...

ensign14 · 23 Oct 2007, 21:35 (Ref:2049681)

I disagree with John. McLaren played it as fair as they could. They were let down by someone who ought to have had the maturity that double world championships could bring. And indeed Alonso's petulance cost him more than any "team orders" did. Had he started from the front row at Hungary he'd've won the title.

Had I been Dennis, as soon as Alonso started making blackmail threats I would have been sacking Alonso for gross misconduct. That would probably have given Hamilton the title, incidentally. Then again, I'm not the moneyman and he can make a few bob from selling Alonso. Or he can stop him driving for someone else by sticking him in GP2 or something.

But this story smacks of being made up by someone thinking of Mansell in Canada. Where did the originating journo come from, by the way?

**Adam43** · 23 Oct 2007, 21:45 (Ref:2049696)

I presume that is a rhetorical question?

flashing · 23 Oct 2007, 22:36 (Ref:2049733)

The Internet is indeed a wonderful thing but the downside is that is has spawned many ‘news outlets’ whose main objective to obtain ‘hits’, because hits equal revenue. The truth, balance, objectivity unfortunately comes nowhere.

These sites don’t have any presence at races and therefore always have to rely on second or third hand sources and it shows.

Even the best news organisation can make mistakes, but the two sites mentioned in this thread have a long history of pushing phoney stories and allowing personal bias to trump truthful reporting.

JeremySmith · 23 Oct 2007, 23:37 (Ref:2049759)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashing

The Internet is indeed a wonderful thing but the downside is that is has spawned many ‘news outlets’ whose main objective to obtain ‘hits’, because hits equal revenue. The truth, balance, objectivity unfortunately comes nowhere.

These sites don’t have any presence at races and therefore always have to rely on second or third hand sources and it shows.

Even the best news organisation can make mistakes, but the two sites mentioned in this thread have a long history of pushing phoney stories and allowing personal bias to trump truthful reporting.

Is your nick name to be taken literally? and quite right, your post that is..

flashing · 24 Oct 2007, 00:14 (Ref:2049779)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

Is your nick name to be taken literally? and quite right, your post that is..

Well flashing as in light, not flasher as in.......

JeremySmith · 24 Oct 2007, 00:21 (Ref:2049783)

Very good then...."Welcome to Ten-Tenths" I hope you enjoy posting here!

flashing · 24 Oct 2007, 00:35 (Ref:2049787)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

Very good then...."Welcome to Ten-Tenths" I hope you enjoy posting here!

Well it does seem to be of the saner BB!

But just another post on topic. During a busy race weekend I will sometimes use the newsNow feed to keep up to date:

http://www.newsnow.co.uk/newsfeed/?name=F1

They have a top story section and often the same sites dominate. Why? Just look at the headlines which are often at total odds with the actual story they publish let alone the actual truth. Some of these sites look like they are run by kids who have way too much time on their hands and must drive press officers mad because they have to respond to this drivel.

I personally have no idea whether Lewis Hamilton caused his problems in Brazil by pushing the wrong button or whatever, but I am sure going to keep an open mind until someone with real credibility reports it.

JeremySmith · 24 Oct 2007, 00:44 (Ref:2049790)

flashing, if you have not already, please take a lQQk at these! Thank you.

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=82104

McLaren are denying that it was his doing, the gearbox problem that is..

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63613

Javi · 24 Oct 2007, 07:17 (Ref:2049900)

[QUOTE=ensign14]I disagree with John. McLaren played it as fair as they could. They were let down by someone who ought to have had the maturity that double world championships could bring. And indeed Alonso's petulance cost him more than any "team orders" did. Had he started from the front row at Hungary he'd've won the title.

yes, If Alonso had started form the front row in hungary he would have won the title... Alonso was sent back the grid because Hamilton protested, would anyone tell me what FIA rule did he broke? None, and still he was sent back... Alonso did wrong in hungary, but Hamilton did before, ignoring team orders in fuel burning stage... Did McLaren penalize Hamilton for that, then for protesting in his behalf to FIA AGAINST HIS OWN TEAM, sending back Alonso 5 places and at the end losing constructor points??? No. How do you think Alonso felt after that?? Comfortable at McLaren?

(John Turner´s post is excellent, I totally agree with that)

**Adam43** · 24 Oct 2007, 07:43 (Ref:2049925)

Did Hamilton protest Alonso in Hungary? Or even McLaren on his behalf? Or is this just another story like the actual topic of the thread?

Kalevi · 24 Oct 2007, 07:56 (Ref:2049934)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqHZ_xaB4Es

According to that onboard footage Lewis was indeed pushing something in his steering wheel before his car started to slow down. If one gets a good picture of his steering wheel we can figure what button he was actually pushing.

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