Inept Judiciary Ruins What Was A Great Race (merged x2) - Page 2

buza · 3 Mar 2007, 07:01 (Ref:1856107)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckshot

Dumbrell didn't even make it through the first turn before doing something stupid in taking out team mate McConville.

Because of course Andy Jones couldn't have backed out of it like everyone else in a simular situation done...

Buckshot · 3 Mar 2007, 07:03 (Ref:1856109)

I can see both sides of the arguement here but the thing that really set me off was the fact that Max Wilson was involved. Seems to be that whenever a stupid act is carried out on track it's either Max Wilson or Paul Morris. Whenever I see any key players on track near those 2 (usually lapping them) I start to get tense.

v8race1 · 3 Mar 2007, 07:19 (Ref:1856113)

One would think CL would have by now the racing 'maturity' to drive around rolling speed humps.....Tander seemed to have no problems doing the same with bargs...

Great defensive driving by Max though...certainly made me go WOW for all the wrong reasons...

billybanana · 3 Mar 2007, 07:57 (Ref:1856131)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckshot

Dumbrell didn't even make it through the first turn before doing something stupid in taking out team mate McConville.

Having watched that incident a few times over now, it was hard to pick up any contact between Dumbrell & McConville. Seemed more like Andy Jones gave Cam the shove.

Dazz · 3 Mar 2007, 08:01 (Ref:1856135)

I wonder if it was Rick Spinning craig in exactly the same way as Craig did to Max if the arguements would be the same?

I hate the whole drive through penalty for every offence. It's plain wrong.

Maybe if a car is spun and loses say 25 seconds on that lap, amybe that time needs to be added to the offending car. If the car hit it taken out of the race, by all means give a full drive through.

I think the rules need to be better suited to the offence, basically.

Pudlea · 3 Mar 2007, 08:17 (Ref:1856140)

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybanana

Having watched that incident a few times over now, it was hard to pick up any contact between Dumbrell & McConville. Seemed more like Andy Jones gave Cam the shove.

That was more of a racing incident, all three drivers really had no-where to go. If any of them would have backed off for the corner, more than likely it would have caused more trouble with the cars coming behind them. Just unfortunate that both SCAR cars were there. Can't really place the balme on ay of them.

mjt57 · 3 Mar 2007, 08:34 (Ref:1856153)

Quote:

Originally Posted by promax

lowndes is the defending "moral champion" and 5 times people champion. he can do no wrong in the eyes of those who wear blue glasses

Well, I for the most part wear "red" glasses. And I tend to lean towards Lowndes. I'm still dirty on HRT for shafting Lowndes...

Anyway I was stuck at work today. What happened to Lowndes and what SHOULD have happened to him?

Thanks

Pudlea · 3 Mar 2007, 08:36 (Ref:1856155)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjt57

Well, I for the most part wear "red" glasses. And I tend to lean towards Lowndes. I'm still dirty on HRT for shafting Lowndes...

Anyway I was stuck at work today. What happened to Lowndes and what SHOULD have happened to him?

Thanks

Lowndes turned Wilson around (car had scars to prove it). He was giving a drive through penalty. Basically what should have happened.

mjt57 · 3 Mar 2007, 08:39 (Ref:1856157)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dazz

I hate the whole drive through penalty for every offence. It's plain wrong.

Me too. I called it "summary injustice". It doesn't allow a team accused of a rules breach to protest its innocence. Or at least, have the chance to defend itself.

I believe that a driver should be allowed the choice - drive through or later on at a post-race hearing, answer the charges. If found guilty then the time that's lost from a drive through be applied, plus an additional penalty, thus affecting his race result.

Similar things occur on the road. Get a TIN or challenge it in court. Or in AFL - be reported and cop a suspension for the next x number of matches. This is like soccer where a player is sent off the field, based on what could be an erroneous call from the umpire or referee.

And yes, I realise that the drive through concept is common in all forms of motorsport. Still doesn't make it fair, does it?

MPA · 3 Mar 2007, 09:06 (Ref:1856174)

After looking at the incident a few times my view is.....

Craig stuck it up the inside going into 4.

Max saw him comming.

Craig backed out, not wanting trouble.

Max braked hard and turned in early to instigate the contact and turn himself around ruining his race.

And Craig's.

Timmy told him to do it because the WhooPS safety car had not rolled for half the race and the drivers that made both stops early paid a lot of money to get closer to the front again with the help of a pointless SC.

Nothing in it really.

Muznik · 3 Mar 2007, 10:36 (Ref:1857095)

Oh I get it. You are still bitter about how last year ended. And you are suggesting that the ofiicials & powers that be are Holden biased.

Yes, I am a Holden fan who incidently was ashamed at some of the actions at PI last year. It was a disappointing result for everyone.

I am a HRT/Skaife fan who thinks they shouldn't be racing until they sort their **** out !

I am also a bit of a Lowndes fan due to his Holden days & the fact hes just a nice bloke. With Craig the thing that makes him a great driver is his aggressiveness. Unfortunately coupled with some impatience it can sometimes result in the penalty he saw today. Thats racing.

Pudlea · 3 Mar 2007, 10:52 (Ref:1857102)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muznik

I am also a bit of a Lowndes fan due to his Holden days & the fact hes just a nice bloke. With Craig the thing that makes him a great driver is his aggressiveness. Unfortunately coupled with some impatience it can sometimes result in the penalty he saw today. Thats racing.

Well said Muznik. This BS about the officals being biassed towards Holden is exactly that BS!. The Murphy/Lowndes incident from a few years ago points exactly to this not being the case. The officials just judge incicdents according to the current rules and give the appropriate penalty. Are the rules correct, well maybe not, there is always room for improvement and yes the officials do sometimes get it wrong, they are only human when it comes down to it. All the drivers are aware of the rules so stop blaming the officials for decision where according tot he rules, Lowndes was in the wrong and they had no choice but to penalise him. People need to put their "RED" and "BLUE" glasses away once in a while and enjoy the racing for what it is.

MPA · 3 Mar 2007, 10:56 (Ref:1857106)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muznik

I am a HRT/Skaife fan who thinks they shouldn't be racing until they sort their **** out !

Indeed. Fancy buying a race team and losing the receipt. How very careless of Mark.

jason7253 · 3 Mar 2007, 12:04 (Ref:1857134)

Just out of intrest someone should keep track of drive thrus given for this sort of incident going back to the last round.
so far
R.Kelly 1
C.lowndes 1
Big difference eh? Every body get over all this and enjoy the racing.
And I am a one eyed Toll supporter and trust me I haven,t taken any thing to heart over the last three months.I can,t see why others need to take things as an insult to them.

Pro Racer · 3 Mar 2007, 12:17 (Ref:1857140)

right call IMO, annoyed with WPS tactics as i stated in the clipsal thread but all in all a good race.

fomoco · 3 Mar 2007, 14:30 (Ref:1857185)

1) Blue flag- to inform driver of leaders coming through.

2) two years ago, Timmy said no blue flags, telementry will tell us and we will radio pit crew to tell driver to move.

3) time to wave blue flag 0.5 sec

4) time to check , radio team , radio driver, driver says I'm racing for 15 place to get points.

Some years ago the top drivers complained of slow drivers, one event drivers etc. Supposedly, we have the best and fastest cars ever and drivers.

Still Craig did tap him, result spin, Rules says you get a drive thru.

I prefer Nascar, End of race check it out. Issue penalty. That hurts more.

Micklegend · 3 Mar 2007, 22:15 (Ref:1857426)

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybanana

Lowndes impatience cost him again..

I agree, I am a major fan of Lowndes, and as soon as I saw him come out of the pits behind Wilson, I said to my missus,"this is bad news for Craig and it will end in tears....most probably for CL". Lowand behold, 2 laps later, there is a tap and spin.

At least Wilson got going again and finished the race at full speed.

Buckshot · 3 Mar 2007, 22:22 (Ref:1857431)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micklegend

...as soon as I saw him come out of the pits behind Wilson, I said to my missus,"this is bad news for Craig and it will end in tears....most probably for CL".

Thanks Mick, glad I'm not the only one that gets these premonitions of disaster when a key player is near Wilson.

Gaz170 · 3 Mar 2007, 22:32 (Ref:1857436)

Craig was impatient and it cost him.

But Max was never going to make it easy to get past.

Pudlea · 3 Mar 2007, 23:25 (Ref:1857468)

Quote:

Originally Posted by fomoco

1) Blue flag- to inform driver of leaders coming through.

2) two years ago, Timmy said no blue flags, telementry will tell us and we will radio pit crew to tell driver to move.

3) time to wave blue flag 0.5 sec

4) time to check , radio team , radio driver, driver says I'm racing for 15 place to get points.

Some years ago the top drivers complained of slow drivers, one event drivers etc. Supposedly, we have the best and fastest cars ever and drivers.

Still Craig did tap him, result spin, Rules says you get a drive thru.

I prefer Nascar, End of race check it out. Issue penalty. That hurts more.

What has the Blue Flag got to do with anything???? At that point in time they were racing for position. It would have bee a total different story if Max was being lapped.

Agreed though Craig deserved the penalty.

sizzle · 3 Mar 2007, 23:43 (Ref:1857483)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pudlea

What has the Blue Flag got to do with anything???? At that point in time they were racing for position. It would have bee a total different story if Max was being lapped.

And that is the whole facts of the matter. It is racing isn't it, not tiddlywinks.

Maybe Max should have let him go, he was under no obligation to do so, equally if Craig had been more decisive instead of piddling around maybe it wouldn't have happened either.
It already sounds like last year all over again. There was more than one team sick of changing rear clips because of Lowndes constant banging on the back door.

Pudlea · 3 Mar 2007, 23:48 (Ref:1857485)

Quote:

Originally Posted by sizzle

And that is the whole facts of the matter. It is racing isn't it, not tiddlywinks.

Maybe Max should have let him go, he was under no obligation to do so, equally if Craig had been more decisive instead of piddling around maybe it wouldn't have happened either.
It already sounds like last year all over again. There was more than one team sick of changing rear clips because of Lowndes constant banging on the back door.

Agreed. Maybe the T8 fans need to look in their back yard first before simply whinging at every little incident they are invovled in on the track. Rubbing is Racing they say (well fair rubbing is anyway).

RotorFan · 4 Mar 2007, 00:04 (Ref:1857506)

The only disgrace here is this thread. It was a great race - V8 supercars does not equal Craig Lowndes.

Pudlea · 4 Mar 2007, 00:25 (Ref:1857526)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RotorFan

The only disgrace here is this thread. It was a great race - V8 supercars does not equal Craig Lowndes.

Second that!

**GTRMagic** · 4 Mar 2007, 00:30 (Ref:1857532)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RotorFan

The only disgrace here is this thread. It was a great race - V8 supercars does not equal Craig Lowndes.

Perhaps we should watch 'Australia Story' tomorrow night...perhaps it will give an insight into the 'change' that has happened to Mr Lowndes in the last 6 months...

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